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Supremes rule against medical marijuana

 
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 12:54 pm
Why don't we just go ahead and ban everything fun?

Sheesh

If you want those banned, I want coffee and refined sugar banned as well; they are just as addictive and harmful.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Bella Dea
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 12:57 pm
McGentrix wrote:
Bella Dea wrote:
McGentrix wrote:
THC impairs judgement, reflex speed, memory and other systems in the body. That's why it is considered a drug.


So does alcohol and that's legal.


That's why it should be banned along with tobacco.


I think pot and tobacco should be legal and alcohol should be illegal. If you wanna kill yourself, go for it. But alcohol makes people do stupid things and you can hurt someone else. You never hear of bar brawls starting because some stoned guy bumped into another stoned guy.
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:02 pm
National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism
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Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:05 pm
Define 'safe.'

Not one has shown it to be 'dangerous,' either. That should tell ya something.

Cycloptichorn
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:09 pm
Is there a classification for drugs that are "not-safe"?
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Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:10 pm
Shrug. I don't know. I guess I intially would say 'illegal,' but there are plenty of drugs which are unsafe, yet legal; look at the wide variety of opiates available, any of which are OD material.

Cycloptichorn
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:17 pm
You mean prescription drugs? I hardly think prescription drugs have any place in this conversation unless you are suggesting that Marijuana should be allowed to be prescribed (the subject of this thread).

A prescription for a drug does not equal legalization.
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Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:18 pm
Interesting. So the only legal drugs are over-the-counter ones, and a doctors scrip is basically a license to buy an illegal substance?

Cycloptichorn
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:21 pm
That would be why you need a prescription.
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Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:24 pm
Interesting. I wasn't under the impression that controlled substances such as prescription drugs were illegal per se, but I now see where you are going.

But, back to the opiates question: SInce many opiates frankly ARE unsafe, prescription or not, does that qualify as an 'unsafe' drug? One where use could kill ya? Marijuana certainly isn't in that category.

Cycloptichorn
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nimh
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:25 pm
McGentrix wrote:

I'd be interested in seeing how many deaths are caused annually by obesity and the health problems it causes (like cigarettes cause cancer, obesity causes ...)

.. and what we deduce from that in relation to the logic of McG's argument (ban McDonalds?)...

Then again, lack of movement also causes many diseases and thus, death (so perhaps also legal sanctions against not moving enough?) ...

etcetera
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:28 pm
Opiates, when used as prescribed, are very safe and very effective. It's when they are abused or used recreationally they become unsafe. Same with most drugs.
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Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:28 pm
But, not Marijuana apparently...

Cycloptichorn
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Scorpia
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:34 pm
Apparantly. Because we saw the quotable statistics for alcohol, cigarettes....but after 7,000 studies of marijuana the "unsafe" factors are: slows reaction, judgement impairments, etc. It seems that my over the counter cough medicine causes the same thing - at it's prescribed dose. Ever take Nyquil?
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 01:45 pm
nimh wrote:
McGentrix wrote:

I'd be interested in seeing how many deaths are caused annually by obesity and the health problems it causes (like cigarettes cause cancer, obesity causes ...)

.. and what we deduce from that in relation to the logic of McG's argument (ban McDonalds?)...

Then again, lack of movement also causes many diseases and thus, death (so perhaps also legal sanctions against not moving enough?) ...

etcetera


Changing the topic Nimh? How about we actually stick to the one being discussed...
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Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 02:33 pm
McGentrix wrote:
There have been over 7,000 published scientific and medical studies documenting the damage that marijuana poses. Not one study has shown marijuana to be safe.

Yes, but it's fun. Many fun things aren't safe, and it would be horrible if the government had the license to outlaw all of them. I can decide for myself how much care I want to take for my health. I need neither Congress, nor the Supreme Court, nor the Drug Enforcement Agency to do it for me. I also have a funny feeling that you agree with this, and that you only argue against Marijuana to annoy some liberals. Wink
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 02:38 pm
Thomas wrote:
McGentrix wrote:
There have been over 7,000 published scientific and medical studies documenting the damage that marijuana poses. Not one study has shown marijuana to be safe.

Yes, but it's fun. Many fun things aren't safe, and it would be horrible if the government had the license to outlaw all of them. I can decide for myself how much care I want to take for my health. I need neither Congress, nor the Supreme Court, nor the Drug Enforcement Agency to do it for me. I also have a funny feeling that you agree with this, and that you only argue against Marijuana to annoy some liberals. Wink


Yes, you and I do, but little Johnny in middle school does not. It's bad enough they have access to cigarettes, a legal drug, but do we need them smoking dope as well?

I know the counter argument is that it's already in the schools, but imagine how much worse it could be if it were as readily available as tobacco is? I do not want a generation of stoners.
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Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 02:50 pm
McGentrix wrote:
Yes, you and I do, but little Johnny in middle school does not. It's bad enough they have access to cigarettes, a legal drug, but do we need them smoking dope as well?

No, but I don't see why Johnny in middle school should be the benchmark for what's appropriate to sell to grown-ups. I can agree to a minimum age for legal drug use, but not a general ban based on what's appropriate for children.

McGentrix wrote:
I know the counter argument is that it's already in the schools, but imagine how much worse it could be if it were as readily available as tobacco is? I do not want a generation of stoners.

Neither do I, and if criminal law was the only way of enforcing moderation in drug usage, I might agree with you. But it isn't. After travelling through Europe observing a variety of regimes with regard to alcohol across different countries, my impression is that liberal laws on alcohol (as in our romantic countries) yield much more attractive results than the tough laws they have in Scandinavia. For example, it is common in Italy to have a glass of wine with your lunch, even if you're a teenager. But being drunk is frowned upon, and I observe it much more rarely in Italy than I do in Sweden. I made similar observations at college, where smoking pot was well-received but perpetual stoners were written off as losers. The result was a climate in which many people smoked pot, but few people abused it.

Based on all these observations, I oppose tough drug laws, whatever the drug in question.
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 02:57 pm
I'll just point out that the US is not Europe. The customs are not the same and the laws are not the same.

If you've ever been around kids in schools in the US, you know there is enough illegal drug activity that we do not need to introduce the leading gateway drug as a legal alternative. For anyone.

Of course I am referring to the legalization, not the prescription.
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Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2005 02:59 pm
The 'gateway drug' idea is bull.

And unsubstantiated bull, at that. There is little evidence that Marijuana is a gateway drug any more than alcohol or cigarettes or even caffiene or sugar.

My experiences have been summed up by Thomas quite nicely.

Cycloptichorn
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