ACTING IN GOOD FAITH

Main Entry: 1faith
Pronunciation: 'fAth
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural faiths /'fAths, sometimes 'fA[th]z/
Etymology: Middle English feith, from Old French feid, foi, from Latin fides; akin to Latin fidere to trust -- more at BIDE
1 a : allegiance to duty or a person : LOYALTY b (1) : fidelity to one's promises (2) : sincerity of intentions
2 a (1) : belief and trust in and loyalty to God (2) : belief in the traditional doctrines of a religion b (1) : firm belief in something for which there is no proof (2) : complete trust3 : something that is believed especially with strong conviction; especially : a system of religious beliefs

Main Entry: su·per·sti·tion
Pronunciation: "sü-p&r-'sti-sh&n
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English supersticion, from Middle French, from Latin superstition-, superstitio, from superstit-, superstes standing over (as witness or survivor), from super- + stare to stand -- more at STAND
1 a : a belief or practice resulting from ignorance, fear of the unknown, trust in magic or chance, or a false conception of causation b : an irrational abject attitude of mind toward the supernatural, nature, or God resulting from superstition2 : a notion maintained despite evidence to the contrary

I think it's pretty clear in how they are defined. Wouldn't you say?

Faith is based out of trust. Superstition is based out of fear.

Also let me point out that faith is: firm belief in something for which there is no proof

While superstition is: a notion maintained despite evidence to the contrary

0 Replies

hephzibah ,
Ok, if that is the distinction you want to use, that is fine by me. Let's move on then.
1 - how is one more rational than the other?
2 - You have eliminated most common 'superstitions' from being superstitions, you have elevated any belief not based on fear to the same level as belief in god.
With the playing feild level, what distinguishes faith in god from faith in lucky rabbits feet?

0 Replies

Quote:

Also let me point out that faith is: firm belief in something for which there is no proof

While superstition is: a notion maintained despite evidence to the contrary

Missed this little edit....
You , with this, have just plummeted belief in biblical religion to the level of superstition, by your own standard. There is plenty of evidence that contradicts writings from the bible.

0 Replies

You igonre the use of the key word "or" in your definition of superstition. I had also asked that people provide a link the to the definitions they use so that others may inspect them to see if anything were changed or left out. When i provided the initial definitions in this thread, i provided the complete entries and links to those definitions for exactly that purpose. The lack of any reference to rationality, either the presence or the absence of such reference, in the definition provided above makes it suspect.

So no, i wouldn't say anything is yet clear, except that you are willing to attempt to manipulate definitions in order to make a weak point. You ignore the importance of fear in organized religion, as well.

Eppie in the toal hole . . . --Silas Marner would send you to your time-out place for such poor work.

0 Replies

Heh..I just let him have that one because it left him in worse position than if I hadn't Razz

0 Replies

I think that's a she . . . Hephzibah was the wife of Hezekiah and the mother of Manasseh (II Kings 21:1) . . . and the name of the foundling in Silas Marner . . .

0 Replies

Doktor S wrote:

hephzibah ,
1 - how is one more rational than the other?

I never said one was more rational than the other. To someone who does not believe in God my faith in God would seem irrational. If someone told me the couch in their livingroom was their god, I would think their faith in that was irrational. It's all a matter of oppinion.

Quote:

You have eliminated most common 'superstitions' from being superstitions, you have elevated any belief not based on fear to the same level as belief in god.

Sure. Why not? Just because someone believes something doesn't mean it is or isn't true. I don't have to agree with it, neither do you. Whether you choose to believe there is a God or not doesn't effect whether or not God really exists.

Quote:

With the playing feild level, what distinguishes faith in god from faith in lucky rabbits feet?

There is no distinction between the two faiths. I can choose to believe that a rabbit's foot will bring me good luck. That doesn't necessarily mean it will though. It becomes superstition when I move to the level of fear where I won't leave the house without it because if I do I might get struck by lightening, hit by a bus, and so on.

0 Replies

Link to superstition:

http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/superstition

Link to faith:

http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/faith

0 Replies

hephzibah--

I dare you to ask God to strike you down.

0 Replies

Setanta wrote:

I think that's a she . . . Hephzibah was the wife of Hezekiah and the mother of Manasseh (II Kings 21:1) . . . and the name of the foundling in Silas Marner . . .

This is true, but that's not where my name came from. It actually came from another scripture. Smile

0 Replies

You've linked the definition of superstition twice . . .

0 Replies

echi wrote:

hephzibah--

I dare you to ask God to strike you down.

Echi, I have. More than once. Smile

0 Replies

Setanta wrote:

You've linked the definition of superstition twice . . .

I fixed it.

0 Replies

It just ocured to me, and how this escaped me before is anyones guess...
How is a belief in god, at least on some level, not fear based?
Is anyone that fears god superstitious and not truely faithful?

0 Replies

Why?

0 Replies

Doktor S wrote:

Quote:

You , with this, have just plummeted belief in biblical religion to the level of superstition, by your own standard. There is plenty of evidence that contradicts writings from the bible.

By your standard and oppinion I'm sure there is. However, how can this be disputed when by my standard and oppinion there is plenty of evidence that support the writings of the bible?

0 Replies

Doktor S wrote:

. . .They both require 'faith in magic or chance' as per the definition of superstition.
They both are irational beliefs arising from ignorance, as per the definition of superstition. I say ignorance because to 'know' something requires a valid form of epistomology, and faith does not meet that standard by any definition.
They both require belief without evidence, as per the definition of faith.
They both imply a confidence in an idea, as per the definition of faith.

Now, what have you to illustrate they are in fact. separate and distinct?

The words 'magic', 'chance' and 'ignorance' do not appear in the definition of faith.

More coming.

0 Replies

Eppie, you willfully ignore two salient points here:

First, that the definition of faith which you provided includes this line: firm belief in something for which there is no proof.

Second, that if a body of scripture is the word of an omniscient god, then it were inerrant. Therefore, one can start shooting it down right and left. How do you account for two conflicting genealogies in the "new testament?" Were your scriptural canon the inerrant word of god, there would be no such contradictions.

0 Replies

Doktor S wrote:

It just ocured to me, and how this escaped me before is anyones guess...
How is a belief in god, at least on some level, not fear based?
Is anyone that fears god superstitious and not truely faithful?

There are different kinds of fear:

Main Entry: 1fear
Pronunciation: 'fir
transitive senses
1 archaic : FRIGHTEN
2 archaic : to feel fear in (oneself)
3 : to have a reverential awe of <fear God>
4 : to be afraid of : expect with alarm
intransitive senses : to be afraid or apprehensive
- fear·er noun

http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/fear

So who decides which fear applies to what then?

0 Replies

Setanta wrote:

Eppie, you willfully ignore two salient points here:

First, that the definition of faith which you provided includes this line: firm belief in something for which there is no proof.

Second, that if a body of scripture is the word of an omniscient god, then it were inerrant. Therefore, one can start shooting it down right and left. How do you account for two conflicting genealogies in the "new testament?" Were your scriptural canon the inerrant word of god, there would be no such contradictions.

what "or" are you refering to? I only saw two and I fail to see how that's relevant:

Main Entry: su·per·sti·tion
Pronunciation: "sü-p&r-'sti-sh&n
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English supersticion, from Middle French, from Latin superstition-, superstitio, from superstit-, superstes standing over (as witness or survivor), from super- + stare to stand -- more at STAND
1 a : a belief or practice resulting from ignorance, fear of the unknown, trust in magic or chance, or a false conception of causation b : an irrational abject attitude of mind toward the supernatural, nature, or God resulting from superstition
2 : a notion maintained despite evidence to the contrary

http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/superstition

Quote:

Second, that if a body of scripture is the word of an omniscient god, then it were inerrant. Therefore, one can start shooting it down right and left. How do you account for two conflicting genealogies in the "new testament?" Were your scriptural canon the inerrant word of god, there would be no such contradictions

Show me the contradictions then.

0 Replies

ACTING IN GOOD FAITH

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know