The US, UN & Iraq III

blatham

Fully agreed.

http://www.estripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=15259


20 mins ago

Quite right, blatham. That was my point. He sets up a straw man so that he can write a whole article putting down a non-existent "conspiracy."

Interested in Blatham's and Kara's interchange about straw men, because I think it demands from the rest of us a new way of talking (and/or posting). We really have to resist the straw-man ploy and simply argue the issues. We have straw-man posters galore here: they've adopted the style from Limbaugh and others. It is so pervasive that it needs a whole special vaccine, like smallpox. Call them on it -- don't let it float by. Too important.

Gee---what's a straw man?

This is a somewhat different but illustrative take on the "straw man" argument.

http://gncurtis.home.texas.net/strawman.html

I would not be just a nothin' My head all full of stuffin' My heart all full of pain I would laugh and I'd be merry Life would be a dinglederry If I only had brain

Very interesting amalgam of related articles in Slate about the recent wiggly behavior of France, Germany and the 'talk big, and don't have a stick' countries, who discussing getting together and purchasing a stick.

This was welcomed comic relief this morning.

Hope someone else enjoys it.
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Europe's Empty Gesture
By June Thomas
Posted Thursday, May 1, 2003, at 4:28 AM PT


" 'Old Europe' threw down the gauntlet at the feet of Britain, the United States and the Atlantic Alliance" Tuesday, said London's Daily Telegraph, after the leaders of France, Germany, Belgium, and Luxembourg announced plans to create a new European defense force to be headquartered near Brussels. The "mini-summit" was intended to "create a stronger military policy to underpin the European Union's common foreign and security policy," said the Financial Times, but if it becomes a reality, the force "could ultimately rival Nato and lead to a clash with the US." The Guardian declared, "Overall, the outcome was symbolic enough to annoy the summiteers' many critics while failing to mark significant progress of any kind."

France's Libération, which was generally supportive of the project, admitted the timing could have been better. "It will look like a new sign of distrust toward the United States at a time when the guns are barely silent in Iraq," especially given the four participants' anti-war activism. Le Monde used the occasion to attack the British prime minister for his loyalty to the United States and his rejection of the summit's goals: Tony Blair believes "the European Union must side with the United States, especially in times of serious international crisis. This is far removed from the ambitions of countries like France, which seek to strengthen Europe in order to act as a counterbalance to Washington's hegemonic desires."

In Germany, Frankfurter Rundschau hailed the start of "a new defense-policy era in Europe. … The meeting's political message leaves no room for others to avoid the question of what this community really wants to be in the world: a vassal or a partner." Süddeutsche Zeitung found the summit declaration "relatively sensible and logical," but wished there had been more participants: "What symbolic power it could have had if not only four but all six European founding states had made an appearance." Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung said it was "an open question" whether the four had strengthened the European pillar of NATO, as they intended, or if "they were swinging a wrecking ball" instead. (German translations courtesy of BBC Monitoring.)

Although EU members Greece and Russia supported the "gang of four," most of the "coalition of the willing" opposed the plan. The FT reported that U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell told a Senate committee that what is needed from Europe is "more military capability, not more headquarters." A NATO spokesman fretted that a new military command could lead to duplication of efforts.

For the London Times' foreign editor, the summit was "a gesture of independence … part of a trend towards small pacts between a few like-minded allies, rather than broad multi-national ones. It has echoes in the stalling of world trade talks and, of course, in challenges to the United Nations." A Times editorial denounced the meeting as "either one of the most intellectually confused or instead politically dishonest meetings conducted by EU nations." The paper reported that while the United States spends more than 3 percent of its gross domestic product on defense, and Britain and France 2.5 percent of GDP, most of Europe (with the exception of Greece) spends much less: Germany 1.5 percent, Belgium 1.3 percent, and Luxembourg 0.8 percent.

It was those spending patterns that led Spain's ABC to dismiss the summit as an empty gesture?-"a toast to the sun." The editorial noted: "The absence of an independent, capable, effective, deterring, balanced European pillar of defense isn't an accident. For decades, Europe has relied on the United States, on the deployment of its troops, its military innovation, and the certainty that it would assume the principal risks should it be necessary." Cuts in defense spending across Europe have been a popular success, but citizens "are now insufficiently sensitized to the risks and threats" they face. Now these four countries have called for measures that will require expenditures, "but the inability of France and Germany to control their galloping public deficits … makes the proposal a mere expression of intentions that is impossible to achieve in practice." It concluded, "Even supposing?-and it is supposing a lot?-that France and Germany achieve their objectives, how effective could they be without the support of Great Britain, Spain, Italy, or Hungary?"
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France and Germany will never get past arguing about who gets to design the uniforms.

Sophia

Thanks for the comic relief---you said it all in your last line:

FRANCE AND GERMANY WILL NEVER GET PAST ARGUING ABOUT WHO GETS TO DESIGN THE UNIFORMS.

This latest effort by France to fracture NATO and further divide Europe and the US is truly a joke. I think the citizens of France will surely hustle Chirac off to the funny farm and then take measures to repair the damage.

I. Well, the original BBC article looks a littel bit different ( ... and the original articles as well):


II. Russia is no EU-member (even not among the number of 'probable' members).

III. In the French-German Combined Brigade, which excists since 1990, this never has been a problem. (Same in the Dutch-German Brigade as well.)

Well, if they do settle on a design, we can then count on the following:
1 - Richard Perle will begin talking about European sweatshop labour
2 - an unidentified White House spokesperson will tell the Washington Post that there is clear intelligence evidence that new breeds of Chinese silk worms, three feet long and each one consuming a pound of moss per day, and bred secretly by Beijng, have found their way to unusually well guarded factories in Avignon and Bonn.
3 - a report will be released by the Pentagon revealing that Forces uniforms are beginning to fray and come apart at the seems. They are looking into it. Focus is on a thread supply purchased from a French manufacturer. The risk to the US military uniform, it is estimated, is troublingly severe. The release will also make brief mention that it's possible that US flag suppliers have been sold the same French thread.
4 - Jessica Lynch will be wheeled in front of congress. She will talk about her rescue by those brave lads who risked their lives, but she won't talk about her ordeal or herself. She'll begin crying, mentioning the sight of the uniform of the US Marines.
5 - Rumsfeld, with Colin Powell at his side, will hold a press briefing. "We know they have those Worms of Moss Destruction." Powell will show satellite photographs of dirt. He will point out the lack of moss.
6 - Press reports of US soldiers' uniforms falling to shreds will hit the media daily.
7 - Bush will 'talk to the nation'. His brow will be furrowed. He will advise that Paris is one of a number of nations harboring insects which can easily destroy military uniforms of free peoples. he will refer to them as the axis of weevil.
8 - missles take out the Eiffel Tower

Blatham

I'm very happy to note that you still have a sense of humor even though your country may never survive Cretien.

I like your number 8 but instead of the Eiffel Tower it should be Chirac's office ( after hours of course but after he arrives for an urgent phone call from Schroeder)

The Axis of Weevil!!!!


Get those bastards!!!

Sofia

You made me spill my coffee

I do what I can, perc.

Did you hear about the dramatic drop in terrorism? (Of course, 2001 was a dramatic rise, with 911... But, global news is good. )

STAYING VIGILANT
Despite the drop-off in attacks around the world, Powell said "we cannot relax our efforts, our resolve, our vigilance."
In releasing the annual report, he said that "with every passing month the campaign has intensified," and that for terrorists still on the loose "life has become harder."
The State Department said there were 199 terror attacks worldwide in 2002, a drop of 44 percent from the 355 attacks recorded in 2001. A total of 725 people were killed last year, far below the 3,295 ?- including thousands in the Sept. 11 attacks in New York, Washington and Pennsylvania ?- who died in 2001.
Attacks on the United States declined from 219 to 77. The drop was due mainly to a drop in pipeline bombings in Colombia ?- from 178 to 41.

The bombings in Bali in October which killed 202 people, mostly foreign tourists, was the deadliest terror attack since the Sept. 11 attacks in the United States.
In Africa, simultaneous attacks on a commercial airliner and a hotel in Mombasa, Kenya, in November were cited as dramatic evidence that sub-Saharan Africa continues to suffer from terror.
For the first time, Greece arrested members of the deadly November 17 group, the State Department said, in a significant step against domestic terrorism.


ENCOURAGING RESULTS?
The evil of terrorism continues to plague the world, but Afghanistan was liberated from Taliban rule and al-Qaida expelled as "the global war against terrorism was waged intensively with encouraging results," said Black said.
"Al-Qaida terrorists are on the run, and thousands of them have been detained," he said in a statement. "More than one-third of al-Qaida's leadership has been killed or captured."
More than 165 countries have issued orders freezing more than $121 million in terrorist-related financial assets, the report said.
The seven countries listed as sponsors of terror are banned from receiving U.S. weapons, barred from U.S. economic aid, and effectively prevented from receiving World Bank loans.
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A news report on the tube this AM said terrorism rates are back to 1969 levels. Seems as though the administration has been largely successful in the War on Terrorism. Wonder if anyone will characterize this as negative?

Flash _ Training for the new fighting force of the axis of weasels has been completed. The French and Belgium's have again perfected the art of graceful surrender. The Germans are in fine voice they can all sing Deutchland uber Allus. There is one sad note however, the three troops from Luxembourg seemed to have gotten lost.

Sofia

Those poor terrorists are suffering terribly----the ACLU is actively engaged in raising funds for defense of these misunderstood murderers.

Chirac, Schroeder, and Putin will probably conduct a whirlwind tour of the world to raise money for their defense while behind the scenes devising plans for attacks that they can blame on the US.
The Trifecta for the fornication of the US.

Gosh, Sofia. Were you a cheerleader in school?

How's about a bomb-bomb girl?

How did ye know of me cheerleadin' days?
Really, only in 9th grade. Me knees suffered mightily in those stratospheric jumps-- you know going down in the squat and propelling yourself way up into the sky...

Bomb-bomb??? What can I make of that....
Never acheived terrorist status in high school, but I did date the cool guy, who performed an illegal experiment in Science, and had the school shut down due to massive stink. (Every school has one.)

Tartarin-- Please tell me you are glad the War on Terrorism is proving successful. Can't you get your pom-poms out for this one?