As this thread has commonly discussed the behavior of the US abroad, the following story seems entirely relevant...(note that the full piece is available on a free day pass from Salon)
Quote:If you've ever wondered what John Ashcroft would do when faced with a choice between defending an energy company and discouraging slavery and murder in the developing world, the unappetizing answer may be found here. FindLaw columnist and Human Rights Watch attorney Joanne Mariner explains how the Justice Department, in its zeal to protect Unocal, is seeking to destroy the Alien Tort Claims Act -- the law that allows people injured by serious violations of international law abroad to seek civil damages in American courts against perps based in the United States.
http://www.salon.com/opinion/conason/2003/05/30/ashcroft/index_np.html
Tartar, I'm describing what Scrat 'demands' to show it isn't conjecture. c.i.
And this from the New York Times, Saturday 1 June
Report Said to Be Critical of Detentions Is Expected on Monday
By ERIC LICHTBLAU
"WASHINGTON, May 30 — A government report due to be released next week is expected to criticize the tactics and strategies the Justice Department used in detaining foreigners after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, officials said today.
The report, by the Justice Department's inspector general, does not draw any conclusions about the legality of the actions by the department or Attorney General John Ashcroft, officials who have seen it said.
But the report does examine the legal rationale for detaining more than 700 foreigners after counterterrorism sweeps, along with their access to lawyers, the length of their confinement and their treatment. Most of those held on immigration violations after the attacks were deported, and very few were ever linked to accusations of terrorism.
Government officials said the report was expected to provide new data showing that dozens of mostly Middle Eastern men were confined for more than 90 days, some without access to lawyers. The report is also expected to question the pace with which the Justice Department resolved cases against those in detention and whether immigration officials were pressured to detain suspects.
Members of Congress and civil liberties groups have been eager for the release of the report.
Officials with the American Civil Liberties Union, who have met with the inspector general's office about the report,said they expect that its findings should buttress their complaints that prosecutors have run roughshod over civil liberties in their pursuit of terrorists.
Justice Department officials would not comment."
Maybe there's beginning to be some open air on the Justice department under Ashcroft.
Tart - we're just getting cherries in now.
Craven - scroll is a bit different from scroll your boats, which I assume was a take-off. And yes, scroll is a public way to announce intentions. Not a game; a declaration of intent. A way to avoid continuous contentious conflict. Maybe you had to be there.
And I mentioned georgeob, precisely because of what I said. There are many others, too -all knowledgeable and informed. It is a selected list, which you would know if you've ever had any intercourse with a many-named character on abuzz known as zinger, or some others, whom I notice have not made it here.
I understand this forum to be about opinions and information, equally shared. There are very few, if any, objective views when voiced by a subject, but I assumed we all knew that.
And that is all I have to say about this matter .....now.
Sorry, CI -- I got confused (I admit) way back when about who's lying about what and when. So many lies, so little time...
Walter -- Thanks to Daylight Time, you have to cross a dateline (north/south approximately through Bermuda) at this time of the year. On the east coast, it is already June 1, though it remains Saturday because people need their whole weekend.
I don't know about you, but I would have difficulty mentioning "tart" and "cherry" in the same sentence.
Yes, we never do get a total purge of the bureaucracy and I doubt we ever will. The Washington machine began shortly after the inception of the government and its creaky gears are grinding on. Too much of the time it produces the sound similar to fingernails on a blackboard and doesn't fail to make me cringe in disbelief.
(And speaking of creaking along, I'm temporarily on AOL dial-up begtween broadband services -- they've got to be kidding, it's just as unstable as it always was).
I encourage your word association, Light, in connection with my persona, knowing (sadly) that neither tart nor cherry would be on your mind if we met!!
Tartarin wrote:
Quote:Walter -- Thanks to Daylight Time, you have to cross a dateline (north/south approximately through Bermuda) at this time of the year. On the east coast, it is already June 1, though it remains Saturday because people need their whole weekend.
Tartarin, they need you in Washington to spin a few things. :wink:
That's kind of you Kara but I think spin is built genetically into the American character, isn't it?
Well, was just poking (sic) fun.
I keep forgetting that if one used the quick post, it wipes out the "watch this topic." Tells you how many times I've been on the boards lately!
And the hits just keep on coming:
Quote:Straw, Powell had serious doubts over their Iraqi weapons claims
Secret transcript revealed
Jack Straw and his US counterpart, Colin Powell, privately expressed serious doubts about the quality of intelligence on Iraq's banned weapons programme at the very time they were publicly trumpeting it to get UN support for a war on Iraq, the Guardian has learned.
Their deep concerns about the intelligence - and about claims being made by their political bosses, Tony Blair and George Bush - emerged at a private meeting between the two men shortly before a crucial UN security council session on February 5.
The meeting took place at the Waldorf hotel in New York, where they discussed the growing diplomatic crisis. The exchange about the validity of their respective governments' intelligence reports on Iraq lasted less than 10 minutes, according to a diplomatic source who has read a transcript of the conversation.
The Guardian
So, how much more will it take before the media and the people openly question the honesty of the people in charge?
PDid, Some people want to hear the words, "We/I lied." We know that's never going to happen. c.i.
The historical Republican forumlation:
government is 'of the people, by the people, and for the people.'
The modern Republican forumulation:
government is evil
Now, I like this, because it is consistent. That is to say, Bush, Rove, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, et al are themselves clearly evil, thus who better to represent government than themselves.
Kara, It's always about "ethics." How can we help but question the motivations of this administration? All of their justifications for war with Iraq has not been proved. Our liberties guaranteed by the Constitution and Bill of Rights are being taken away by this administration. How can we not question this administration's ethics? Do you mean to say you have no questions about what this administration has done? c.i.
c.i., I am so totally at odds with what this administration is doing to civil rights that I cannot even talk about it. The name of Ashcorft shrivels my soul.
What I was pointing out was that I do not believe that these administrators are acting in an "evil" way. I see evil as intentional, and maybe I cannot point to anyone who has ever acted purposely in an evil way. Our leaders think they are doing what is best for this country, and that is so totally frightening.
"Freedom will be protected at the cost of civil liberties" - Sage Francis
