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Bernie Sanders First to Sign Pledge to Rally Behind Democratic Nominee.

 
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  4  
Reply Fri 6 Mar, 2020 08:59 pm
@RABEL222,
No doubt in my mind. There's a reason Trump wants to run against Bernie and that Putin set the troll farms to boost Bernie.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  4  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2020 03:16 pm
Bernie’s gonna start “rallying” behind Biden any minute now. I can just feel it.
livinglava
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2020 05:29 pm
@snood,
snood wrote:

Bernie’s gonna start “rallying” behind Biden any minute now. I can just feel it.

How many of Bernie's supporters are sheep that can be herded over to Biden by Bernie, do you suppose?
snood
 
  2  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2020 06:33 pm
@livinglava,
livinglava wrote:

snood wrote:

Bernie’s gonna start “rallying” behind Biden any minute now. I can just feel it.

How many of Bernie's supporters are sheep that can be herded over to Biden by Bernie, do you suppose?


I don’t “suppose” on that, either way. It may even be possible they choose to support or not support, with no “herding” involved.

And I wasn’t talking about them. I was talking about Bernie.
livinglava
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2020 07:33 pm
@snood,
snood wrote:

livinglava wrote:

snood wrote:

Bernie’s gonna start “rallying” behind Biden any minute now. I can just feel it.

How many of Bernie's supporters are sheep that can be herded over to Biden by Bernie, do you suppose?


I don’t “suppose” on that, either way. It may even be possible they choose to support or not support, with no “herding” involved.

And I wasn’t talking about them. I was talking about Bernie.

Obviously Bernie can vote however he wants in November (or later as the case may be)

But what you are implying about him signing a pledge to support Biden is that he has power to cause other votes that would go to him to go to Biden.

That implies that he can rustle up his supporters and corral them to vote for Biden.

My point was that you are assuming Bernie's voters can be corralled by Bernie, and they may just go ahead and vote for him anyway no matter what kinds of pledges he signs or advice he gives.

People who vote for third candidates are tired of two-party politics, so they are trying to make the history books with a significant minority, not transfer their votes to achieve a majority for someone they don't want.
snood
 
  2  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2020 07:54 pm
@livinglava,
I didn’t imply ****. You inferred a hell of a lot. Bernie was first to sign a pledge to support the nominee. My post was making fun of the fact that he’s going to drag his feet about supporting the nominee. If you want to speculate about who he’s dragging along or whatever, don’t project all that speculation on me. I was commenting on Bernie because he’s too damn full of himself to get the hell off the stage, concede with grace, and uphold the ******* pledge he signed with all that fanfare. That is all I’m saying, and that is all I mean.
livinglava
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2020 09:02 pm
@snood,
snood wrote:

I didn’t imply ****. You inferred a hell of a lot. Bernie was first to sign a pledge to support the nominee. My post was making fun of the fact that he’s going to drag his feet about supporting the nominee.

When you talk about him "supporting the nominee," do you mean with just his own vote, or do you mean by getting others to vote as well because of his support/endorsement?

Quote:
If you want to speculate about who he’s dragging along or whatever, don’t project all that speculation on me. I was commenting on Bernie because he’s too damn full of himself to get the hell off the stage, concede with grace, and uphold the ******* pledge he signed with all that fanfare. That is all I’m saying, and that is all I mean.

What is there for him to 'concede with grace?' The primaries are just primaries. If people want to vote for him in November, they can and will.

Conceding is something you do in an election where the winner actually gets a job/office. At that point you have something to concede. As far as conceding to be the Democratic party nominee, ok he can do that but it doesn't mean anyone has to vote for Biden.

It sounds like what you want him to do is take his name off the ballot by not running as a 3rd party candidate. If he does that, maybe his supporters will end up voting for Biden, idk. I guess it depends on how much they want to risk the Democrats gaining power over the house of representatives and white house simultaneously, and what kind of effects they expect that would have on the world.

There's a lot of talk about "anything is better than Trump," but is a world where the Democratic party has the power of executive order what Sanders supporters really want? And if not, why should they vote for that just because they don't like Trump?

0 Replies
 
Olivier5
 
  3  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2020 01:46 am
@snood,
Quote:
Campaign manager Faiz Shakir said in an email to supporters that ... after Sanders votes Wednesday in the Senate, "Bernie and Jane are going to get on a plane back to Vermont. Once there, they'll begin holding conversations with supporters to get input and assess the path forward for our campaign. We will keep you updated as those conversations progress."


I guess you'll have to show a little more patience. The good news is it won't kill you.
snood
 
  4  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2020 07:03 am
@Olivier5,
Oh, I can wait just as well as the next person. You’ll forgive me if, while we all wait for Bernie to announce his intentions, I’m not under the same delusion as his followers that the delay has anything to do with the best interests of the nation.

Olivier5
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2020 09:40 am
@snood,
Questioning people's intentions or motive is not something I do frequently.
0 Replies
 
revelette3
 
  3  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2020 10:21 am
@snood,
Bernie Sanders probably thinks he can get more concessions at the convention (if we have one) if he remains in the race as he did in 2016, plus he probably doesn't want to disappoint his base. They would turn on him like a pack of wild rabid dogs if dropped out one second before he has to drop out.

I don't think it matters one way or another, I think the democrats have already made up their minds. How it all turns out with Trump, who knows? I sure don't. Never would have thought Hillary would have lost, but she did. However, since Biden did get a good amount of votes in places like Michigan and Missouri and Biden is not hated like Hillary was, I am somewhat more hopeful than I was.
livinglava
 
  0  
Reply Thu 19 Mar, 2020 10:50 am
@revelette3,
revelette3 wrote:

Bernie Sanders probably thinks he can get more concessions at the convention (if we have one) if he remains in the race as he did in 2016, plus he probably doesn't want to disappoint his base. They would turn on him like a pack of wild rabid dogs if dropped out one second before he has to drop out.

I don't think it matters one way or another, I think the democrats have already made up their minds. How it all turns out with Trump, who knows? I sure don't. Never would have thought Hillary would have lost, but she did. However, since Biden did get a good amount of votes in places like Michigan and Missouri and Biden is not hated like Hillary was, I am somewhat more hopeful than I was.

Think of government as having the job of representing as many different points of view as possible in a way that doesn't erupt into war.

To facilitate constructive discourse, or at least to attempt to, they have to move different views around parties and different parties around different offices. Sometimes the GOP is the opposition and sometimes the Democrats are. Taking turns as the opposition causes them to develop their ideologies and prerogatives in a different way than if they were in the White House dealing with the other party in the opposition.

For every asymmetry that happens in government, there is going to be a corresponding asymmetry that favors the other party. So, for example, B Clinton had a Democrat congress to work with his first term, and the Dems took advantage of it to pass a lot of legislation. Then, the GOP took over the congress during his second term and eventually produced the Contract with America, got GW Bush elected, and then that party had a strong position and less opposition.

So really what needs to happen is that some form of balanced governmental formation needs to emerge/evolve where the two parties work together and honor their differences instead of always just trying to subvert them. It's like there needs to be a ceasefire in a war where one party or the other doesn't take advantage of the ceasefire to develop underground tactics to subvert the other party covertly while pretending on the surface to be getting along.

Real democracy is about respecting each others' views and differences as an inevitability of freedom of religion/speech/culture. But since there are differences/conflicts that can't be respected and honored for whatever reason, we have to keep struggling for common ground where doing so is practically guaranteed to be useless/fruitless.

Probably Trump will stay in the White House for another four years, though; and if he doesn't and the house remains leftist, there will be a lot of conflict with the senate and supreme court, and a lot of bad blood will result from putting the GOP through the misery of taking all those executive orders to court to get the supreme court to revoke them. Whatever is achieved by executive order will be subject to later retribution, as is happening now vis-a-vis all the executive-order work that was done by the Obama administration.

So really what has to happen is people just have to bite the bullet and see what they can achieve by finding common ground with the other party and listening to dissent that emerges from outside the two major parties.

Bernie's supporters are right for maintaining their stance, because voicing their opinions is more important than shutting up and rallying behind a Democrat nominee that doesn't really represent them.
0 Replies
 
 

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