1
   

Lynndie England's Sentence

 
 
Reply Tue 27 Sep, 2005 11:49 pm
Lynndie England Gets 3 Years

Quote:
Army Pfc. Lynndie England, who said she was only trying to please her soldier boyfriend when she took part in detainee abuse at Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison, was sentenced to three years behind bars.


Her "don't blame me, blame my boyfriend" defense didn't save her from serving time.
  • Topic Stats
  • Top Replies
  • Link to this Topic
Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 914 • Replies: 18
No top replies

 
Sturgis
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Sep, 2005 06:29 am
Essentially she got off easy. The best possible punishment for all the savages involved, would have been to subject them to the same sort of treatment they inflicted on the prisoners. Three years is nowhere near enough for England, she should get time alone just for her pathetic reasoning.
0 Replies
 
Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Wed 28 Sep, 2005 11:40 pm
Sturgis wrote:
The best possible punishment for all the savages involved, would have been to subject them to the same sort of treatment they inflicted on the prisoners.


Legally sanctioning the same acts in retribution is the ideal?

Odd that.
0 Replies
 
Noddy24
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 09:44 am
Two young women from West Virginia.

Two military careers.

Two military discharges--one honorable, one dishonorable.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 10:05 am
book and movie in the works.
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 11:29 am
Quote:
Lynndie deserves an apology





Before being sentenced to three years in prison and a dishonorable discharge, Lynndie England apologized to just about everyone in sight. She apologized to "coalition forces and all the families" and to the "detainees" she and others had abused at Abu Ghraib prison - England was the smirking soldier holding the leash, you might remember - and to "the families, America and all the soldiers." What she did not do is demand an apology in return. She's entitled to one.
A stronger person, maybe one with some political fiber, would have demanded an apology from her superiors - starting with the commander in chief, George W. Bush: How dare you send me into war for reasons that now seem downright specious? She might have demanded an explanation as well - not that she would have gotten one. After all, none of us really have. It was, it seems, some sort of mistake.

She might have demanded from Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld an apology for a military plan that no one, with the possible exception of Mrs. Rumsfeld, thinks called for enough troops and which was implemented before all of the troops were on the ground. How dare you, sir, send me to war so exposed?

She might have demanded an apology from the Army for sending her to work in a bad and chaotic place without proper training. Who says they're sorry about that? Not the President. Not Rumsfeld. Just salute and shut up.

She might have demanded an apology for not being told if the Geneva Convention applied to her detainees. From the President on down, the unspoken message had gone forth that the war on terror was something new under the sun. And the prisoners in Abu Ghraib were not real soldiers because the actual war was over and the enemy defeated - or so said the President. The detainees were something else, terrorists maybe, linked if only by rhetoric to Osama Bin Laden and the darkest of evil. A little fun at their expense - a pyramid of nude men and some sexual abuse - is what they had coming. If she got that message, who can blame her? Better yet, who will apologize for it?

The Washington Post on Wednesday published a letter written to Sen. John McCain by an Army captain, a West Pointer at that. In it, Capt. Ian Fishback says that for 17 months he's been searching for the Army's standards regarding the humane treatment of detainees. He cannot find them. Surely, torture is applying a hot poker to some poor guy's rear end. But is it putting a leash on a nude man? Is it mocking his genitals? Is it, in fact, any of the things Lynndie England did and which, thanks to digital photography, so offended the Muslim world?

It's impossible not to be revolted by what England did and to insist that no American should need special training in the humane treatment of fellow human beings. But she is, as she says, weak and passive and the sort of woman who is an easy mark for a man with the gift of fibbery. This was Charles Graner, her superior, boyfriend and the father of her child. As is very often the case in life and literature, the perpetrator is often also a victim. No reading of England's life story can stand any other interpretation. She is one of life's losers.

Nonetheless, she deserves her punishment. So do the others. But at Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo and elsewhere, the buck stops suspiciously low in the chain of command. Somehow, no one higher up is responsible for the situation England found herself in or for what she did. She's apparently accustomed to this sort of thing - just another example of getting stuck with the baby. Maybe someday she'll realize that a whole lot of very important people did her wrong. Who will apologize for that?




Those truly responsible are sitting in the seat of power and are unfortunately immune from punishment.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 11:56 am
It appears, au, that Ms. England, as slow and dull-witted as she appears to be, perhaps even "weak and passive and the sort of woman who is an easy mark for a man with the gift of fibbery," is not so stupid as to think she ought to blame George Bush for her own transgressions. Like it or not, Bush is not to blame for all that goes bad in this world. Bad things happened before him, and bad things will happen after him. 'Tis a bitter pill for some of you libbies to swallow, I know.
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 12:10 pm
Yeah, blaming bush is a stretch...but the bitter pill is Abu and the whole Iraq fiasco.
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 12:15 pm
Ticomaya
Can you in good conscience absolve Bush and his minions the responsibility what went on in Abu Garab?
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 12:21 pm
Quote:

The court-martial conviction Monday of the reservist Lynndie England for her role in the abuse of Iraqi prisoners at Abu Ghraib should fool no one that the Pentagon is taking seriously the mistreatment of Iraqis, especially after the release last Friday of a report on torture by members of the 82rd Airborne Division stationed near Falluja.
A captain in the division approached Congress and Human Rights Watch, which issued the report, after failing to get the army to act on his allegations of systematic beatings and abuse of prisoners that occurred in 2003 and 2004. The captain said he spent 17 months trying to get the military to follow up on the charges, which were backed up by two sergeants. Last week, a spokesman for the army said it was investigating. The captain has been identified by The New York Times as Ian Fishback, who has written letters to aides of two Republicans on the Senate Armed Services Committee, John Warner and John McCain, outlining some of the allegations. A spokesman for Warner, John Ullyot, said Monday that the senator found the charges "serious" and expected the army to determine whether they are credible.
If the allegations are found credible, they further demolish the contention by officials that the abuse first reported at Abu Ghraib in 2004 was an isolated case of a few bad apples. Pentagon brass also tried to explain away the activities of England's unit as the actions of relatively untrained reservists. It is less easy to dismiss as a fluke such abuse when it occurs at the hands of the 82rd Airborne, a thoroughly trained and highly decorated division.
The new charges, along with other accusations of abuse that have emerged since Abu Ghraib, including 28 suspicious detainee deaths, provide strong evidence that both reservist and active duty troops throughout Iraq were confused about their responsibility to treat detainees as prisoners of war under the terms of the Geneva conventions. Congress should have long since created a special commission, as proposed in a bill by Senator Carl Levin of Michigan, to investigate prisoner abuse.
A truly independent inquiry, along the lines of the one done by the 9/11 commission, could trace accountability for prisoner abuse through statements and policies by ranking civilian and military officials in the Bush administration. Accountability for the shame of prisoner torture and abuse should not stop with Lynndie England and her cohort.
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 12:26 pm
panzade
I would remind you the buck stops or it should stop at the man in charge.
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 02:08 pm
Should. Hope you fired off an angry letter to Pres Nixon when Lt Calley shot up that village.
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 02:11 pm
au1929 wrote:
Ticomaya
Can you in good conscience absolve Bush and his minions the responsibility what went on in Abu Garab?

You got any evidence he was involved? I'll tell you what, when the insurgency in Iraq start prosecuting its operatives who blow up civilians intentionally, behead captives if blackmail demands aren't met, etc., I'll start obsessing about it.
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 02:17 pm
panzade

I do not see any linkage between the two. Bush and his now attorney general practically invited the action at Abu Gerab.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 02:18 pm
" Like it or not, Bush is not to blame for all that goes bad in this world."

agreed

would you say > or < 95% ?Smile
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 02:21 pm
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article315839.ece

More on the behaviour of troops at war.
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 02:30 pm
Disgusting as that report is McTag, I'd hardly lay their behaviour at the feet of the President.
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 10:40 pm
panzade wrote:
Disgusting as that report is McTag, I'd hardly lay their behaviour at the feet of the President.


Well no. Not the behaviour. One would always hope that the conduct of troops on foreign soil would always be exemplary; but experience teaches that this is unlikely.
But the presence of the troops there, though. Who unleashed the dogs of war?
Wait a minute-what thread are we on? Lynndie England's sentence?
Lynndie was a puppet. The guidelines for her and Sgt Grainer's behaviour were established much further up the chain of command. She was stupid enough to pose for photographs. The guilty puppeteers are going free.
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Sep, 2005 10:51 pm
I can't disagree
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

T'Pring is Dead - Discussion by Brandon9000
Another Calif. shooting spree: 4 dead - Discussion by Lustig Andrei
Before you criticize the media - Discussion by Robert Gentel
Fatal Baloon Accident - Discussion by 33export
The Day Ferguson Cops Were Caught in a Bloody Lie - Discussion by bobsal u1553115
Robin Williams is dead - Discussion by Butrflynet
Amanda Knox - Discussion by JTT
 
  1. Forums
  2. » Lynndie England's Sentence
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.04 seconds on 05/04/2024 at 07:31:47