ACTING IN GOOD FAITH

Forums: Spirituality And Religion, Religion, Faith
Email this Topic • Print this Page

Answers-dot-com wrote:

faith (fāth) n.

1. Confident belief in the truth, value, or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing.
2. Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence. See synonyms at belief, trust.
3. Loyalty to a person or thing; allegiance: keeping faith with one's supporters.
4. often Faith Christianity. The theological virtue defined as secure belief in God and a trusting acceptance of God's will.
5. The body of dogma of a religion: the Muslim faith.
6. A set of principles or beliefs.

*************************************************************

su·per·sti·tion (sū'pər-stĭsh'ən) n.

1. An irrational belief that an object, action, or circumstance not logically related to a course of events influences its outcome.
2.
1. A belief, practice, or rite irrationally maintained by ignorance of the laws of nature or by faith in magic or chance.
2. A fearful or abject state of mind resulting from such ignorance or irrationality.
3. Idolatry.

(emphasis added in both definitions)

Source for definition of faith

Source for definition of superstition

***************************************************************

Among the pushing type of christians at this site, it is asserted that their faith is something special, and that they are entitled to a special consideration on the basis of the importance of their faith to themselves. I say that this is nonsense, that their faith is indistinguishable from superstition, and is entitled to no more consideration than is a belief in astrological signs, lucky rabbits' feet or any other number of unfounded desires asserted to be truth.

For the sake of discussing any alleged distinction between faith and superstition, i intend to ignore any definitions which are not provided in full as i have done above, and provided without a link, so that they may be examined. Posting a portion of a definition without the full definition and without a link by which the definition can be examined will more than likely constitute an attempt to extract a portion of a definition as a basis for one's argument, without leaving the remainder available for someone else's contention in refutation.

I have referred to specific portions of the definitions given above, by adding emphasis. I have also provided the full definitions and links to the definition pages so that anyone else may attempt to deny the case i'm making.

Topic Stats
Top Replies
Link to this Topic

Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 14,155 • Replies: 303

No top replies

I have faith that this thread will spiral downwards.

I believe I will make myself a Bloody Mary now.

0 Replies

Make one for me, but leave out the alkyhaul . . . yes, i doubt the bobble thumpers will show up for this one . . .

0 Replies

No entry found for bobble thumper.
Did you mean Bible thumper?

Suggestions:
Bible thumper
Bible-thumping
bibliotherapy

No entry was found in the dictionary. Would you like to search the Web for bobble thumper?

0 Replies

Mr. Setanta,

Are you serious? Are you kidding me? OMG! I think you are!

http://users.pandora.be/eforum/emoticons4u/happy/1074.gif

This is the funniest thing you have ever done that I know of!

http://users.pandora.be/eforum/emoticons4u/happy/1459.gif

Let's tell the rest of the story Mr. Setanta, shall we? No, wait, let me. It will be my pleasure. That is, if I can stop laughing long eough!

http://users.pandora.be/eforum/emoticons4u/happy/516.gif

Timber posed this challenge to me yesterday. I conceded. Timber and I chuckled about it.

http://users.pandora.be/eforum/emoticons4u/happy/505.gif

You and a another buddy or two (but especially you) can't seem to just accept that I conceded. I admitted defeat. If you are waiting for me to bow down and worship you because I admitted defeat, ain't gonna happen.

http://www.smileys.ws/smls/yahoo/00000028.gif

It's just one small challenge, Mr. Setanta. :wink:

Now, ARE you going to meet my challenge that you have typed that you are an atheist?

http://www.smileys.ws/smls/yahoo/00000033.gif

C.I.,

Okay, now I am the one ROFLMBO!!

http://www.smileys.ws/smls/laughing/00000014.gif

0 Replies

No, MOAN, you did not concede--you squirmed, you attempted to dodge and you fell back on your common resort of "well, that's just what i believe." At no time did you acknowledge that there is no distinction to be made between your faith and superstition.

0 Replies

Why are you addressing C.I., MOAN, he's not appeared in this thread. Are you losing what little grip you came here with?

0 Replies

Mr. Setanta Wrote:

Quote:

No, MOAN, you did not concede--you squirmed, you attempted to dodge and you fell back on your common resort of "well, that's just what i believe." At no time did you acknowledge that there is no distinction to be made between your faith and superstition.

Momma Angel Wrote:

Quote:

What is with you? Ok timber, how is this:

I concede. I cannot meet your challenge. You win! What's your address? I will send you a cigar.

Are we finished now?

http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1756940&highlight=conceed+concede#1756940

Momma Angel Wrote:

Quote:

spendius,

Thank you. I tried telling them that my faith was not based on ignorance or fear, but they didn't accept that.

I did concede to Timber. No big deal.

http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1758063&highlight=conceed+concede#1758063

THAT'S THREE!

The reference was to C.I. because of all the times he said he was ROFL! It was a joke. Rolling Eyes

0 Replies

Subsequent to your response to Timber, you wrote your response to Spendius, in which you assert inferentially that for faith and superstition to be equivalent, there must be an element of fear. You attempt to slide out from under the comparison by asserting, without proof, that fear is a necessary component of superstition, but not of faith.

In fact, fear is not a necessary component of superstition, which i was able to demonstrate using the definition of superstition which you provided, but only after being goaded, because you continually provided a truncated definition, in the hope of keeping the bit about fear in it, so that you could witlessly assert that it doesn't apply to you because you have no fear.

Beyond that, the childish, murderously violent, vengeful, racist, sexist god of the old testament constantly demands that his adherents fear him. The expressions "a god-fearing christian" and "put the fear of god into him" are commonplaces precisely because a fear of god is such a basic component of christianity.

You lose on two counts here. The first, because you did not actually concede, as your response to Spendius indicates. The second, because you can neither demonstrate that fear is a necessary component of superstition, nor can you assert that the belief in the god of the bobble is not based upon fear.

0 Replies

In short, MOAN, when you claim you conceded, that wasn't actually true . . . you're not acting in good faith.

0 Replies

I said I concede. I conceded the challenge. I said I could not meet the challenge.

Look, I don't write like they did in the Bible. You don't need to interpret anything. I conceded the challenge.

Now, how about you admitting you typed I'M AN ATHEIST?

0 Replies

Mr. Setanta Wrote:

Quote:

In short, MOAN, when you claim you conceded, that wasn't actually true . . . you're not acting in good faith.

http://web4.ehost-services.com/el2ton1/laughing1.gif

You are by far the most humorous person I have ever encountered. Funny thing is, I don't think you are trying to be. :wink:

0 Replies

I will just as soon as you admit that you willfully took the post out the context of a response to someone else who had already described me as an atheist. That has been my point all along--that i am only an atheist to the extent that others describe me as such. The entire context was as follows:

Francisco D'Anconia wrote:

I'm glad to see your involvement, Mr. Apisa...

But I'd like to see what a religious person wants to say about this...I know you're agnostic like me, Frank, and I'm going to guess that you, Setanta, are as well or an atheist.

To which i responded:

Setanta wrote:

Yes, i'm an atheist. There are people here of markedly religious conviction--but given the reception they usually get, they tend to be gun shy. I have, of late, avoided such threads, so as not to unnecessarily offend those of religious conviction. However, the title of this thread was too good to pass up.

So, just as you willfully ignore that you did not in fact concede to Timber, but just gave up the argument while attempting to reserve a condition of fear in your definitions, in this case, you ignore the context in which i responded to someone who had already labelled me an atheist

***************************************

In your response to Spendius, you wrote:

Momma Angel wrote:

spendius,

Thank you. I tried telling them that my faith was not based on ignorance or fear, but they didn't accept that.

I did concede to Timber. No big deal. (emphasis added)

That is a blatant attempt to suggest that, in fact, your faith and superstition are not the same, because of an unsupported inferential claim that superstition necessarily entails fear, and that christianity does not. You have not supported either inferential claim, and i submit that you cannot.

0 Replies

Set,
Not being a Christian man yourself and all, I can understand that you do not have any idea of what the fear of God is all about. Fear is not the fear that you know where you quiver and tremble at something that scares you. No, God fear is not about being afraid. If is about love. I don't know if you know what love is, but I will give you the benefit of the doubt. God fear is about not wanting to do anything that God would find disappointing. It is the fear of doing some of the very things that some of us Christians do when we deal with those such as yourself. It is doing things that we do not want to do against God, but we sometimes do anyhow. Just as a child does not want to do anything that would be displeasing to their parents, we do no want to do anything that is displeasing to God.

So, you see Set, fear of God is nothing to be afraid of. Scripture even tells us that the fear of God is the beginning of knowledge.

0 Replies

MOAN, once again, you lie when you contend that you conceded the point, you did not, as your response to Spendius indicates. You are not acting in good faith.

0 Replies

So, Lack of Intrepidity, that loving desire not to offend god, and god's loving desire for you to act as obediant children explains putting aldulterers to death (but only if they're women), putting homosexuals to death, putting unruly children to death . . . as always, the christian relies upon a tortured exegesis to reconcile the childish, hateful, vengeful, murderously violent god of the old testament with the peace, love and brotherhood propaganda of the new testament (the latter of which hasn't prevented the horrible deaths of millions upon millions).

Fear of god indeed, anyone in their right mind would fear that vicious sucker.

0 Replies

Set,
I am not aware of any Christians that are putting adulterers, homosexuals and unruly children to death. I am aware of many of your ilk who condone killing innocent children and calling it abortion.

Calling our God names says more about you than our love of Him says about us.

0 Replies

Mr. Setanta,

So, Francois didn't say he was guessing you were either an agnostic or an atheist and you didn't reply with Yes. I'm an atheist?

Well, dang my lying eyes. Rolling Eyes

0 Replies

Intrepid wrote:

I am not aware of any Christians that are putting adulterers, homosexuals and unruly children to death.

Your reading comprehension skills aren't very sharp, are they? Your god enjoins the killing of adulterers, homosexuals and unruly children--read Leviticus. More on that later.

Quote:

I am aware of many of your ilk who condone killing innocent children and calling it abortion.

You don't know what my "ilk" is--but that is typical of the kind of attitude one can expect from christians--you've got everyone else pidgeon-holed, don't you? Us and them, and we're the good guys, they're the bad guys. A foetus is not a child, so your contention is nonsensical.

Quote:

Calling our God names says more about you than our love of Him says about us.

See the reference to Leviticus above--and that isn't the only example in your bobble when the god of your fathers displays himself to be vengeful, murderous, racist and sexist. If you "love" such a deity with reverential awe, it at the least demonstrates that you aren't paying much attention--and at worst puts you in the same league with the monster you revere. It's not name-calling when it's true, you know.

0 Replies

Mr. Setanta,

Well, I guess the real problem here is you don't understand the New Covenant? But, you know what? I can understand how you don't get it. You don't seem to be one to let go of something very easily. Do you hold grudges against people forever?

I'm just going by what you post. There is forgiveness in the New Covenant but you seem to not pay much attention to that, so I gather you just don't forgive too easily? I don't know, so I am asking.

But, you sure don't let go of anything on these posts with me, even when I am discussing something with someone else.

0 Replies

ACTING IN GOOD FAITH

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know