Bernie-
I think it is a pity.It means we can't both be intellectuals.Great minds think alike.Take that away and everybody can lay claim using subjective criteria.Hence the battle of the snots which I'm not convinced I was a part of.I don't recall trading pointless insults.I was labelled "clueless" and "a snot" for simply pointing out that it was billions of 2 cents off decisions at the gas pump etc which creates the necessity of cut price safety procedures.That was the cause of the Aberfan disaster.Anybody,at the time,who disposed of mining waste safely could not have sold their coal to bargain hunters.And they would have bought Columbian or Polish or Chinese coal if they could have done.What do you think it would cost the economy to reduce fatal traffic accidents by 2/3rds.It could be done.It's a delicate balance and using hindsight to score cheap political points is not on my agenda.Actually Newt Gingrich made the same point I did on TV.But he's a snot and clueless as well I don't think.He only got elected.
Maybe it was the "drinking iron" jest.It was a jest wasn't it?(It's in Salammbo I think.)
One thing is for sure-to greet a message you don't like with a pointless insult,which bothers me not a jot,is a sure sign of anti-intellectualism and of the underestimation of threader's intelligence.It is proposing the ID of the insulter.
"Never utter these words:'I do not know this--therefore it is false.' "
"One must study to know,know to understand,understand to judge."
Narada.
There is also Resistance Analysis.
georgeob1 wrote:Did you know that Richard's wife, Isabel Burton was the original translator into English of Jose de Alencar's allegoric epic poem "Iracems" - a Brazilian version of the encounter between the Portuguese and the Native Indians - and that this became the inspiration for a somewhat sticky & melodramatic, but very popular, novel of the time called "Green Mansions". Can't recall the author's name...
Maybe I can help your memory, George :wink:
Iracema
georgeob1 wrote:spendius wrote: ...I'll not make it conditional on your stopping smoking that I read the book again.
What a swell guy ! My offer, however, remains entirely conditional.
well, Spendi and george, Bernie has stopped smoking. Not an easy task for him. So get to readin....I would like a report back on a regular basis.
But on the subject of ID.....there are better books to read.
Creationism's Trojan Horse:
The Wedge of Intelligent Design, for instance.
What do I have to give up to get you to read that one?
Blatham provided a link to the essay "Intelligent Design Has No Place in the Science Curriculum" (Morowitz, Hazen, and Trefil). The authors describe Michael Behe's argument about bacterium flagellum and then give their critique:
Quote:But there's always another challenge to evolution, always another supposed example of irreducible complexity. At the present time the poster child of intelligent design is the flagellum of a bacterium. That complex structure in bacterial walls features a corkscrew-shaped fiber that rotates, propelling the bacterium through the water. Obviously, a completely functioning flagellum is very useful, but it is also obvious that all its parts have to be present for it to function. A nonmoving corkscrew, for example, would be useless and would confer no evolutionary advantage on its own. Roughly 50 molecules are involved in constructing the flagellum, so the probability of all the parts' coming together by chance seems infinitesimally small.
However, that intelligent-design argument contains a hidden assumption: that all parts of a complex structure must have had the same function throughout the history of the development of the organism. In fact, it is quite common for structures to have one function at one time and be adapted for quite another use later on. A land animal's legs become a whale's flippers. An insect may develop bumps on the side of its body to help it get rid of internal heat, but when the bumps get big enough, they may help the insect glide or fly, thus opening up an entirely new ecological niche for exploitation. That process is so common that evolutionary scientists have given it a name: exaptation.
No evolutionary theorist would suggest that something as complex as the flagellum appeared ab initio. Instead, it was assembled from parts that had developed for other uses. For example, some molecules produce energy by rotating, a normal procedure within cells. Other molecules have a shape that makes them ideal for moving materials across cell membranes. The flagellum's building blocks include both types of molecules. Instead of being assembled from scratch, then, the flagellum is put together from a stock of already existing parts, each of which evolved to carry out a completely different task. The flagellum may be complicated, but it is not irreducibly complex.
spendius wrote:
The Major General,aka blatham,aka Bernie,aka Lola
And what does this mean?
BTW, have you guys established yet which of you has the biggest one? If so, let's talk again about ID.
(taking a chance that the mins can enjoy an opportunity to laugh at themselves and offer me the same opportunity in return.)
Hi Sweet Angel of Lovin' care-
I hope he's treatin' ya right.He's a lucky fella.An' I hope you are okay too.
If he gets a bit shirty just smack him round the chops with a wet fish.That'll calm him down.
It's hard work being light hearted these days though but down in the dumps is usually not positive so it has to be done.At least we now know how tame movies are.I guess you won't approve but I chose Fox.And girl have I learned a lot.Is there no limit to lessons.
Love from England.
spendius wrote:Hi Sweet Angel of Lovin' care-
I hope he's treatin' ya right.He's a lucky fella.An' I hope you are okay too.
If he gets a bit shirty just smack him round the chops with a wet fish.That'll calm him down.
It's hard work being light hearted these days though but down in the dumps is usually not positive so it has to be done.At least we now know how tame movies are.I guess you won't approve but I chose Fox.And girl have I learned a lot.Is there no limit to lessons.
Love from England.
a kiss for you spendi............I'm doing well enough. And I've had to do a minimum of smacking, but when it has been necessary, I have packed a good waaalup. Don't ever let em get you down.
And could you be more specific? You chose which Fox for what purpose?
Quote:What do I have to give up to get you to read that one?
That's easy.Being parsimonious with your charms.
But I can't read it.I have four books on the go plus some other stuff in between.I'm on Blavatsky,A Miller biog,Flaubert's letters and,as soon as I find it Hoffie.
spendius wrote:Quote:What do I have to give up to get you to read that one?
That's easy.Being parsimonious with your charms.
But I can't read it.I have four books on the go plus some other stuff in between.I'm on Blavatsky,A Miller biog,Flaubert's letters and,as soon as I find it Hoffie.
Consider yourself parsimoned.
<whispering> read the Trojan Horse first.
Fox News.Never had it off.I thought you would know what I mean.Sheesh!
I've half cracked Blavatsky's code I think.Have you ever took it on?Whatever anybody says about that book don't let them tell you it isn't a good read.I forgot to say that I'm also doing The Great Mother a bit at a time.
It is very relevant to this ID debate.I might quote a passage tomorrow to show you what I mean.
Why are American books so much better made than ours?
spendius wrote:It is very relevant to this ID debate.I might quote a passage tomorrow to show you what I mean.
Why are American books so much better made than ours?
I didn't know they were.....what about sweet Charlotte? For further good discussions on this an other subjects, might I suggest this ? There are some good people over there.
http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=11263&start=1690
And lose Fox News........good god man, that's not news, it's big brother. At least turn to CNN.
Lola-
I just happened on Fox about 2 hours before the hurricane landed and I stayed with it.I have got to know all their reporters and I'm not one for jumping about from place to place.It doesn't look like BB to me.I've a pretty good idea what BB looks like and it's a long way off that.If this had happened in China there would have been a news blackout and we would never even have heard of it.
I have a tendency to support the President whoever he is.If Fox lean a bit then it isn't that far and anyway I can see through it.The pictures are the thing.It's history in the making.I can see by watching it just how trivialised a lot of the history books actually are.Imagine Salammbo filmed at life's pace.Do you think Fox could adapt to the mores.
spendius wrote:Lola-
I just happened on Fox about 2 hours before the hurricane landed and I stayed with it.I have got to know all their reporters and I'm not one for jumping about from place to place.It doesn't look like BB to me.I've a pretty good idea what BB looks like and it's a long way off that.If this had happened in China there would have been a news blackout and we would never even have heard of it.
I have a tendency to support the President whoever he is.If Fox lean a bit then it isn't that far and anyway I can see through it.The pictures are the thing.It's history in the making.I can see by watching it just how trivialised a lot of the history books actually are.Imagine Salammbo filmed at life's pace.Do you think Fox could adapt to the mores.
You should listen to me. If you tend to support the President, then you should be interested in more balanced news coverage that the "fair and balanced" channel ----- NOT. Try CNN, you'll come to know those folks too soon enough and, while it's still not the best coverage in the world, it's better than Fox. Any channel is better than Fox.
btw, did you know that Dennis Potter distrusted and disliked Rupert Murdock.....hated him, I'll say. Watch the Singing Detective and look for his jabs at Murdock in the third or fourth week of the series. Or get a copy of the interview with Potter. It took place just before he died. It's called "Potter on Potter." You'll get an idea of how a good writer who loves the free press feels about Murdock and his kind.
Francis wrote:
Maybe I can help your memory, George :wink:
Iracema
Thank you Francis.
Perhaps the only thing worse than forgetting something is encountering the fact that you once not only remembered but offered the information to those who didn't ask for it!.
I'm flattered (I think) that you found it.
Lola wrote:
... well, Spendi and george, Bernie has stopped smoking. Not an easy task for him. So get to readin....I would like a report back on a regular basis.
I said thirty days Lola - not one less.
Lola-
Okay-I'll try it.
Now I see why you are such Potter fans.You do remember,of course,that he hated advertising too but changed his mind after a visit to Russia.
Why do you have it in for a guy who has transformed sport in this country.He's done a lot for the working man and he has "chosen" American citizenship.Anyway-you shouldn't hate anything at all except hatred.And we decide what a free press looks like and Mr Murdoch knows it.Potter's okay.He's not up for being swooned over though.I know how to have digs at people.I like new things.
Things I'd never have thought of.Things I can use.I'm an IA Richards fan.Art has to have value.
I saw P on P live.
spendius wrote:It is very relevant to this ID debate.I might quote a passage tomorrow to show you what I mean.
spendius,
Did you come across anything in your reading that would indicate biological intelligent design theory is legitimate science?
wande-
Not one iota.How could it be otherwise?
Did you know that over in the Cafe there's some denigration of this thread going on.In compensation there are some really,really intelligent dudes having a fantastically interesting discussion.You better get over there pronto in case you miss any of the cutting edge stuff.It's had me riveted and rapt all day and I'm utterly exhausted from wrestling with the momentous topics that are being debated.
