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TO RESCUE or NOT TO RESCUE?

 
 
Foxfyre
 
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 04:37 pm
Quote:
"I find no warrant for such an appropriation in the Constitution, and I do not believe that the power and the duty of the General Government ought to be extended to the relief of individual suffering which is in no manner properly related to the public service or benefit. A prevailing tendency to disregard the limited mission of this power and duty should, I think, be steadfastly resisted, to the end that the lesson should be constantly enforced that though the people support the Government the Government should not support the people.

The friendliness and charity of our countrymen can always be relied upon to relieve their fellow-citizens in misfortune. This has been repeatedly and quite lately demonstrated. Federal aid in such cases encourages the expectation of paternal care on the part of the Government and weakens the sturdiness of our national character, while it prevents the indulgence among our people of that kindly sentiment and conduct which strengthens the bonds of a common brotherhood."

-- President Grover Cleveland, upon vetoing a bill appropriating money to aid drought-stricken farmers in Texas [February 16, 1887]


There was no disaster relief in the United States prior to the 1930's. The people looked to government to build the roads and deliver the mail, but nobody expected the government to feed them when they were hungry. Government assistance during the Great Depression was intended to be limited, short term, and as much as possible provided the dignity of work for benefits received.

Now every big storm, every large scale fire, every flood, every earthquake sends presidents and politicans rushing to declare disasters and emergencies with promises of generous restitution for any victims.

Is it out of hand? Or does the government do too little? If you think too much, to what extent would you want policies rolled back to pre-New Deal levels? If you think too little, what more would you want the government to do?
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Type: Discussion • Score: 0 • Views: 813 • Replies: 16
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Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 04:51 pm
None of the above. One of the main functions of government is security and defense, whether it be against and invader or a natural disaster.

When the local infrastructure is destroyed, it follows that the Federal Government would have the resources to bring aid, whether the threat is a hurricane or an invading army.
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 04:58 pm
That is definitely a take on it that I wasn't thinking of, Chrissee, and it definitely merits discussion. What kind of aid would you see as appropriate for the Federal government to provide in the case of a hurricane or an earthquake?
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Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 05:35 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
That is definitely a take on it that I wasn't thinking of, Chrissee, and it definitely merits discussion. What kind of aid would you see as appropriate for the Federal government to provide in the case of a hurricane or an earthquake?


Whatever aid is available to save lives and rebuild the infrastructure. My philosphy is that the aid should be equal whether the catastrophe is man made or natural. The role of local government should be more in preparation, evacuation, educating the citizenry as to what to do in advance of a disaster. That said, I think the Feds over-delivered what was needed for Ophelia. It was barely a Cat 1 and here they are with FEMA and all kinds of reliefe efforts in place, a waste of the taxpayer's dollar.

Of course, with Rove in charge of FEMA now, it's all PR.
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Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 05:38 pm
BTW the closest answer is Number 4, but it is way too broad. I don't think even the most liberal here would agree with that. In some cases, the government should provide for people's needs, but only in cases where they cannot help themselves.
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Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 05:43 pm
Quote:
There was no disaster relief in the United States prior to the 1930's.


That is patently false. Where did you come up with this?
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Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Sep, 2005 05:48 pm
Quote:
Government assistance during the Great Depression was intended to be limited, short term, and as much as possible provided the dignity of work for benefits received.


I am not sure about the meaning of the last mudled clause but, more or less, it is the same today.
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Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Sep, 2005 10:01 am
Chrissee wrote:
Quote:
There was no disaster relief in the United States prior to the 1930's.


That is patently false. Where did you come up with this?



I would like an answer. Just curious. Sounds like something Limbaugh would say.
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Sep, 2005 10:09 am
What disaster relief did the Federal government provide prior to the 1930's?
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Sep, 2005 10:17 am
The government should take care of the peoples immediate needs. However the rebuilding of communities is not the responsibility of the national government. i.e. the rebuilding of New Orleans should be the responsibility of the state of La. and the city of New Orleans.
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Sep, 2005 10:21 am
At last a reasonable response.

So Au, what do you consider to be people's 'immediate needs' and how long are such needs deemed 'immediate'?
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Sep, 2005 10:39 am
Help in getting people resettled and support for a limited period of time. Rebuilding as I said is the responsibility of the community.
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Sep, 2005 10:42 am
But see? The problem with that is there is no guideline for what constitutes 'resettling' or what constitutes 'limited time'. Some would think resettling isn't complete until the people are back in a home of their own, earning the same level of income, and have recouped all their savings. Others say, we'll shelter you during the storm and for X number of days until you can make other living arrangements and then you're on your own. Still others would say there is a compromise in there somewhere.
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Sturgis
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Sep, 2005 01:41 pm
I can see assisting but only on a limited basis. There has to be some involvement from local government as well which often does not happen.
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Sep, 2005 03:26 pm
As you know, Los Alamos NM is the birthplace of the atomic bomb and at one time was a 100% government town. The houses built there for employees were typical government issue with few frills or amenities and not that much to look at. The town is now like any other town with everything local government or privately owned except for the Los Alamos National Labs that employ a lot of high salaries scientists and other high tech people. A lot of those folks bought a lot of the old government houses that were sitting on very attractive property that was backed up to a national forest.

A few years ago, a massive forest fire burned up that part of the national forest and took out a couple of hundred of those old houses and President Clinton declared Los Alamos a disaster area.

Well all those scientists and high tech types were well insured, and with their insurance money plus the disaster relief, they replaced that old government housing with nice, big, modern, beautiful homes.

Needless to say those who didn't get burned out and are still stuck with their old, outdated, not-that-good-to-look out government built housing, are feeling a bit cheated.

What's wrong with this picture?
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Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Sep, 2005 07:46 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
What disaster relief did the Federal government provide prior to the 1930's?


You said there was no disaster relief before the 1930s. I guess you misspoke.

Where did you hear there was no Federal disaster relief before 1930, tha ti s not true either. I want to know what your source is.

Obviously, the Federal Government didn't send helicopters in to save people in the 1900 Galveston hurricane but they did provide relief in helping to recover and rebuild.

BTW the year is 2005. Over 100 years since the Galveston hurricane. A lot has changed in 105 years.
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Merry Andrew
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Sep, 2005 09:58 pm
Chrissee, you have not, however, answered foxfyre's question. What disaster relief did the Federal government provide prior to the 1930s? Everything I've read about the Galveston hurricane (1900), the San Francisco earth quake (1906) or the 1920 flooding in New Orleans indicates that it was the Red Cross providing most of the relief, not government agencies. There was no such thing as FEMA, of course. Even NPR -- surely not a bastion of conversatism -- made a point of mentioning that on one broadcast of background material to the New Orleans tragedy.
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