0
   

Do ugly people get punished more for crime?

 
 
snood
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 09:53 am
neologist wrote:
Leave it to snood to bring reason into the debate. :wink:



Ugh! Don't want to cloud the issue with facts, or anything.... Laughing
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OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 10:03 am
snood wrote:
xingu wrote:
Quote:
I heard about this guy who was very ugly so he married this beautiful woman (thinking it might help) but she was not very brainy... Their kids came out ugly and stupid


Rex
If I was fourteen and had a teacher like that I would not be looking for a wife.

I was watching the Bill Maher show and he was discussing this issue with a panel. The issue was bought up that an encounter like this would cause phycological damage to the victim.

I can't imagine myself having any phycological damage by having sex at fourteen.

Anyone have any opinion on this?


Lemme get what you're saying - Are you saying as long as the one having sex with a minor is a good looking babe, no harm, no foul? What about a Brad Pitt type male teacher seducing a fourteen year old girl - that a no-no?
Apples and bowling balls, my friend. The stigma is different, hence, so is the crime. Fired and probation not to re-offend seems appropriate to me.
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sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 10:10 am
(Gosh, just reading through and then BAM from O'Bill -- thanks! Made my day. :-D)
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OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 10:25 am
Just the facts, mam.
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RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 11:42 am
snood wrote:
xingu wrote:
Quote:
I heard about this guy who was very ugly so he married this beautiful woman (thinking it might help) but she was not very brainy... Their kids came out ugly and stupid


Rex
If I was fourteen and had a teacher like that I would not be looking for a wife.

I was watching the Bill Maher show and he was discussing this issue with a panel. The issue was bought up that an encounter like this would cause phycological damage to the victim.

I can't imagine myself having any phycological damage by having sex at fourteen.

Anyone have any opinion on this?


Lemme get what you're saying - Are you saying as long as the one having sex with a minor is a good looking babe, no harm, no foul? What about a Brad Pitt type male teacher seducing a fourteen year old girl - that a no-no?


Snood you seem to be getting to the reason why I posted this.

Society picks who is "beautiful" and those people are more free to live above the law...
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 11:43 am
The poll seems to show a lean toward beauty... Is this because of indoctrinated social fears?
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snood
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 11:58 am
O.B.:

Quote:
Apples and bowling balls, my friend. The stigma is different, hence, so is the crime. Fired and probation not to re-offend seems appropriate to me.


So happy the punishment met with your approval, but it isn't quite that cut and dried, or there wouldn't be the ongoing controversy. It "seems appropriate to you" and the "stigmas are different"?

I have some personal experience with this - and I want to tell you that a 30 year old woman messing around sexually with a 15 year old boy can f*ck that boy's head up. Stigmas? So, since the boys juvenile friends give him "atta boys", whereas the girls friends might label her "whore" or worse, that should define how unjust was the act of sexual predation itself?

I say that the main difference between sexual predation with a male or female perp is the level of brutality. There is by definition an intrusiveness and violation when a man does it to a girl. We, in all our enlightenment, try to pretend that since the man can't be physically "raped" in the same way, that the crime is different. It is still taking advantage of someone unable to make informed choices. It is a crime, no matter who does it.

To alter our societal response to this crime relative to how pretty the perp is, diminishes us all. Those of you trying to make that argument are trying to defend something that is morally indefensible.
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 12:45 pm
snood wrote:
O.B.:

Quote:
Apples and bowling balls, my friend. The stigma is different, hence, so is the crime. Fired and probation not to re-offend seems appropriate to me.


So happy the punishment met with your approval, but it isn't quite that cut and dried, or there wouldn't be the ongoing controversy. It "seems appropriate to you" and the "stigmas are different"?

I have some personal experience with this - and I want to tell you that a 30 year old woman messing around sexually with a 15 year old boy can f*ck that boy's head up. Stigmas? So, since the boys juvenile friends give him "atta boys", whereas the girls friends might label her "whore" or worse, that should define how unjust was the act of sexual predation itself?

I say that the main difference between sexual predation with a male or female perp is the level of brutality. There is by definition an intrusiveness and violation when a man does it to a girl. We, in all our enlightenment, try to pretend that since the man can't be physically "raped" in the same way, that the crime is different. It is still taking advantage of someone unable to make informed choices. It is a crime, no matter who does it.

To alter our societal response to this crime relative to how pretty the perp is, diminishes us all. Those of you trying to make that argument are trying to defend something that is morally indefensible.


Yea this!
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 12:53 pm
Nice post Snood...

I couldn't agree more...
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RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 01:01 pm
When sex sells then people become degraded as snood was saying. We are all degraded as a collective society for letting beauty beguile us into forgetting what is fair and just... Not only people directly involved but the people who stand by and let it happen...
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chr42690
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 01:34 pm
xingu wrote:
Damn, I wish I was a fourteen year old in her class.

All my female teachers were old, fat or beautiful challenged.


Really?
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snood
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 01:36 pm
chr42690 wrote:
xingu wrote:
Damn, I wish I was a fourteen year old in her class.

All my female teachers were old, fat or beautiful challenged.


Really?


Whoo, slow down, chr4 -
I get dizzy when you get all profound and complex like that!
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Montana
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 01:54 pm
I also agree with you, Snood.
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RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 02:03 pm
I had two contrasting female English teachers...

One of them was very pretty and the class was always chaotic. I cannot remember a single thing I learned there other than how tribal and unruly people can get when they cannot think..

Another female English teacher I had was older and not really attractive at all but she was stern... She had little sayings that she retorted back whenever you were snappy with her. She was a pillar of discipline.

I still remember my prepositions, form of the verb to be, conjunctions, and many English grammar rules, spelling etc... that she taught. I remember the books that she read to us in class. She had the students perform in musical productions... I think of her quite often and I think I owe a great part of my mind and character to her unwavering duty as a teacher.
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snood
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 02:09 pm
I have an interest in education. My undergrad degree is in education, and I am an instructor in the Army. My thinking about the ethics of teacher/student social relationships does not occur in a vacuum. The idea that we might punish differently depending on how someone looks or what their gender is, is just not something I can take quietly.
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RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 02:12 pm
When a classroom becomes a hierarchy of who is the most beautiful or the smartest instead of what the curriculum is then learning ceases...
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Montana
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 02:17 pm
Snood
This is unacceptable and no one should take it quietly!

I personally think our justice system needs an overhaul!
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RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 02:20 pm
It seems the law is now working on a sliding scale...
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Montana
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 02:22 pm
Rex
I can't argue with that.
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RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 02:37 pm
The question is, how can we build "mercy" into the law that is fair to all?
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