Middle America's creeping theocracy

Didnt boat fulls of christians colonize america with the intent to create a christian nation, one nation under God? Wasnt this country founded on biblical doctrines? Wasn't the constitution written by a bunch of christians? Werent the laws put in place as a reflection of the comands in the bible.... or am i missing something?

I could be wrong. But even in my history classes in the 13 years i spent in school taught me that. And that wasnt in just one school, ive attended to 10 different schools. I got the same story in ten schools in two different states.

I guess i just dont get where the problem is with a christian nation pushing christian agendas.

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J_B wrote

Quote:

Back to public schools.... Our local population is religiously diverse between Christianity and Judaism. Our 8th grade social studies curriculum includes a unit on comparing "The Three Religions of Abraham". It does not include any discussion of the other major religions of the world or delve into the differences among Christian beliefs. It's strictly an effort to include a surface level understanding of the major tenets of each of the three religions. It is not optional and is not discussed with the parents. I'm fine with it as my kids get this and much more on each of the world's religions through their UU Sunday School, but some folks have expressed concerns.

I would ask how well controlled is the curricula? Would it be possible for an instructor to introduce his/her bias into the discussion? Or better still is it possible to keep an instructors religious beliefs out of the classroom. IMO once pandora box has been opened or the apple has been tasted that would be the natural progression.

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We are no longer a Christian nation. The colonists and Constitution writers might have all be Christian but as a diverse nation we should stop 'pushing christian agendas' in our public schools. Public schools are solely supported by public tax dollars and the curriculum should not 'push' the agendas of only a portion of those taxpayers.

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JB, you have a point. I was wrong about the agendas in the school. ANd honestly i never thought of it that way. As a democratic nation i suppose we have gone away from a christian nation by sheer volume of non christian voters.

The i guess it becomes a topic just like with other religions.... tolerence from society. If a christian parent chooses to home school, is the right theirs to see to their own childs education, or has education becomes the complete responcibility of the state....

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and this is purely out of curiosity, if any one disagrees with the education provided by the public schools provided does that mean they should have to pay school taxes AND tuition to get their kid an education they prefer?

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BreatheThePoison
This nation was founded by people who were seeking freedom of religion. They wanted to be able to practice the religion of their choice and not to be persecuted for it.
That was recognized by the writers in our constitution. The US is a secular not a Christian nation. The fact that the majority practice some form of Christianity does not make it so.

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BreatheThePoison wrote:

and this is purely out of curiosity, if any one disagrees with the education provided by the public schools provided does that mean they should have to pay school taxes AND tuition to get their kid an education they prefer?

IMO, yes. We can't pick and choose which public programs our tax dollars are used, as much as I'd like to sometimes. Nor should public tax dollars be used to support public education AND private education. Private education expenses, including the expenses of home schooling should fall to the individual families using the service.

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au1929 wrote:

I would ask how well controlled is the curricula? Would it be possible for an instructor to introduce his/her bias into the discussion? Or better still is it possible to keep an instructors religious beliefs out of the classroom. IMO once pandora box has been opened or the apple has been tasted that would be the natural progression.

I too think it's better handled outside of school. I think the idea was to specifically include some discussion of Islam because our kids are so naive about it. By comparing Islam to Judaism and Christianity, they hope to teach tolerance and acceptance.

I was raised in a VERY white, Christian state with only a tiny Jewish community among the Protestants and Catholics. I now live in a VERY white, Judeo-Christian community with absolutely no mix of ethnic or other religious beliefs except a sprinkling of Asian families. I grew up very naive and I don't think that was necessarily a good thing. I do think the public schools need to emphasize diversity and acceptance, not just on religious grounds but on race as well.

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JB-

I can see where that makes sense. I actually was home school a few years durring school. And because we also paid school taxes we were allowed the right to use the facilities. So i could do art and gym at the public school, use the pool, the play ground that sort of thing, but my parents still had to pay for the cost of home schooling and the taxes that supported the local school.

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One thing to consider is that everyone pays school taxes, whether we have or will ever have children in public school.

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Setanta wrote:

That is not a statement that religious indoctrination is illegal. It is an observation about the finding of the Supremes more than fifty years ago. Your inability to comprehend the distinction, or your unwillingness to do so, in no way authorizes your attempt to contend that i have stated that religious indoctrination is illegal. I think it ought to be, but i have not at any time in this thread stated that it is.

Boy howdy.

Tell us please Setanta, fo' us po' ignorant hillbillies: When the Supreme Court rules that something violates the Constitution, if that doesn't mean it's illegal, please, tell us po' dumb ones what do it mean?

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freeduck, i realized that just as i clicked submit.. lol.

I had remembered my elderly neighbor telling me to crank out some kids so they can justify paying the town's school taxes.

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Yep, I remember complaining about paying taxes to a gay co-worker who chastised me saying that he would be paying school taxes for his entire life and never use those services. But of course, he felt it was worth it because he saw value in having an educated populace.

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yes, and educated populace is so much better than the uneducated masses. A very agreable point. So atleast no matter what the outcome of this we can find some solace no matter we desired in the fact that an education is better than no education.

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real life wrote:

Boy howdy.

Tell us please Setanta, fo' us po' ignorant hillbillies: When the Supreme Court rules that something violates the Constitution, if that doesn't mean it's illegal, please, tell us po' dumb ones what do it mean?

This is so pathetic, i just had to quote it so that it could be seen again. The Supremes shot down one program in an Illinois school district in 1948. It created no law, and it did not hold that any religious course in a school is illegal. It did not hold that religious indoctrination is illegal, it simply ruled that one school district's program was unacceptable.

I am hardly to be held responsible for your ignorance of the workings of Federal jurisprudence. Tediously, allow me to point out once again--at no time have i contended that religious indoctrination is illegal. The point of my post was to point out that such a program was once ruled unconstitutional by the Supremes, and that the current court might find differently in this case.

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El-Diablo wrote:

They tend to always portray the positive except in the case of established "barbarians" such as the mongols and huns. Very rarely do we hear of the things the terrible things that went on in Christian Europe in the middle ages just as we don't really hear that which went on in Islamic empires.

exactly.

how come the mongols and huns are the only barbarians on the planet when they arn't the ones who started the triangular slave trade, or carried out the cathocalypse of latin and central america, the genocide of red indians, the colonial carving up of africa, the inquisition, the pogroms, the holocaust, the unit 731 crimes OR the armenian genocide, the genocide of hindus in bangladesh, the stomping out of zorastrianism in iran and this, this and this

how come every ball falls in the court of the huns and mongols ??

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we are not new to bible-belting in india either -

here's one mr max muller revealing his evangelical agenda in a letter to his wife (from "the life and letters of the right dis-honourable max maniac")

"This edition* of mine and the translation of the Veda will hereafter tell to a great extent... the fate of India, and on the growth of millions of souls in that country. It is the root of their religion, and to show them what the root is, I feel sure, the only way of uprooting all that has sprung from it during the last 3000 years."

* of the translation of Rig Ved

then there's one Mr. Monier Williams, who had this to say - in a speech given at Oxford to the Missionary Congress on 2 May 1877, said: "When the walls of the mighty fortress of Brahminism are encircled, undermined, and finally stormed by the soldiers of the Cross, the victory of Christianity must be signal and complete."

india is the country with the maximum number of missionaries in the world.(Time magazine says so) and they keep the ball started by ace missionaries like muller and monier, rolling all over the country. here's a sneak peak (by Francois Gautier, http://www.francoisgautier.com/ ) into their activities.

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BreatheThePoison wrote:

Didnt boat fulls of christians colonize america with the intent to create a christian nation, one nation under God? Wasnt this country founded on biblical doctrines? Wasn't the constitution written by a bunch of christians? Werent the laws put in place as a reflection of the comands in the bible.... or am i missing something?

No, they came from Christian nations. Some just wanted the freedom to practice their own versions of religion. Some came for economic or other reasons.

You are missing something. This country was not founded on biblical doctrines. Many of the Founding Fathers were deists, not Christians or theists. Yes, some of the laws such as allowing slavery, treating women as second class citizens, killing witches, lying to and exterminating neighboring tribes, and blue laws were supported by biblical commands. But for the most part our laws reflect English Common Law, not the Bible.

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BBB
Kansas legislature just voted to approve teaching Intelligent Design in their schools.

Sadly, this demonstrates there is no intelligence in Kansas.

BBB

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Re: BBB

BumbleBeeBoogie wrote:

Kansas legislature just voted to approve teaching Intelligent Design in their schools.

What class are they going to teach it in?

Does it get its own class, like science does? Or do they teach it in sociology and humanities?

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Middle America's creeping theocracy

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