Passage ...... Where do you go after you die

death
Booman, yeah in addition to the logical impossibility of knowing death is the empirical reality that--notwithstanding Shirley McClain's teachings--no matter how hard I try I cannot experience pre-birth. For eons (or more) I neither existed nor non-existed, in the profound sense that there was no "I" to exist or not exist. I do feel, however, that this applies only to ego. I believe--and this is a purely religious assumption--that my real self has no beginning or end. I am the Cosmos (so are you, of course). My present form is a mere gesture of the Cosmos, like the hand forming a fist and then opening. I've always been both the hand and the fist, with the hand having ontological priority.

For those agnostics, atheists, and the religious, who think we are god, always existed, and never existed. Spritual thought and feelings are not limited to the christian religion. All human thought about gods and spiritual experience are all the same, and not the same. It's a natural phenomenon with humans, and probably with some animals too. People who feel the spirit of their christian god is no different than the shaman that prays to his god. It's part and parcel of most human experience. Some believe and some don't; but most people who believe in god or a higher power are just following their cultural beliefs and teachings. I call it "an accident of birth." If your parent believes in a christian god, you probably also believe in the christian god. There is no favoritism nor natural selection in those beliefs. c.i.

...From my studies of most major religions and philosophies, I saw the same basic truths inall of them
... As for parental influences, my parents raised me as a baptist, but thank God, they always emphathized thinking for myself.

death
C.I., where've you been, traveling again?
Booman, have you read Aldous Huxley's The Perennial Philosophy. It examines mystically oriented religions and mystics throughout the ages and a wide range of cultures to demonstrate that there is a fundamental mystical insight experienced by people throughout the world and ages. It seems to emerge autonomously, often without diffusion from prior ages and different cultures. It seems to be inherent as a potential of mature humans.

This thread ROCKS! (just had to say it) :-D

Almost everybody it seems believes in death. What strengthens, sustains and fortifies this belief is identification with that which appears to die, or at least that which is transient, i.e. the body and brain.

I think having faith in death is a form of self ignorance, a kind of symptom of forgetting.

death
Twyvel, I sometimes think that people who believe in death really believe in a kind of immortality. I don't mean the belief in an afterlife of a soul, which begins with death--that too--but in a notion that there will be a continuing self of sorts that will exist in a state of oblivion. That's called "being" dead.
I think we've discussed this in one form or another elsewhere.

JL,
...No I haven't read it, but he seems to be in tune with me. (Oops, did I get arrogant? )

...AMEN CODEBERG!...

Hi JLN, Just returned from 17 days in Peru and Ecuador. Machu Picchu, Cuzco, and the Galapagos Islands are magical places all. Will offer a short commentary in a few days in the Travel Forum. c.i.

death
Booman, no arrogance at all. I do think that the perennial philosophy is manifest quite clearly in the comments of many of us in this and the thread about the nature of reality.
Yes, it rocks, Codeborg, and it's partly your fault.

Here's a thought; People who are into freezing the body for later ressurection, would have to definately, not believe in heaven/hell, or reincarnation, right?

betel leaf
C.I., Glad you're back safe. I'll look forward to your commentary. I've never checked out the travel thread. Now I will. Did you drink cocoa tea (or betel?) for the altitude?

Not that I'm an expert in this sort of thing,,, ....but isn't it coca tea for altitude? (Seems to fit, huh? )

coca
Yeah, coca. Thanks.
It seems to me that people who freeze themselves hoping to be thawed out in the distant future do not fear being--if all works out as planned--extremely backward. They'll look to the future like homo erectus looks to us. In any case, I suspect they'll live miserable lives trying to play cultural catch-up.

Nor do they seem to consider that they'l again have to face the prospect of death, they're so afraid of. Whoo boy!

Ahhh...ci, I think agnostics should not have been included in that thought.

JLN, Yes, plenty of coca tea and Diamox to overcome altitude sickness. None in our group of 11 suffered from altitude sickness, but most of us could not sleep well.
Frank, All of us, including agnostics, have experienced some form of otherworldly, ethereal, and/or metaphysical response to daily life or dream world.........which many interpret as a spiritual reality.

c.i.

Okay Cc.I.,
...You just struck a nerve. I don't believe, I've ever shared this before. When I was about ten years old, I had a tooth pulled. I got gassed. As I was going under, I had feelings of, "This is it! This is the true exsistence. I haven't been here since birth!" I was more sure of this than any feeling I've ever had in my life. And I have since had many epihanies.

truth
Booman, this reminds me of Nietzsche's famous epiphany: his realization of the Eternal Recurrence.

JL,
...I used to regret that I had dropped out of school, and failed to read so many of the great philosphers, most of you scholars, are so familiar with. For instance, only in my 20's, and 30's, did I start going to the library, and briefly skim, Aristotle, Plato, Arfrican Religions, Oriental religions, Islam, astrology, numerology,etc.,etc.
...However, skimming those schools of thought, and hearing confirmations from people like you and others in this forum, and elsewhere, I find a same basics truth, confirming thoughts I had, as far back as childhood. All this reaffirms my long held belief that anyone that realizes it, has a direct line to the truth. All holy books, ministers, and philosophers, only supply hearsay.
...And this makes me glad I established direct contact before I started reading about it. That lends more credence to my thoughts, and personal beliefs. I know I was not influenced by other thinkers. And I hope others can find assurance from me, because I have known a few geniuses, and brainiacs, in my time, and I AM DEFINATELY NOT ONE! Plus modesty is not in my make up, I'm an entertainer for Chrissakes! What I'm trying to say is everyone has access, if you just realize it.

...And that's my worth...........Grasshopper.