Those wannabe cowboy ICE-holes on the southern border

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hightor wrote:

Quote:
Wait, you only think immigrants should come from the North?

I thought we were talking about refugees. In any case, no "shoulds" apply...the northern border is just a safer route. (Those wannabe cowboy ICE-holes on the southern border are primed to commit those sorts of repressive atrocities in a spirit of righteous enthusiasm.) edgarblythe was referring to skin shades. IT workers from India and Pakistan are dark-skinned people, that's all.

Source: Monitoring Biden and other Contemporary Events

I don't understand the phrase "Those wannabe cowboy ICE-holes" - It seems to call those mounted officers wearing cowboy hats as "wannabe cowboy ICE-holes." What are "ICE-holes"? Fishers in winter days dig holes on ice to fish, so if you go on a frozen river you can see ice holes around you. Are the officers like ice holes? If so, why capitalized ice?

I've thought otherwise, "ICE-hole" here might be a verb. If so, with "those", you will get "cowboys", not "cowboy."

Okay, what does the phrase mean?

Note: I've googled it and found no clue there.

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@oristarA,

I'm sorry, oristarA, I'll explain the reference. ICE is the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency whose mission is the enforcement of immigration laws and investigation of cross border crimes. It has a reputation for brutal treatment of people caught for illegally crossing the border. Recently there were pictures of ICE agents, mounted on horses, chasing down Haitian refugees in Texas. I referred to them as "wannabe cowboys" because they were wearing cowboy hats and lots of Texans have this thing about the state's cowboy heritage (exaggerated, by the way) and like to talk tough and brandish six-guns. I then added the hyphenated "-hole" as a play on the term "asshole" (a jerk) because chasing people while mounted on a horse and terrifying them is something an asshole would do.

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@hightor,

Quite apart from your correct explanation of the English, people breaking the law (in this case illegal entry) should expect that the authorities may try to apprehend them, and that if they try to avoid apprehension, the authorities will likely pursue. The rational solution would be not to commit the crime.

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@Brandon9000,

What about the Border Patrol agents who are breaking the law? Border Patrol agents are law-enforcement agents. They are under oath to follow the laws. Immigrants are not under this oath.

Border Patrol agents who break the law and mistreat immigrants are assholes.

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@Brandon9000,

Quote:

...people breaking the law (in this case illegal entry) should expect that the authorities may try to apprehend them, and that if they try to avoid apprehension, the authorities will likely pursue.

True.

Quote:

The rational solution would be not to commit the crime.

Also true. I think the problem is that the people entering the country illegally aren't making completely rational decisions. It's rational to try to escape from a **** hole but it's not rational to assume that border regulations will be suspended and undocumented people will be allowed entry. Desperation is a factor here.

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@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

What about the Border Patrol agents who are breaking the law? Border Patrol agents are law-enforcement agents. They are under oath to follow the laws. Immigrants are not under this oath.

Border Patrol agents who break the law and mistreat immigrants are assholes.

Given that their duty is to apprehend people entering the country illegally, what law exactly did they break?

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@hightor,

hightor wrote:

Quote:
...people breaking the law (in this case illegal entry) should expect that the authorities may try to apprehend them, and that if they try to avoid apprehension, the authorities will likely pursue.

True.

Quote:
The rational solution would be not to commit the crime.

Also true. I think the problem is that the people entering the country illegally aren't making completely rational decisions. It's rational to try to escape from a **** hole but it's not rational to assume that border regulations will be suspended and undocumented people will be allowed entry. Desperation is a factor here.

Agreed, but it is not our duty to allow every poor person in the world into our country, nor would it be in our interest to do so.

1 Reply

@Brandon9000,

Brandon,

Do you agree that it is against the law for a Bordee Patrol agent to rape an "illegal" immigran?

I am not sure if you are making the argument that Border Patrol agents can do whatever they want to "illegals". If a border patrol agemt breaks the law while he is apprehending a criminal alien, then the border patrol agent is illegal.

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@Brandon9000,

Quote:

Agreed, but it is not our duty to allow every poor person in the world into our country, nor would it be in our interest to do so.

That's true. But that makes it all the more incumbent on our border agents to be seen as enforcing our immigration laws consistently, fairly, and humanely.

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@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

Brandon,

Do you agree that it is against the law for a Bordee Patrol agent to rape an "illegal" immigran?

I am not sure if you are making the argument that Border Patrol agents can do whatever they want to "illegals". If a border patrol agemt breaks the law while he is apprehending a criminal alien, then the border patrol agent is illegal.

These are pretty dumb questions. Did some border patrol agent rape an illegal? I haven't heard of that. If it did happen, do you believe it's a standard part of their practice?

My opinion is that apprehension of invaders, even with some, minimal violence if necessary to make the apprehension, is right, proper, and part of their job. Obviously, this does not include the comission of crimes such as rape. Any such bad individual agent should be fired and prosecuted, but that has nothing to do with the fact that their ordinary actions are absolutely good and appropriate.

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@Brandon9000,

You are using the word "invader" as a way to justify your extreme views. The teenaged kids and single moms are coming arent here to invade anything. They just want to mow your lawn.

The Border Patrol is not a military organization. They are law enforcement. You may be able to justify a soldier in a wartime conflict who accidentally shoots kids during battle. Solidiers operate in war afainst a military enemy with tanks and snipers and rockets.

When that Border Patrol commits violence, they should be prosecuted.

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@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

You are using the word "invader" as a way to justify your extreme views. The teenaged kids and single moms are coming arent here to invade anything. They just want to mow your lawn.

The Border Patrol is not a military organization. They are law enforcement. You may be able to justify a soldier in a wartime conflict who accidentally shoots kids during battle. Solidiers operate in war afainst a military enemy with tanks and snipers and rockets.

When that Border Patrol commits violence, they should be prosecuted.

I asked you if a border patrol agent raped someone, as you implied, and for some reason, you declined to answer me. I'm asking again.

Anyone who enters the country illegally should be apprehended and removed. They don't get to mow my lawn if they arrive by sneaking in against my laws. You've made a vague implication that some border patrol agents somewhere are doing something wrong, but have given zero examples.

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@Brandon9000,

There are two different statments here.

1) Should someone who enters the country be apprehended and and removed.

2) shoud Border Patrol agents who break the law while doing their job be apprehended and removed.

These are two completely different issues which you conflating. Your opinion on the first doesn't dictate your opinion on the second. We all know your position on the question of whether immigrants here illigally should be removed.

This thread is about allegedly corrupt border patrol agents.

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@maxdancona,

And yet again you vaguely imply that border patrol agents are breaking the law but cannot offer one single example. There are probably some physics teachers somewhere breaking the law, but that has nothing to do with the profession.

2 Replies

@Brandon9000,

I am simply trying to get you to accept that Border Patrol agents shouldn't break the law while doing their job. If you would just agree with this point, I will feel we have gotten somewhere.

It is irrelevant to the issue at hand; the question of whether Border Patrol agents SHOULD follow the law is different from the question of whether they do. But I will play the game if you really insist.

How many examples do you want of Border Patrol agents breaking the law? I will do the googling for you. Will 5 examples be fine?

2 Replies

@Brandon9000,

Your Physics Teacher example illustrates my point.

A Physics Teacher should never break the law while doing their job, and Physics teachers who do should be arrested and removed.

When I was a Physics teacher, a few times I wanted to slap a student. There was time where a student hit me. I stayed in control and acted professionally (which meant not responding to the violence). There were times when slapping a student probably would have had educational value. Still I understood that I couldn't slap my students and I did my job according to the rules.

Border Patrol agents should be held to the same standard.

1 Reply

@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

I am simply trying to get you to accept that Border Patrol agents shouldn't break the law while doing their job. If you would just agree with this point, I will feel we have gotten somewhere.

It is irrelevant to the issue at hand; the question of whether Border Patrol agents SHOULD follow the law is different from the question of whether they do. But I will play the game if you really insist.

How many examples do you want of Border Patrol agents breaking the law? I will do the googling for you. Will 5 examples be fine?

It would be wrong to ask for five examples. I just want you to obey the rules of debate by giving some examples. I think that two will be sufficient to hod up your end.

0 Replies

@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

Your Physics Teacher example illustrates my point.

A Physics Teacher should never break the law while doing their job, and Physics teachers who do should be arrested and removed.

When I was a Physics teacher, a few times I wanted to slap a student. There was time where a student hit me. I stayed in control and acted professionally (which meant not responding to the violence). There were times when slapping a student probably would have had educational value. Still I understood that I couldn't slap my students and I did my job according to the rules.

Border Patrol agents should be held to the same standard.

When I was in my 20s, right out of grad school I got a job teaching Physics and Physical Science in a boy's Catholic high school by telling an employment agent "anything but teaching." Although most of the students were well behaved, the minority that were not was enough to throw the whole school into disarray. Unfortunately, I was so young and knew so little about life myself that I couldn't really control them, even handing out punishments left and right. I got out of that position as quickly as a I could (about nine months).

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This entire narrative was proven beyond a shadow of a doubt to be a fake news lie perpetuated by leftist media.

Anyone here who states that ICE agents were "whipping" the illegal, law breaking criminal invaders is a liar.

Maybe people here should be upset that the media is allowed to push propaganda and lie purposely with zero repercussions for doing so.

Media's 'fact-checkers' avoid false narrative Border Patrol agents 'whipped' Haitian migrants
The Washington Post, CNN, NBC, AP, USA Today, Snopes all failed to address the widespread falsehood

https://www.foxnews.com/media/fact-checkers-border-patrol-haitian-migrants-whip-horseback

1 Reply

@ManOfTruth,

Here's the thing about that though.

No one is disputing the agents did, in fact, have whips to round up Haitian migrants. Not even you. The photographer from your own posted article is quoted "Paul Ratje, the photographer behind the pictures told KTSM, the NBC affiliate in El Paso, Texas, that he and his colleagues never saw anyone get whipped. "I’ve never seen them whip anyone," Ratje said. "He was swinging it, but it can be misconstrued when you’re looking at the picture."

So I ask you, what was the purpose of having whips in the first place?

Are the agents in a rodeo, paid to lasso cattle? Or are they circus performers, wanting specific animals to step up onto a platform? Who gave that type of weapon choice to the agents to begin with? It's not a serious, well regarded, thought out plan at all.

Whips have long been associated with keeping black skinned people under control. The only reason agents had whips was to instill fear and intimidation. It's not like whips are really going to incapacitate a fleeing person. It's just going to piss someone off to the extent they'll fight back.

Maybe that was the intention of the Border Agents. Make "them" fight back, to provocate and escalate the situation. Of all the ways and tools at Border Patrol's disposal, whips should not have been utilized. Period.

That's the truth that needs exposed.

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Those wannabe cowboy ICE-holes on the southern border

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