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Dubai Ports: Shame on the Democrats!

 
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 01:25 pm
Thanks for the article Walter. I'd say Chertoff's take is spot on. I've had surprisingly little trouble convincing most of the people I've discussed this with that the Deal was good for America. I suppose it's because most of their opposition was the knee-jerk-didn't-know-any-better variety. Pity, neither Bush nor any of his people attempted to sell it on the National Level. The lion's share of the blame still rests with those politicians who played on ignorance and bigotry for political gain; but I think this is one of those cases where Bush's lack of diplomatic ability really hurt the country. I could easily see where a Bill Clinton type speaker could have sold this and punished rather than rewarded the unscrupulous promoters of ignorance and bigotry. I see this as a sorry reflection of American politics, across the board.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 02:42 pm
OB, Good post. The who and how matters a great deal, and most politicans fail in those realm.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 02:47 pm
Quote:
suppose it's because most of their opposition was the knee-jerk-didn't-know-any-better variety.


I saw Jon Stewart on Larry King a few weeks ago, and he had this to say:

Quote:
STEWART: So, I'm not exactly sure what that -- I know that it sounds bad. I know that if, you know, in America today it's as though somebody has stoked fear in this country. I don't know who that might have been but it appears that the country is poised to react, let's say reflexively with a certain xenophobic zeal.

KING: But when you stoke fear why then would you have the people you are saying to be fearful of run your ports?

STEWART: Because you forgot you had stoked the fear. I'm not so sure they're paying much attention to the speeches they gave three weeks ago. "We're at war." Then three weeks later. "I don't understand. What's wrong with the port deal?" You know it's as though when you're at war, you know, he put us on war footing. You remember that. And then he seemed absolutely shocked that anyone would complain that perhaps our ports might be run from foreign nationals, although apparently most of them are.


Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 02:53 pm
No-one complained before that the US-ports were run by "foreign nationals" (P&O) or that foreign nationals gave security and help to US military forces (Dubai Port Word).

I still don't get that.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 03:02 pm
Walter, It's because the democrat's talking heads were too ignorant to know what harm they would do.

Bush's primary rhetoric about "fear" have been successful; he failed to educate the congress and the American People before presenting his plan.

In essence, they all failed; both republicans and democrats. It only shows how split politically this country now stands.
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 07:51 pm
It appears Jon Stewart is far more ignorant than Bush. No surprise, that. At least Bush can tell friend from foe instead of lumping every Mid-East country into the same pile. Stewart's commentary exemplifies the ignorance of the American public.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Mar, 2006 09:22 pm
Something funny happened on our way to Dubai.


WASHINGTON -- In the aftermath of the Dubai ports dispute, the Bush administration is hiring a Hong Kong conglomerate to help detect nuclear materials inside cargo passing through the Bahamas to the United States and elsewhere.


The administration acknowledges the no-bid contract with Hutchison Whampoa Ltd. represents the first time a foreign company will be involved in running a sophisticated U.S. radiation detector at an overseas port without American customs agents present.


Freeport in the Bahamas is 65 miles from the U.S. coast, where cargo would be likely to be inspected again. The contract is currently being finalized.


The administration is negotiating a second no-bid contract for a Philippine company to install radiation detectors in its home country, according to documents obtained by The Associated Press. At dozens of other overseas ports, foreign governments are primarily responsible for scanning cargo.


While President Bush recently reassured Congress that foreigners would not manage security at U.S. ports, the Hutchison deal in the Bahamas illustrates how the administration is relying on foreign companies at overseas ports to safeguard cargo headed to the United States.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 02:57 am
OCCOM BILL wrote:
Thanks for the article Walter. I'd say Chertoff's take is spot on. I've had surprisingly little trouble convincing most of the people I've discussed this with that the Deal was good for America. I suppose it's because most of their opposition was the knee-jerk-didn't-know-any-better variety. Pity, neither Bush nor any of his people attempted to sell it on the National Level. The lion's share of the blame still rests with those politicians who played on ignorance and bigotry for political gain; but I think this is one of those cases where Bush's lack of diplomatic ability really hurt the country. I could easily see where a Bill Clinton type speaker could have sold this and punished rather than rewarded the unscrupulous promoters of ignorance and bigotry. I see this as a sorry reflection of American politics, across the board.


It is depressing how easily national statesmen can fall into base behaviors because of political expediencies. In this affair, the Republicans are only marginally better than the Democrats.

What this issue forces us to consider (if we have not done so already) is the question of whether principle trumps self-interest in the realm of politics.

The answer, sadly, is OF COURSE IT DOES NOT!

A small fraction of our representatives may vote in accordance with their intellect and their conscience, but, in the main, they vote based on how they might benefit from a particular vote.

Now the reality is that self-interest rather than conscience drives societal movement. Yes altruism pops its shining head up from time to time, and, generally, we can expect the most from humanity when times are worse, but in the day to day advance of the world's events, bet on positions that favor someone personally.

The Dubai ports deal is a perfect example.

Notwithstanding the fact that their opposition smacked of xenophobia and racism (two of the greatest [according to Liberals] sins to visit mankind), Democrats committed themselves to the course and dissembling argument of "How can we sell our ports to the Arabs! One or two of the 9/11 terrorists came from the UAE and so that is proof positive that the UAE can't be trusted!"

Unfortunately we can never rely upon consistency of argument in American politics.

If we could, we could infer from the the arguments of Chuckie Schummer and his ilk that the actions of several, speak for the intent of millions. Thus since we had quite a few people in favor of invading Iraq, Chuckie should shut up about it as this approval (regardless of whether or not it was of the few) spoke for all Americans.

But then wait, perhaps Chuckie's argument is not so illogical within his reality and that of his party.

A minority of people object to a given governmental action, and Chuckie and his fellow Libs are lightening quick to assert that these few speak for everyone. Thus, it makes sense in the Wonderland world of the Left that if one Arab from Dubai rode a plane that crashed into the World Trade Center, all Arabs from Dubai are untrustworthy.

Of course what we are dealing with is not the seemingly utter stupidity of the arguments being made, but the gross cupidity of Democrats for a return to power.

That self-interest in a positive force in the world is not toxic to conservatives, but it surely is to liberals, and yet we are confronted, on a daily basis, with the advancement of the self-interest of Liberals.

What is so nauseating about issues like these is the way that would be ideologues so quickly part ways with the ideology they are accused of promoting for the benefit of their personal interests.

In another thread I may explain why in this field of dreck the Republicans are marginally better that the Democrats, but for now, a plague on both their houses!
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 03:13 am
Finn d'Abuzz wrote:
In another thread I may explain why in this field of dreck the Republicans are marginally better that the Democrats, but for now, a plague on both their houses!
Be sure and link it because this I'd be curious to see, being as I currently disagree. Democrats can pretty much be depended upon to oppose Bush, whether he's right or wrong, if there is any foreseeable political gain to be had. But when the Republicans reached for the bigotry card for political gain in this instance, they abandoned their own President and weakened the cause they supposedly mutually support. This, IMO, is the greater wrong.
0 Replies
 
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 10:32 am
OCCOM BILL wrote:
But when the Republicans reached for the bigotry card for political gain in this instance, they abandoned their own President and weakened the cause they supposedly mutually support..

As opposed to all the other times when the GOP played the bigotry card in support of the administration?
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 10:33 am
Walter Hinteler wrote:
No-one complained before that the US-ports were run by "foreign nationals" (P&O) or that foreign nationals gave security and help to US military forces (Dubai Port Word).

I still don't get that.

The US is a media driven country. No one knows what's going on until the media reports it usually by hyping how horrible something is.

A couple of years ago a local station spent a week hyping their story about how people that have been convicted of sexual crimes are driving school buses. The spent a week saying.. "Are your children safe?" in their ads. It turns out they found one bus driver had managed to lie about his criminal past, was found out, no longer was driving and no evidence they even approached a child. Meanwhile they had stoked the fears of parents everywhere and tarred a lot of bus drivers as potential threats. There were letters to the editor, calls for tougher legislation, people were personally driving their kids to school and all because some TV station wanted to increase its ratings.

If we don't know about it, we don't worry about it. If the TV doesn't tell us about it, we don't know about it. (Boy, I just indicted myself with every other American.)
0 Replies
 
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 10:35 am
Cycloptichorn wrote:
I saw Jon Stewart on Larry King a few weeks ago, and he had this to say:

Quote:
STEWART: So, I'm not exactly sure what that -- I know that it sounds bad. I know that if, you know, in America today it's as though somebody has stoked fear in this country. I don't know who that might have been but it appears that the country is poised to react, let's say reflexively with a certain xenophobic zeal.

KING: But when you stoke fear why then would you have the people you are saying to be fearful of run your ports?

STEWART: Because you forgot you had stoked the fear. I'm not so sure they're paying much attention to the speeches they gave three weeks ago. "We're at war." Then three weeks later. "I don't understand. What's wrong with the port deal?" You know it's as though when you're at war, you know, he put us on war footing. You remember that. And then he seemed absolutely shocked that anyone would complain that perhaps our ports might be run from foreign nationals, although apparently most of them are.

Stewart is absolutely right.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 10:38 am
OCCOM BILL wrote:
The lion's share of the blame still rests with those politicians who played on ignorance and bigotry for political gain;


Just to see if we are on the same page Bill.. what would you call the logic in that statement of yours? :wink:
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Mar, 2006 11:28 am
Good question, parados. Wink
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 Mar, 2006 12:06 am
parados wrote:
OCCOM BILL wrote:
The lion's share of the blame still rests with those politicians who played on ignorance and bigotry for political gain;


Just to see if we are on the same page Bill.. what would you call the logic in that statement of yours? :wink:
Confused That's not even the whole sentence, let alone the whole point. What's your game?

And what prey tell do you like about his questioning a fragmented sentence C.I.? Did I miss something?
0 Replies
 
Roxxxanne
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 Mar, 2006 12:12 am
OCCOM BILL wrote:
parados wrote:
OCCOM BILL wrote:
The lion's share of the blame still rests with those politicians who played on ignorance and bigotry for political gain;


Just to see if we are on the same page Bill.. what would you call the logic in that statement of yours? :wink:
Confused That's not even the whole sentence, let alone the whole point. What's your game?

And what prey tell do you like about his questioning a fragmented sentence C.I.? Did I miss something?


Yeah when the Creator was handing out brains, you thought he said trains and you caught one to the coast. Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 Mar, 2006 12:16 am
Roxxxanne wrote:
OCCOM BILL wrote:
parados wrote:
OCCOM BILL wrote:
The lion's share of the blame still rests with those politicians who played on ignorance and bigotry for political gain;


Just to see if we are on the same page Bill.. what would you call the logic in that statement of yours? :wink:
Confused That's not even the whole sentence, let alone the whole point. What's your game?

And what prey tell do you like about his questioning a fragmented sentence C.I.? Did I miss something?


Yeah when the Creator was handing out brains, you thought he said trains and you caught one to the coast. Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile
I see your debating skills have improved tremendously since we last spoke. Good for you!
0 Replies
 
Roxxxanne
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 Mar, 2006 12:22 am
I am not here to debate especially with fenceposts and anyone with the comprehension skills of a gnat would already know that.
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 Mar, 2006 12:30 am
Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 Mar, 2006 09:01 pm
Quote:
Any complaints about boogeymen and racist reactions to muslims point to the people that have used those arguments for the last 4 years.


Quote:
The lion's share of the blame still rests with those politicians who played on ignorance and bigotry for political gain;


I'm just curious what you think is the difference in logic between these two statements Bill. Care to explain why you think one is OK and the other isn't based solely on the statements themselves.
0 Replies
 
 

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