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Time to put up or shut up; Upd: Coverup Continues

 
 
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 01:21 pm
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/06/19/MNG0NDB1GU1.DTL&feed=rss.news

Quote:
San Francisco Chronicle
Pentagon to release new abuse photos
The Abu Ghraib images will mask victims' identities

Eric Rosenberg, Hearst Newspapers

Sunday, June 19, 2005


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Washington -- The Pentagon is preparing to release another batch of photos showing prisoner abuse at the Abu Ghraib prison near Baghdad, a step that is likely to renew criticism of U.S. handling of detainees there.

As many as 144 photos and still images from four videotapes could be made public in coming weeks, as soon as the Pentagon finishes editing them to conceal the identify of the victims.

The digital photos are from the same batch amassed by Army Spc. Joseph Darby, who was based at Abu Ghraib. Darby turned the photos over to military investigators last year.

Later, some photos showing naked Iraqi prisoners being forced to simulate sex acts were broadcast and published. The ensuing controversy triggered wide criticism of U.S. policies on handling prisoners at Abu Ghraib and other military prisons.

A federal judge in New York on June 2 ordered the government to prepare to release the rest of the Darby photos in response to a lawsuit filed by the American Civil Liberties Union under the Freedom of Information Act. In pressing for release of the pictures, the ACLU contends that prisoner abuse was more widespread than the Bush administration has acknowledged.

"We think that the public has a right to this information," said Amrit Singh, staff counsel at the ACLU.

As part of its lawsuit, which also seeks documents pertaining to the detention center at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, the ACLU wants to "create a system of accountability for the abuses that happened in the name of the American people and to hold accountable high-ranking officials," Singh said. The government has already released some 36,000 pages of documentation in response to the lawsuit, but the images would be the first to be made public.

Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld has said repeatedly that only a handful of low-level Army troops were involved in the abuse. The abuses "took place on one shift in Abu Ghraib -- not the shift before, not the shift after, but on one shift," Rumsfeld reiterated this month, adding: "As a result, dozens of people have been prosecuted and are being punished, as they should be."

To date, eight soldiers have pleaded guilty or been convicted at court- martial in the scandal. Despite the findings of several military reviews pointing out flaws in the operation of military prisons, no military or civilian personnel at the highest levels of the military chain of command have charges brought against them.

In issuing his order, U.S. District Court Judge Alvin Hellerstein of New York City gave the government until June 30 to get the photos ready by removing information in the pictures that might identify the victims. The judge said the photographs "are the best evidence the public can have of what occurred" at Abu Ghraib.

David Kelley, the U.S. attorney for the Southern District of New York, has asked Hellerstein for an extension -- until July 22 -- to get all the images, both video and pictures, ready for release. He said the Army's Criminal Investigation Crime Lab was currently processing the videos frame by frame.


July 22nd. I haven't been able to find any news about this actually being released today.

I can recall reading a Sy Hersh article talking about what kind of stuff we can expect to see in these photos, and while I'm not looking forward to actually SEEING them, I believe it is important for the American people to be told the truth!

So, it's time for the Administration and the Pentagon to put up or shut up; either comply with the court order, or don't, and deal with the firestorm that will come their way for openly defying American law.

It will be interesting to see how this turns out, neh?

Cycloptichorn
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woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 01:27 pm
This is ancient history!!
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 01:29 pm
Like 9/11, you mean?
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 01:29 pm
No, it isn't.

Things that happened a year or two ago are not 'ancient history.'

Things that have been hidden, and then are released, are not 'ancient history.'

But, nice try at the Dismissal Defense; I doubt it will fly.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 01:31 pm
(note, I don't think they are comparable in terms of scale -- but if something bad happened, the passage of a few years does not mean that it can or should be forgotten... as we are often reminded by politicians re: 9/11.)
0 Replies
 
woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 01:57 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
No, it isn't.

Things that happened a year or two ago are not 'ancient history.'

Things that have been hidden, and then are released, are not 'ancient history.'

But, nice try at the Dismissal Defense; I doubt it will fly.

Cycloptichorn


This is re-hasing the same sh!t we have seen and heard about for 2 years. What is it going to show? More scumbags with bra's on their heads?

Nothing new here.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 02:14 pm
You really, really need to read this:

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?040510fa_fact

I think the remaining pictures are not good. Not good at all.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 03:10 pm
bm

and agree with cyclo - successfully hiding and suppressing something for years doesnt ever make it "ancient history"
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 03:51 pm
Some people get off on torture porno.

There's nothing to be gained from seeing pictures of crap that's been reported.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 03:53 pm
Apparently the supression will go on longer.

Quote:
On July 22, the Center for Constitutional Rights (CCR) denounced the latest efforts of the Bush Administration to block the release of the Darby photos and videos depicting torture at Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison facility. On June 2, 2004, CCR, along with the ACLU, Physicians for Human Rights, Veterans for Common Sense, and Veterans for Peace filed papers with the U.S. District Court, charging the Department of Defense and other government agencies with illegally withholding records concerning the abuse of detainees in American military custody. Since then, the organizations have been repeatedly rebuffed in their efforts to investigate what happened at the prison.

In June, the government requested and received an extension from the judge stating that they needed time in order to redact the faces of the men, women and children believed to be shown in the photographs and videos. They were given until today to produce the images, but at the eleventh hour filed a motion to oppose the release of the photos and videos, based on an entirely new argument: they are now requesting a 7(F) exemption from disclosure under the Freedom of Information Act to withhold law enforcement-related information in order to protect the physical safety of individuals. Today's move is the latest in a series of attempts by the government to keep the images from being made public and to cover up the torture of detainees in U.S. custody around the world.


http://www.ccr-ny.org/v2/reports/report.asp?ObjID=imOUU2rj8m&Content=608

I knew it. I knew they wouldn't turn them over.

Note that the article specifically says men, women, and children. That right there will tell you why the Bush administration will continue to flout the Law and coverup what has been done in our name.

Despicable!

Cycloptichorn

ps what a lame excuse as well. "for their protection." makes me want to f*cking puke
0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 04:24 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Apparently the supression will go on longer.

Quote:
On July 22, the Center for Constitutional Rights (CCR) denounced the latest efforts of the Bush Administration to block the release of the Darby photos and videos depicting torture at Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison facility. On June 2, 2004, CCR, along with the ACLU, Physicians for Human Rights, Veterans for Common Sense, and Veterans for Peace filed papers with the U.S. District Court, charging the Department of Defense and other government agencies with illegally withholding records concerning the abuse of detainees in American military custody. Since then, the organizations have been repeatedly rebuffed in their efforts to investigate what happened at the prison.

In June, the government requested and received an extension from the judge stating that they needed time in order to redact the faces of the men, women and children believed to be shown in the photographs and videos. They were given until today to produce the images, but at the eleventh hour filed a motion to oppose the release of the photos and videos, based on an entirely new argument: they are now requesting a 7(F) exemption from disclosure under the Freedom of Information Act to withhold law enforcement-related information in order to protect the physical safety of individuals. Today's move is the latest in a series of attempts by the government to keep the images from being made public and to cover up the torture of detainees in U.S. custody around the world.


http://www.ccr-ny.org/v2/reports/report.asp?ObjID=imOUU2rj8m&Content=608

I knew it. I knew they wouldn't turn them over.

Note that the article specifically says men, women, and children. That right there will tell you why the Bush administration will continue to flout the Law and coverup what has been done in our name.

Despicable!

Cycloptichorn

ps what a lame excuse as well. "for their protection." makes me want to f*cking puke


It amuses me to see your anger over something like this but on nothing else on this war on terror. Sure you have said many times how you are not happy about the bombings but have shown no real emotion about it.

Today the London police shot and killed a suspect in the latest bombings. Did you cheer at all about it or did you feel more pity for the guy who was killed.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 04:25 pm
Lash wrote:
There's nothing to be gained from seeing pictures of crap that's been reported.

The idea here of course is that the pictures are likely to show things that have not been reported yet. Which is probably exactly why the administration wants to keep a lid on it.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 04:28 pm
Baldimo wrote:
It amuses me to see your anger over something like this but on nothing else on this war on terror.

Yeah I mean, how amusing, someone who gets all upset at a bunch of suspects, many of whom ended up never being accused of anything, being tortured by his own country's soldiers. What a pussy, huh? Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 04:31 pm
And of course also, everyone knows that our resident shrink Baldimo can tell exactly when you're really angry - and when you're just saying many times you're sad, but are in fact "showing no real emotion".

Talented, he is, like that - and all just on the basis of a bunch of internet posts and everything!
0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 04:40 pm
nimh wrote:
And of course also, everyone knows that our resident shrink Baldimo can tell exactly when you're really angry - and when you're just saying many times you're sad, but are in fact "showing no real emotion".

Talented, he is, like that - and all just on the basis of a bunch of internet posts and everything!


Word usage is very telling abut someone. Aparently you all thik I'm a racist just from a few posts. Funny isn't it. Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 05:23 pm
Racist? Where the hell does race come in, here?
0 Replies
 
Scorpia
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 05:42 pm
"Some people get off on torture porno."

That's the one thing I'm NOT proud of our military for.
0 Replies
 
goodfielder
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 06:55 pm
I would have thought that the continuing cover-up was bad politics. It's an old saw in politics but the coverup is usually worse than the action trying to be covered up. The best thing would have been for the administration to release everything in one fell swoop. Sure people would have gagged but eventually - unless we're really strange - we get sick of it and ignore it, turn it off, try to block it from our minds and then take comfort in the fact of its exposure and that it will be corrected. Stringing it out only causes greater damage.

On the plus side one would hope the exposure means that it isn't happening now.

And another more positive thought. At least the rule of law is still in place.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jul, 2005 11:34 pm
It's important to tear the scab of this wound because some of the terrorists are losing their zeal. The left wants to be sure they keep their bloodlust up by making this an issue again.

What other reason could there be for the timing and push for this?
0 Replies
 
goodfielder
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jul, 2005 07:17 am
McGentrix wrote:
It's important to tear the scab of this wound because some of the terrorists are losing their zeal. The left wants to be sure they keep their bloodlust up by making this an issue again.

What other reason could there be for the timing and push for this?


Dunno McG but I do know this - politics should be about what can be done for a nation, not what can be done to it.
0 Replies
 
 

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