Lash wrote:I am completely out of step with the GOP. Possibly the reincarnation of Jerry Falwell would jazz them... Let me try to channel them...
Certainly Powell--where the hell has he been?
Yeah, about that? He's advising Obama.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1554812/Powell-ready-to-jump-on-Obama-bandwagon.html
Ouch
Cycloptichorn
I hadn't seen that, thanks Cycloptichorn.
That's stronger than what I'd seen before.
The Mendacity of Hype
Barack Obama and politics as usual, again.
By Geoffrey Norman
For realists ?- or cynics, if you prefer ?- there was finally some good news from the presidential campaign. No more worries about "a new politics" and "change" which, if they had been for real, would have required one to take the campaign seriously and pay attention to this season's political star, Barack Obama. Turns out, it was a sham.
Normally, realists have a fairly easy time of it when it comes to presidential politics. Without knowing who the candidates are or what they are saying, one can confidently assert, "They are all the same," and "The way you can tell that they're lying is that their lips are moving." You don't have to do any deep research or hard digging to back up these assertions in any given political season.
When George H. W. Bush promised "no new taxes," that pretty much sealed it: taxes would be going up. When LBJ promised no American boys would be sent to fight wars that Asian boys should be fighting, smart money said that the Marines would soon be landing. In fact, most of our big-time war presidents came off campaigns in which they had promised to keep us out of war.
The point, here, is not to demonstrate that our politicians frequently break their promises. This is not breathtaking news. Neither is the tendency of political candidates to straddle issues. "I was for [whatever] before I was against it." This is routine stuff and one doesn't have to be especially hard-bitten to recognize it for what it is.
But we all hope for something else, we all have a sequestered place in our hearts longing for "a new kind of politics." And when we hear whispers of it, we want to buy in. Barack Obama had a lot of us going for a while. He was "post-racial." He was all about "hope" and "audacity." He was for "change." And this time, he promised, we really could achieve it. "Yes we can."
Well, it appears that it is time to say, "Be still my heart," and move on to other things. Obama told us his campaign wasn't going to be about the money ?- after all, that was politics as usual. He was going to "aggressively pursue an agreement with the Republican nominee to preserve a publicly financed general election." Later, he expanded on that to say, "I will sit down with John McCain and make sure that we have a system that works for everybody."
Well, McCain is still waiting for that sit-down. Turns out, Obama is all about the money. Now that he can raise more on his own than the government could have offered him ?- and probably more than McCain can raise ?- Obama has changed his mind (assuming it was ever made up), and is hoping the voters will not hold it against him.
Politics, man ?- you do what you gotta do.
You run against NAFTA in the Ohio primary, calling the bill "devastating" and "a big mistake." That's where the votes are . . . or were. Now that he is looking beyond the mid-west, he's all about free trade. Yeah, well, the rhetoric may have gotten a little "overheated" back there in Ohio, he says passively, but he's certainly no protectionist. Perish the thought.
Then, there is the post-racial stuff. That little sequestered place in our hearts quivered with the hope that with this candidate, in this election, we might move beyond identity politics. And Obama said as much, himself, when he was asked on 60 Minutes if his race was going to be a handicap in the election.
"No . . . " he said. "If I don't win this race it will be because of other factors . . . [because] I have not shown to the American people a vision for where the country needs to go that they can embrace." Apparently, the American people are more stupid now than they were when he spoke those words. And his enemies will inevitably try to exploit that stupidity.
"We know what kind of campaign they're going to run," Obama said in a recent speech. "They're going to try to make you afraid. . . . They're going to try to make you afraid of me. ?'He's young and inexperienced and he's got a funny name. And did I mention he's black?' "
Well, you go with what works. When an aide once asked Huey Long how he was going to explain to a group of important constituents why the "Kingfish" had gone back on a campaign promise, Long said, simply, "F*** 'em. Tell 'em I lied."
This probably wouldn't work for Obama. But maybe his apologists ?- those people who still believe in change, hope, and a new kind of politics ?- could try out a variation on Huey's classic. How about, "F*** 'em. Tell 'em I was being audacious."
?- Geoffrey Norman is editor of vermonttiger.com.
Finn, It's not his "change" message that I'm impressed with. It's about his ability to "work" within the political system for his advantage whether its about domestic issues or dealing with foreign countries. He's sharp enough to understand what works and what doesn't work; that is mighty powerful in the world of politics.
Forget "change;" it sells enough donuts even though all of 'em have holes in them. What matters is his ability to sell those donuts.
That story has a date that is a year old, cyclops, according to my computer screen.
okie wrote:
That story has a date that is a year old, cyclops, according to my computer screen.
Does anyone have anything to illustrate a change in the last year? Did Obama get advice from Powell or not?
The story being a year old doesn't mean anything by itself.
K
O
Roxxxanne wrote:Before Obama became the presumptive nominee, geogeob1 and others crowed about how well McCain was doing in the national polls. I pointed out that the polls were more or less irrelevant until Obama was the nominee and it became a fari fight, one against one. And that I expected that Obama would surge to as much as a 15 point lead weeks after he became the presumptive nominee.
Voila! The latest Newsweek poll shows Obama with a 15 point lead.
When it comes to Obama, Newsweek reminds me of my daughter's Yellow Lab bitch. In the presence of her "pack leader," she either pees on the floor or lays on her back.
cicerone imposter wrote:Finn, It's not his "change" message that I'm impressed with. It's about his ability to "work" within the political system for his advantage whether its about domestic issues or dealing with foreign countries. He's sharp enough to understand what works and what doesn't work; that is mighty powerful in the world of politics.
Forget "change;" it sells enough donuts even though all of 'em have holes in them. What matters is his ability to sell those donuts.
Am I to take this seriously?
Finn dAbuzz wrote:Roxxxanne wrote:Before Obama became the presumptive nominee, geogeob1 and others crowed about how well McCain was doing in the national polls. I pointed out that the polls were more or less irrelevant until Obama was the nominee and it became a fari fight, one against one. And that I expected that Obama would surge to as much as a 15 point lead weeks after he became the presumptive nominee.
Voila! The latest Newsweek poll shows Obama with a 15 point lead.
When it comes to Obama, Newsweek reminds me of my daughter's Yellow Lab bitch. In the presence of her "pack leader," she either pees on the floor or lays on her back.
Do you see any media giving inordinate deference to McCain?
Finn dAbuzz wrote:cicerone imposter wrote:Finn, It's not his "change" message that I'm impressed with. It's about his ability to "work" within the political system for his advantage whether its about domestic issues or dealing with foreign countries. He's sharp enough to understand what works and what doesn't work; that is mighty powerful in the world of politics.
Forget "change;" it sells enough donuts even though all of 'em have holes in them. What matters is his ability to sell those donuts.
Am I to take this seriously?
Take it any way you wish; it's only an opinion that can "change."
Roxxxanne wrote:
Voila! The latest Newsweek poll shows Obama with a 15 point lead.
If yall hang out at all on Nimh's "Polls, charts and pretty graphs" thread, or whatever it is called, you would be suspicious of the Newsweek poll.
It is an "outlier," meaning it, for some reason, is out of step with other polls which have Obama up by, perhaps, 6% in the popular vote.
snood wrote:Finn dAbuzz wrote:Roxxxanne wrote:Before Obama became the presumptive nominee, geogeob1 and others crowed about how well McCain was doing in the national polls. I pointed out that the polls were more or less irrelevant until Obama was the nominee and it became a fari fight, one against one. And that I expected that Obama would surge to as much as a 15 point lead weeks after he became the presumptive nominee.
Voila! The latest Newsweek poll shows Obama with a 15 point lead.
When it comes to Obama, Newsweek reminds me of my daughter's Yellow Lab bitch. In the presence of her "pack leader," she either pees on the floor or lays on her back.
Do you see any media giving inordinate deference to McCain?
Not to the degree of Newsweeks fawing over Obama.
Conservative outlets like The National Review and FOX have a share of McCain cheerleaders, but they also have no shortage of critics.
There is an article on today's Nation (or maybe New Republic) Online, that castigates in quite insulting terms, Scott Simon of NPR for criticizing Obama for his reversal on public funding and his not so veiled suggestion that Mcain and Republicans are racists. ("Oh and by the way, he's black.")
Do you?
Yeah, Finn. The free ride McCain's gotten has been pretty widely documented. do you think it was all in jest when he called the media "my base"?
hawkeye10 wrote:Quote:Op-Ed Columnist
The Two Obamas
By DAVID BROOKS
Published: June 20, 2008
God, Republicans are saps. They think that they're running against some academic liberal who wouldn't wear flag pins on his lapel, whose wife isn't proud of America and who went to some liberationist church where the pastor damned his own country. They think they're running against some naïve university-town dreamer, the second coming of Adlai Stevenson.
But as recent weeks have made clear, Barack Obama is the most split-personality politician in the country today. On the one hand, there is Dr. Barack, the high-minded, Niebuhr-quoting speechifier who spent this past winter thrilling the Scarlett Johansson set and feeling the fierce urgency of now. But then on the other side, there's Fast Eddie Obama, the promise-breaking, tough-minded Chicago pol who'd throw you under the truck for votes.
This guy is the whole Chicago package: an idealistic, lakefront liberal fronting a sharp-elbowed machine operator. He's the only politician of our lifetime who is underestimated because he's too intelligent. He speaks so calmly and polysyllabically that people fail to appreciate the Machiavellian ambition inside.
But he's been giving us an education, for anybody who cares to pay attention. Just try to imagine Mister Rogers playing the agent Ari in "Entourage" and it all falls into place.
Back when he was in the Illinois State Senate, Dr. Barack could have taken positions on politically uncomfortable issues. But Fast Eddie Obama voted "present" nearly 130 times. From time to time, he threw his voting power under the truck.
Dr. Barack said he could no more disown the Rev. Jeremiah Wright than disown his own grandmother. Then the political costs of Rev. Wright escalated and Fast Eddie Obama threw Wright under the truck.
Dr. Barack could have been a workhorse senator. But primary candidates don't do tough votes, so Fast Eddie Obama threw the workhorse duties under the truck.
Dr. Barack could have changed the way presidential campaigning works. John McCain offered to have a series of extended town-hall meetings around the country. But favored candidates don't go in for unscripted free-range conversations. Fast Eddie Obama threw the new-politics mantra under the truck.
And then on Thursday, Fast Eddie Obama had his finest hour. Barack Obama has worked on political reform more than any other issue. He aspires to be to political reform what Bono is to fighting disease in Africa. He's spent much of his career talking about how much he believes in public financing. In January 2007, he told Larry King that the public-financing system works. In February 2007, he challenged Republicans to limit their spending and vowed to do so along with them if he were the nominee. In February 2008, he said he would aggressively pursue spending limits. He answered a Midwest Democracy Network questionnaire by reminding everyone that he has been a longtime advocate of the public-financing system.
But Thursday, at the first breath of political inconvenience, Fast Eddie Obama threw public financing under the truck. In so doing, he probably dealt a death-blow to the cause of campaign-finance reform. And the only thing that changed between Thursday and when he lauded the system is that Obama's got more money now.
And Fast Eddie Obama didn't just sell out the primary cause of his life. He did it with style. He did it with a video so risibly insincere that somewhere down in the shadow world, Lee Atwater is gaping and applauding. Obama blamed the (so far marginal) Republican 527s. He claimed that private donations are really public financing. He made a cut-throat political calculation seem like Mother Teresa's final steps to sainthood.
The media and the activists won't care (they were only interested in campaign-finance reform only when the Republicans had more money). Meanwhile, Obama's money is forever. He's got an army of small donors and a phalanx of big money bundlers, including, according to The Washington Post, Kenneth Griffin of the Citadel Investment Group; Kirk Wager, a Florida trial lawyer; James Crown, a director of General Dynamics; and Neil Bluhm, a hotel, office and casino developer.
I have to admit, I'm ambivalent watching all this. On the one hand, Obama did sell out the primary cause of his professional life, all for a tiny political advantage. If he'll sell that out, what won't he sell out? On the other hand, global affairs ain't beanbag. If we're going to have a president who is going to go toe to toe with the likes of Vladimir Putin, maybe it is better that he should have a ruthlessly opportunist Fast Eddie Obama lurking inside.
All I know for sure is that this guy is no liberal goo-goo. Republicans keep calling him naïve. But naïve is the last word I'd use to describe Barack Obama. He's the most effectively political creature we've seen in decades. Even Bill Clinton wasn't smart enough to succeed in politics by pretending to renounce politics.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/20/opinion/20brooks.html?hp
Brooks is not the only one who is convinced that Obama is a slick old school killer......I'm hoping that these guys are right about him
David Brooks is full of you know what and number 2, Obama refuses to play their little sordid game! They're ALL full of "schitt"!
snood wrote:Yeah, Finn. The free ride McCain's gotten has been pretty widely documented. do you think it was all in jest when he called the media "my base"?
During this presidential campaign?
Which outlet in particular or do you suggest -"All of them!"
Considering that the Obama supporters contend their guy is oh so different than old political hacks like John McCain, it would seem that anything (including a free pass from the Media) that draws a comparison between them is bad news for Obama.
teenyboone wrote:
David Brooks is full of you know what and number 2, Obama refuses to play their little sordid game! They're ALL full of "schitt"!
Well that certainly put Mr Books in his place! I bet he doesn't dare show his face in public again.
Finn dAbuzz wrote:Considering that the Obama supporters contend their guy is oh so different than old political hacks like John McCain, it would seem that anything (including a free pass from the Media) that draws a comparison between them is bad news for Obama.
I think you mean that Obama detractors contend that Obama supporters contend their guy is oh so different than old political hacks like John McCain. There may be a post somewhere out of the 18,000 on the Obama thread by someone claiming he is "different", but most supporters just talk about how they like his policies and his vision. But you can find a dozen threads where Obama detractors (there don't seem to be actual McCain supporters) talk about how Obama supporters are into hero worship. Evidence on A2K is scant for that opinion.
I've noticed that you're a feisty little devil.
