fishin wrote: parados wrote:
I did. The article doesn't say what OSM stated in the thread title.
Ah! I see... So your entire complaint here and the reason you posted the 2005 FBI UCR was because of the thread title? You purposely ignored the actual article so that you could just argue about a title??
It seems you purposely ignored my comments on the article.
You can't make the leap that more guns equals less crimes based on the article. It also makes it impossible to make the leap that more guns caused less gun crimes since there was more crime in total. More guns to prevent crime would have had to prevent crime if there was an actual connection between the two.
Fewer gun crimes can not be shown to be caused by more guns. There is no direct correlation.
As I said earlier, I don't know how the stats fall out for sure but the article very clearly identifies that it is talking about firearms related crimes and no, you can't make the leap from "more guns caused less gun crimes since there was more crime in total" because it's apples and oranges.
You also can't prove the claim that guns caused any crimes at all using your linked stats for the same reason.
I am not the one that drew conclusions. OSM and the author of the article did. "gun rights organizations contend that this bolsters their contention
that armed citizens deter criminals. " It doesn't prove anything one way or the other. It does prove one thing though. Some people believe you can claim actions in 2003 are a response to 2005 gun sales. Do you believe that fishin?
The only way to find the validity of the claims in the article is to find the stats they used and figure out if the stats are accurate and whether they've interpreted them correctly.
I have pointed that out. The stats have been misrepresented as being from 2005..
By the way, I can find no published report by the FBI on the number of gun crimes in 2005. The preliminary FBI report doesn't include it. (It is included in the final reports for other years.) I wonder where the author got his numbers from.
I did a quick Google search and the NSSF lists/links where they got their stats from in their press release:
I don't know if any of the Federal agencies have complete 2005 stats yet. It usually takes them at least a full year to compile them all.
So why did the author of the article state...
Gun crimes, suicides and firearms-related accidents declined last year at the same time that firearm and ammunition sales climbed,
That statement is factually incorrect. The nssf site states..
* Most recent year for which statistics have been compiled; may be 2005, 2004 or earlier
In reality the only number they may be using from 2005 is the treasury reciepts. I can find nothing related to 2005 and those reciepts.
From the 2004 ATF report on annual firearms.. approximately 3 million were manufactured.
The manufacturing reports show a slight decrease from year to year in the number of guns manufactured from 1998-2004.
The real interesting stat found in the Commerce in Firearms in the United States is that in 1993 - 8 millions guns were sold. In 2004 about 4.5 million were sold.