Questioner
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Dec, 2005 01:04 pm
Intrepid wrote:
I did not leap in. I have been in since the beginning. It is just that I do not agree with you.


I can respect disagreement. I cannot respect false representation of my stance in order for said disagreement to take place.
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Dec, 2005 01:06 pm
...and the false representative is????
0 Replies
 
Questioner
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Dec, 2005 01:08 pm
Intrepid wrote:
...and the false representative is????


Quote:
The fact that you do not consider it to be insufficient evidence does not lessen it's value as evidence.


Perhaps misunderstanding should be the word used instead of misrepresentation. And I made reply to this describing how it was not an accurate assessment on your part.
0 Replies
 
real life
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Dec, 2005 07:18 pm
Questioner wrote:
real life wrote:
Hi Questioner,

I see that you've added 'You're lying' to your repetroire of non-responses. Nice job.

I refer you back to this post http://www.able2know.com/forums/a2k-post1506430.html&highlight=heartbeat#1506430 for a discussion from a medical standpoint that was submitted in court.

I have my doubts as to whether you will read it, but perhaps others who are interested in the topic will.


.......It is certainly an interesting read.........


Do you agree with the combined medical judgement of these experts, or do you know better than they?
0 Replies
 
Questioner
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Dec, 2005 08:13 am
real life wrote:

Do you agree with the combined medical judgement of these experts, or do you know better than they?


I certainly can't disagree with them, as it's not my field.

Wouldn't you agree that it apparently wasn't enough evidence to get the job done?
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Dec, 2005 08:29 am
BTW... the information was from 1971
0 Replies
 
Questioner
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Dec, 2005 08:33 am
Intrepid wrote:
BTW... the information was from 1971


Good to know.

Not that that really has any bearing at all at the moment.
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Dec, 2005 08:37 am
Probably none. Wasn't it 1973 that the Wade/Roe thing came about?
0 Replies
 
Questioner
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Dec, 2005 09:19 am
Aye, it was.
0 Replies
 
real life
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Dec, 2005 09:32 pm
Questioner wrote:
real life wrote:

Do you agree with the combined medical judgement of these experts, or do you know better than they?


I certainly can't disagree with them, as it's not my field.

Wouldn't you agree that it apparently wasn't enough evidence to get the job done?


Obviously the court allowed existing abortion laws in nearly every state to be struck down, regardless of what the American College of Obstetrics and Gynecology had to say.

What I am asking you is, upon seeing the medical judgement of the American College of Obstetrics and Gynecology, would you have come to the conclusion that the unborn is not a living human and not deserving of protection?
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Dec, 2005 12:58 pm
If this site has already been posted, I apologize. But if you go to the site and click on the number of weeks on the graph, it will show you the precise development of the unborn.

http://www.visembryo.com/baby/nav/spnav.7.gif

You'll find the site here:

http://www.visembryo.com/baby/
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Dec, 2005 01:02 pm
That is awesome! Thanx Foxfyre!
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Dec, 2005 01:10 pm
You're most welcome MommaAngel. It was posted on another board I frequent and that is discussing this subject. This is maybe the most useful tool I've seen for those who wish to be fully informed on this subject and not just dogmatic in their point of view.
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Dec, 2005 01:20 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
You're most welcome MommaAngel. It was posted on another board I frequent and that is discussing this subject. This is maybe the most useful tool I've seen for those who wish to be fully informed on this subject and not just dogmatic in their point of view.

It sure helped me. I still find the miracle of birth so awesome. I can't have children, so it's kind of hard for me to understand anyone that would want to abort a pregnancy. I am really trying to understand the views of others, but it is really hard to do sometimes.
0 Replies
 
Questioner
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Dec, 2005 01:24 pm
real life wrote:

What I am asking you is, upon seeing the medical judgement of the American College of Obstetrics and Gynecology, would you have come to the conclusion that the unborn is not a living human and not deserving of protection?


I've been giving your question quite a bit of thought RL.

After reading the information you posted I have to say that I would find it difficult to rule the same way the courts did. Now I say that with a few clauses built in:

1) I would most likely still allow abortions up until the 3 week period.
2) Certain cases would have to be given special attention, and allowances made.
3) Anonymity must be maintained, same as with any other Doctor/patient relationship.

Outside of that, I wouldn't have issue with the pro-life stance.

Having said all that, I'd like to note that until the laws change, I will still consider myself pro-choice.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Dec, 2005 01:38 pm
Questioner wrote:
real life wrote:

What I am asking you is, upon seeing the medical judgement of the American College of Obstetrics and Gynecology, would you have come to the conclusion that the unborn is not a living human and not deserving of protection?


I've been giving your question quite a bit of thought RL.

After reading the information you posted I have to say that I would find it difficult to rule the same way the courts did. Now I say that with a few clauses built in:

1) I would most likely still allow abortions up until the 3 week period.
2) Certain cases would have to be given special attention, and allowances made.
3) Anonymity must be maintained, same as with any other Doctor/patient relationship.

Outside of that, I wouldn't have issue with the pro-life stance.

Having said all that, I'd like to note that until the laws change, I will still consider myself pro-choice.


I think using this rationale, most of us are pro choice. Smile

Once we do recognize that destroying the unborn at any stage is ending a human life, we can come to agreement or at least compromise on how this consensus can be legally addressed. I would agree that very early in the pregnancy, it can be between a woman and her doctor. After a certain stage, it should still be legal but with medical necessity becoming a factor and, when there is no medical necessity, a court order or some other legal provision should come into play.

If we could just agree on these simple provisions, I think abortion would again become socially unacceptable except in extreme circumstances, the abortion mills would close down due to lack of profitability, and the net result would be a lot fewer abortions along with a lot fewer unwanted children as I think women would again be more likely to accept responsibility to see that unwanted pregnancy did not occur.
0 Replies
 
echi
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Dec, 2005 04:20 pm
Momma--

(I'm not setting up any trap, or anything. Don't worry.)

When, if ever, do you feel that it is acceptable to terminate pregnancy?
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Dec, 2005 04:56 pm
It's okay, echi, I don't think that of you.

I will never use the word acceptable along with abortion. I will say this, there are case in which I could understand it being done. Like in medical emergencies, etc. Still don't like the thought of it at all, but I can understand it.
0 Replies
 
echi
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Dec, 2005 05:11 pm
Momma--

That's what I figured. You and I are on the same page (here, at least).
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Dec, 2005 05:14 pm
Glad to hear it.
0 Replies
 
 

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