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Natalie Holloway Case

 
 
Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Jul, 2005 05:38 pm
New Mexico Ranks #1 in Crime

North Dakota Once Again is Safest


Quote:

Joining New Mexico at the top of the rankings list (in descending order) were Florida, Nevada, Louisiana and Maryland. On the safer end of the rankings scale immediately preceding the North Dakota were New Hampshire, Maine, South Dakota and Vermont.
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boomerang
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Jul, 2005 06:00 pm
North Dakota. Vacation paradise!

I'm sure that tourism is a great part, if not the largest part, of Florida economy.

I think when something happens outside of your own country it is always scarrier - different laws, different system, you don't know what to expect, you might not speak the language, and so on.

A while back there was a big hub-bub in our papers where an Oregonian had been arrested for murder on some island paradise along with a couple of locals. He was eventually released for lack of evidence -- after spending a few years in jail.

I'm a bit fuzzy on the details I'll have to see if I can find out a bit more. It reminds me a lot of this Natalie Holloway case.
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ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Jul, 2005 06:21 pm
Ah. Well. I am a little amazed by the vehemence of Debra's responce, but grant her the right to it. You should/will certainly not vacation on Aruba, Debra.

I won't vacation there, not because I am not interested in Aruba, but I am older, don't have a lot of money, and am very selective re where I can spend money for flights for - and I choose ... cities that are exciting to me for their history, architecture, and culture including present day culture - and they happen to have some lurking danger.. Different views with different people.

On the Holloway case, I admit to interest in how it all happened.
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ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Jul, 2005 06:31 pm
I should add that I lived for a quarter century a few blocks, ok, ten or twelve, but once, about four blocks.. from the heart of Sholine Crips and V13 territory. Myself and neighbors were fine.

A lot of homicidal crime has to do with internecine rivalry and family or relationship angers. Tourists in much of the world's tourist spots are mainly subjected to robbery/muggings. In the US, that can be pulsed up because of the heavy distribution of serious weapons and drugs.
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edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Jul, 2005 08:17 pm
Duct tape with blond hair on it was found on a beach across the island from where she was last seen. It will be sent away for testing.
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bart
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jul, 2005 04:50 am
wrong mentality
Dear Debra,

spending a few millions of dollars to the disappearing of one single girl, you just can't call that a 'bungled investigation'. And if you consider the fact that she hasn't been found yet as an excuse not to go anymore on vacation to Aruba, I advise you to stay in your hometown forever, since girls are missing everywhere in the world.
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Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jul, 2005 02:24 pm
I don't care how much money that has been spent searching for "one single girl." We're talking about a very small island and a human being. Perhaps it's acceptable to you to boil Natalee's disappearance down to a cost-benefit analysis and determine that the costs are too great and the benefits ("one single girl") too small, but it's not acceptable to me (nor a lot of other people).

Despite the amount of money that may have been spent searching for Natalee, the fact that they haven't found her alive and have not found a body smacks of FOUL PLAY. Someone got rid of Natalee's body to cover-up a crime and the criminal investigation has been bungled.

You can vacation in Aruba if you want. Are you a single girl? If so, there may be a few boys in Aruba looking to show you a good time. . . .
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Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jul, 2005 02:33 pm
Well it took over a year to find Chandra Levy's body. She is a single girl with a suspected government coverup. I guess you won't be traveling to DC any time.
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Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jul, 2005 02:45 pm
Since when has DC been portrayed as an "island paradise" that depends on tourism for economic prosperity?

An island community that depends on tourism for the bulk of its economic prosperity cannot maintain that prosperity if the tourists must fear falling victim to crime. Until such time as the Aruban authorities solve the mystery of Natalee's disappearance and justice is done for Natalee's family, the Aruban tourist industry can expect to suffer.
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Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jul, 2005 03:08 pm
Debra - my response was to your comment about "…Are you a single girl? If so, there may be a few boys in Aruba looking to show you a good time…." And your comment about FOUL PLAY. As bad as what happened to poor Natalee, FOUL PLAY has occurred in nice quiet towns, in usually safe tourist places and in every other nook and cranny you can think of.

Well the same can be said for almost every where in the world. I really wasn't commenting on whether Aruba is suffering about tourism or not.

I don't know whether or not the investigation has been bungled. There is no way to know at this point in time. If who ever committed this horrific crime, dumped the body (assuming she is murdered - which it appears to be) in the ocean - especially on the opposite side of the island away from the resorts, it would most likely be gone forever. The other side of the island the ocean is extremely rough and unsafe to swim in. There is also an area referred to as the shark feeding grounds - as there are many sharks in the area - I believe this is where a lot of garbage is dumped. Not hard to imagine that a body could be swept out to sea here or eaten by the many sharks.
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Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jul, 2005 03:10 pm
I do expect that Aruba's tourist industry will suffer at least some what. However, by all likelihood it will be short lived. People seem to have short memories about such tragedies.
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Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jul, 2005 03:52 pm
bart wrote:
Dear Debra,

spending a few millions of dollars to the disappearing of one single girl, you just can't call that a 'bungled investigation'. And if you consider the fact that she hasn't been found yet as an excuse not to go anymore on vacation to Aruba, I advise you to stay in your hometown forever, since girls are missing everywhere in the world.


Debra wrote:
I don't care how much money that has been spent searching for "one single girl." We're talking about a very small island and a human being. Perhaps it's acceptable to you to boil Natalee's disappearance down to a cost-benefit analysis and determine that the costs are too great and the benefits ("one single girl") too small, but it's not acceptable to me (nor a lot of other people).

Despite the amount of money that may have been spent searching for Natalee, the fact that they haven't found her alive and have not found a body smacks of FOUL PLAY. Someone got rid of Natalee's body to cover-up a crime and the criminal investigation has been bungled.

You can vacation in Aruba if you want. Are you a single girl? If so, there may be a few boys in Aruba looking to show you a good time. . . .


Linkat wrote:
Well it took over a year to find Chandra Levy's body. She is a single girl with a suspected government coverup. I guess you won't be traveling to DC any time.


Debra wrote:
Since when has DC been portrayed as an "island paradise" that depends on tourism for economic prosperity?

An island community that depends on tourism for the bulk of its economic prosperity cannot maintain that prosperity if the tourists must fear falling victim to crime. Until such time as the Aruban authorities solve the mystery of Natalee's disappearance and justice is done for Natalee's family, the Aruban tourist industry can expect to suffer.


Linkat wrote:
Debra – my response was to your comment about “…Are you a single girl? If so, there may be a few boys in Aruba looking to show you a good time….” And your comment about FOUL PLAY. As bad as what happened to poor Natalee, FOUL PLAY has occurred in nice quiet towns, in usually safe tourist places and in every other nook and cranny you can think of.

Well the same can be said for almost every where in the world. I really wasn’t commenting on whether Aruba is suffering about tourism or not.

I don’t know whether or not the investigation has been bungled. . . .



And, of course, I was responding to bart's comments. Bart said, "spending a few millions of dollars to the disappearing of one single girl, you just can't call that a 'bungled investigation'".

The costly search (in terms of time, money, effort) to find Natalee and the criminal investigation into her disappearance are not the same.

Bart's minimizing of Natalee's disappearance is offensive. According to him, she's just "one single girl" and girls go missing all the time (basically a "so what" attitude and a "don't blame Aruba.")

If Bart wants to minimize Natalee's disappearance, so be it. He can travel to Aruba if he wants to . . . and I'm sure there are a few Arubans available to show him/her a good time. And if he/she disappears . . . so what? He/she is just one single person.

Natalee wasn't vacationing in D.C. or any other place in the world. She was vacationing in Aruba. She disappeared after she left a club in the company of three Aruban residents. These three people have done nothing but lie and change their stories to cover-up what has to be considered foul play.

Like it or not, the eyes of the entire world are on Aruba. If the mystery of Natalee's disappearance is not resolved by Aruban authorities and justice is not done for Natalee's family, I have no doubt that their "island paradise" won't seem so much like a paradise anymore and the Aruban tourist industry will suffer.

I won't go there on vacation . . . but Bart can go.
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wandeljw
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Jul, 2005 07:29 am
The family has now hired a private investigator to find out what happened to Natalee Holloway. This is a sad tragedy. Here in Illinois there was a case where a teenage girl was murdered by the boy who took her to their high school prom.
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Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Jul, 2005 07:42 am
I agree with you Debra that calling Natalee just one single girl is a bit much. You would not consider her just one single girl if she were your daughter. Also money spent does not equate to quality of criminal investigation, however, I don't think we can really say whether the investigation is bungled or not until it is complete. Although I am sure for the family and friends of Natalee that the investigation is taking way too long, it is still actively going on and until we hear the results it is unfair to make a determination on how it was handled.

Also, currently the one person being held so far for her disappearance is not an Aruban, but a Dutch teenager currently staying in Aruba.
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CerealKiller
 
  1  
Reply Thu 21 Jul, 2005 04:32 am
From what I understand, tourism is actually up in Aruba following the Holloway case. I think it's brought the island to the public's eye, and most reasonable people assume (and I agree with them) that if you travel, you can keep yourself safe without too much trouble. The problem (from what I understand) is that this girl just made foolish risks, and it may very well have cost her her life.
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angelar1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Jul, 2005 06:26 am
Why blame Aruba for a mistake Holloway made? It was an unfortunate mistake but, she is the one who wondered off with 3 young men and did not stay with her friends. No one else left with locals just her. It is not fair to place blame on Aruba for her leaving with men she didn't know.
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vaughn15
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Jul, 2005 08:36 am
Sad The sorrow and anguish over not knowing the fate of your loved one has to be one of the most horrific experiences that a family encounters. As a grandmother of two beloved teenagers, I just can't imagine the heartache (and don't want to) should one of them go missing. Granted, Natalie made some terrible choices in going off with young people she did not know against the advice of her fellow classmates and possibly under the influence of an intoxicant. As a result of whomever, this young lady may never be found especially if she landed in shark infested waters or was sold as a sex slave or whatever. I understand that the Prime Minister of Aruba has asked that records on this case be turned over to the FBI; I only wish this had happened sooner. I also find it amazing there was not a single blonde hair found in the vehicle that she purportedly was transported in with the 3 young men. That was one slick clean up job if 'tis so. Just my two cents.
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decaturgurl
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Jul, 2005 09:32 pm
as children we are taught not to go off with strangers. and even in a safe place we know not to go off with strangers. i'm sorry for what is taking place but i do NOT believe aruba should suffer because of natalie's lack of judgement. she chose to get into that vehicle with those guys. we're safe in our communities but we don't jump in cars with strangers, atleast i hope not.
so to blame the aruba government is ludicrous. i would go to aruba. sorry but any place can be considered dangerous if you don't use judgement. i feel sorry for the family but now is the time people should sit down with their families and discuss the dangers of going off with strangers
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angelar1
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jul, 2005 01:18 pm
decaturgurl wrote:
as children we are taught not to go off with strangers. and even in a safe place we know not to go off with strangers. i'm sorry for what is taking place but i do NOT believe aruba should suffer because of natalie's lack of judgement. she chose to get into that vehicle with those guys. we're safe in our communities but we don't jump in cars with strangers, atleast i hope not.
so to blame the aruba government is ludicrous. i would go to aruba. sorry but any place can be considered dangerous if you don't use judgement. i feel sorry for the family but now is the time people should sit down with their families and discuss the dangers of going off with strangers
i totally agree!!!!
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vaughn15
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jul, 2005 02:56 pm
Yes, Natalee made some very bad choices and obviously suffered the ultimate for it. It is also very obvious that not everything was done in the beginning to solve this case so guess what, plenty of time for any forensic evidence to be destroyed, duh. The political clout of the young man's father played a large role in the bungling of this case; the same thing happens here in the U.S. all the time. Then again, what about the foreigners who have committed horrendous crimes in this country that have been given diplomatic immunity; this truly disgusts me.

Natalee was a young girl and like most students was in Aruba for a good time, no matter her choices she did NOT deserve to die.

Nuff said.
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