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How does one PROVE that SELF is an illusion?

 
 
Jasper10
 
  1  
Reply Fri 21 May, 2021 08:02 am
@Leadfoot,
I deliberately didn’t mention Gravity for now...however gravity must have a role to play in psychological interactions .....there must be science correlations that can prove this.

The electromagnetic force is a combination of 3 forces interacting....this is a stance that I am comfortable with.

My view is that all sciences are interconnected......therefore all sciences need to get their heads together .....without bias.
Jasper10
 
  1  
Reply Fri 21 May, 2021 08:32 am
@Jasper10,
Is it not the case that we all need an electrical force to interact with a magnetic force to produce a movement force and thus a gravitational force is produced?....otherwise we wouldn’t be having these conversations here on planet earth....actually that’s 4 interacting forces not 3.....my math is terrible ...I’ll leave the math to htam9876...
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Fri 21 May, 2021 11:17 am
@Jasper10,
Quote:
Is it not the case that we all need an electrical force to interact with a magnetic force to produce a movement force and thus a gravitational force is produced?.
It is not. That is gibberish on at least a couple of levels.

Go look up the term 'gold leaf electroscope'. It’s a relatively ancient instrument for showing electrostatic force. You can see it with the naked eye. It works without a trace of either magnetism or gravity.

And where the hell did you get the idea that the electromotive force has ANYTHING to do with gravity? As far as we know it doesn’t, but if you can show how it does, you got a Nobel in the bag.

But are you just telling us your articles of faith/hope? That’s cool if so but you shouldn’t present it as accepted by mainstream science. It makes religion look stupid. Which it often is, but that’s a different thing.
Jasper10
 
  1  
Reply Fri 21 May, 2021 12:42 pm
@Leadfoot,
Gibberish...ok ...well let’s wait and see on that one.....I did put a ? after my statement....also main stream science stating electromagnetic force is a single force?...well yeah ok ....lol...let’s wait and see on that one as well shall we....mainstream science has a lot to learn as well don’t forget.
Jasper10
 
  1  
Reply Fri 21 May, 2021 01:35 pm
@Jasper10,
One thing is sure....mainstream science is lost....why? because it has no understanding of consciousness types and doesn’t yet accept PRESENCE or SELF.

Mainstream science is a “prisoner of consciousness” and has no AWARENESS that this is case.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Fri 21 May, 2021 01:53 pm
@Jasper10,
I would put it as 'the mainstream understanding of science is 'lost'.' Many actually believe that there is some rule in science that negates the possibility of 'God'. Some of them are actually 'scientists'.
Jasper10
 
  1  
Reply Fri 21 May, 2021 03:54 pm
@Leadfoot,
If mainstream science was honest it would consider ALL logic possibilities with equal merit/diligence rather than just half until definitive proof was found.

This is sadly not the case with mainstream science at present, it is biased and only accepts 0,1...1,0 logic as we know.

Is that sound science?.......No it isn’t.....
0 Replies
 
htam9876
 
  1  
Reply Fri 21 May, 2021 10:55 pm
@Jasper10,
“there are two types of thought interaction:
1.The STILL interaction.
2.The MOVEMENT interaction.”

Yes, no matter STILL or MOVEMENT, charges exist, electrical interaction exists.
Actually in piggy’s unit charge model, charge is directly reflected by the spiral chirality (SELF) of the physical structure, which would not change in MOVEMENT / different reference frame.
Obviously the wave characteristic aspect of electrical interaction is the “MOVEMENT interaction”. The result of the integration (the charge) of that equation flips following the inversion of space, which has no contradiction with the analysis with the spiral curve: chirality flips following the inversion of space. This is the key point. But it doesn’t mean that charge or interaction only exist in MOVEMENT.
Perhaps, the wave characteristic of electrical interaction is only the property of the “MOVEMENT interaction”.
htam9876
 
  2  
Reply Fri 21 May, 2021 11:06 pm
@Leadfoot,
“The Electromagnetic Force is only considered to be ONE of the forces, not two, but that always made me suspicious.”
Fun…The fact is that the “mainstream” always considers it as “Electromagnetic” / the “ONE”. But they seems not yet able to explain why “ONE” explicitly.

Once upon a time, it made piggy suspicious too. haha…

Actually we can be AWARE of a bit about it in philosophy first:
Gravity as well as electric force can do work to a proton, while the Lorentz force would not. So, in logic, magnetism is not such a “normal” force as gravity or electric force.
0 Replies
 
Jasper10
 
  1  
Reply Sat 22 May, 2021 09:34 am
@htam9876,
Wow!!!...what appears to be just ONE definitive proof of a correlation between science and philosophy/psychology ..... So item 2. thought interaction i.e. MIND MOVEMENT interaction results in a flip in charge.This is exactly what is experienced in this type of thought interaction....The individual does “toggle”/“flip” consciousness (+/-) state....I would say that your last sentence is correct......the wave characteristic of electrical interaction is only the property of the “MIND MOVEMENT interaction”
Jasper10
 
  1  
Reply Sat 22 May, 2021 09:54 am
@Jasper10,
With regard to consciousness types and thought interaction (STILL or MOVEMENT interaction) ...I have previously mentioned the swinging pendulum with a fixed point (fulcrum...hence 0,1...1,0 logic)...I think we also need to consider the “see saw” which also has a fixed point (fulcrum ...hence...0,0....0,1...1,0...1,1 logic).

Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sat 22 May, 2021 12:16 pm
True that. Ever seen two equal weight kids stuck on a see saw?

In electronics we call it the meta state problem.
Jasper10
 
  1  
Reply Mon 24 May, 2021 06:54 am
@Leadfoot,
A problem?...well ....not in philosophy it isn't.

The "see saw" philosophy is associated with (0,0...0,1...1,0...1,1) logic possibilities and one can come into an AWARENESS of the "STILL" consciousness state.........which is different to "pendulum" philosophy which is associated with "MIND MOVEMENT" consciousness states.....i.e. related to (0,1..,1,0 logic possibilities).……

One needs to learn to get control of CONSCIOUSNESS states.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Mon 24 May, 2021 08:35 am
@Jasper10,
Quote:
A problem?...well ....not in philosophy it isn't.

Especially in philosophy.
Jasper10
 
  1  
Reply Mon 24 May, 2021 09:46 am
@Leadfoot,
Well I grant you.....it is a major problem for Philosophy AND Science if it continues to choose ONLY (0,1..1,0 logic possibilities).

Jasper10
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 May, 2021 03:32 am
@Jasper10,
Lets be clear here most present day Science AND Philosophy only accepts 0,1...1,0 logic possibilities...WITHOUT definitive proof of those possibilities...Probabilities of evidences claiming a bias one way or the other are TOTALLY irrelevant because one needs a START/END point to be able to give a definitive probability. The START/END points are not known!!!!

Definitive carnal PROOF is therefore a "red herring" and always has been.

One has no option but to accept ALL logic output possibilities of 0,0...0,1...1,0...1,1.

Unless most modern day Philosophy/Science accepts this it WILL remain trapped a "prisoner of consciousness"....PERIOD.

Adopting 0,1...1,0 logic possibilities only is NOT sound philosophy/science.
0 Replies
 
htam9876
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 May, 2021 06:20 pm
@Jasper10,
No matter in STILLNESS or in MOVEMENT, the spiral chirality (SELF) would not change: left handed is left handed; right handed is right handed.
In classical electromagnetism, no matter in STILLNESS or in MOVEMENT, charge would not change: positive is positive; negative is negative.
The significance is “charge is directly reflected by the spiral chirality (SELF) of the physical structure, which would not change in MOVEMENT / different reference frame” in piggy’s unit charge model as piggy said ahead.

Perhaps the wave characteristic of electrical interaction is only the property of the “MOVEMENT interaction”. The key point is the result of the integration (the charge) of that equation flips following the inversion of space, which has no contradiction with the analysis with the spiral curve: chirality flips following the inversion of space. “Coincidence” again?

Actually a complete wave function has another part of energy – time (Et). For simplicity sake, piggy omitted this part in the unit charge model.
In STILL interaction, the wave function degrades to be Ψ(t ) =(1/r)sinEt. The intensity of the STILL interaction is also ∝ 1/r. The fact in classical electromagnetism is the intensity of the electric field of charged particle ∝ 1/r. Coincidence again?

A question might be whether time associated with 4D space can flip too? Once upon a time, in the era of (sub)consciousness, some people (perhaps including piggy himself) used to speculate physics casually depending on the consciousness or speculate physics in math game. Now, in the new era, we can resort to the philosophy of the PRESENCE and SELF to judge whether a conjecture is reasonable or not. As piggy illustrated in the physics thread, the frequency of light reflects time; as piggy illustrated in the unit charge model in the “anti matter” thread, “anti particle” is the flipping of the spiral chirality while the frequency of light actually can remain unchanged. So, piggy’s humble opinion hereby is that “for the anti particle, time is also t rather than -t”. In the new era, we should not sacrifice the true physical meaning of the PRESENCE and SELF for delicate / perfect mathematical model. haha

Philosophy, physics and math are all interconnected here. SELF in control.
…………………………………………………………………….
“One SELF two aspects” is the “Electromagnetic” / the “ONE”.

A new model for neutron, the “core” will join in the fun too.

Put aside the chirality, that’s the issue of gravity and the dynamic.

And the mechanism of formation of matter vs the origin of cosmos is absolutely the affair of PRESENCE. It is at least “equal weight” with something else (some other theories).

Moreover, seems the PRESENCE has another “uncertain” aspect (non standing wave) too, to which piggy is toggling between “give it up” and “can’t give it up”.

“At the end of the tail”, why?
………………………………………
Piggy’s heath and mental situation is getting worst, due to suffering terrible and overall dark sanction of the First Order for so many years. Piggy now suffers serious anxiety neurosis. Piggy almost forgot the knowledge of math. Fortunately, the thought in philosophy is still ok at present. Piggy dies hard. Actually, most of my time is spent on worrying about the safety and prospect of my family members.
Piggy really doesn’t know when the First Order would decide to shout “execute”, and then piggy will disappear in this cosmos for ever.
给他江门地方黑恶势力钟永康集团及新会一中九一四班谁谁一个超文革赛阎王光荣称号快快全世界全宇宙打靶啦。当今时代,全世界没有什么人能够值得如此殊荣。呵呵
htam9876
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 May, 2021 06:32 pm
@Jasper10,
Piggy is STILL on the FULCRUM while that “authentic” rabbit Dandan “still” bungee bungee on the pendulum. Full logic. High five!
Jasper10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 May, 2021 04:13 am
@htam9876,
With regard to your statement

.....Piggy is STILL on the FULCRUM while that “authentic” rabbit Dandan “still” bungee bungee on the pendulum...….

An interesting philosophical question that SELF is presently discussing with PRESENCE is...….

When SELF experiences the "toggling"/bungee bungee.....is this toggling between the FULCRUM (STILL) and the end of the PENDULUM (MOVEMENT) ?? or is it a "toggling"/bungee bungee experienced by SELF who is hanging on sometimes desperately to the end of the PENDULUM as it swings backwards and forwards (ANXIETY) ??…..a "prisoner of consciousness types"??

Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 May, 2021 05:36 am
@htam9876,
Quote:
Actually, most of my time is spent on worrying about the safety and prospect of my family members.

Piggy really doesn’t know when the First Order would decide to shout “execute”, and then piggy will disappear in this cosmos for ever.

In order not to worry, it helps greatly when you realize who First Order is.
 

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