The US, UN & Iraq II

Nimb wrote:

Ehm, I though the beef with France was that it wouldn't "stand shoulder to shoulder" with the US in approving a resolution that would grant the US the right to start this war? So - if the beef with France is that it "cowardly" refused to join the war, how can you claim that the war wouldn't have happened if France had co-operated? The thing you were asking France to co-operate with was this war!

France backed the first resolution and led Powell to believe they would back a reasonable 2nd resolution. The Security council passed 1441 15 to 0------I've just realized how futile this is---it's history. The future is all that matters. Chirac has delusions of grandeur----he will probably dig himself a hole just as Daschle has---that hole may be his political grave.

Bush has only begun to fight---the Turks and French will not enjoy it when the cowboy gets really pissed.

As pissed as he was during the Vietnam war?

I think that what we know about what really happened in Basra depends on who we read!:

A humanitarian crisis is unfolding in southern Iraq five days into the US-British invasion aimed at toppling Iraqi President Saddam Hussein.
The biggest grievance is lack of water, with supplies cut off by a thunderous ground and air assault in the south, home to Iraq's Shi'ite Muslims, many of whom are eager to see Saddam go.
"We need water. All we can do is dig for water in wells. It is water that even animals would not drink," said 30-year-old Muhammad Ali, who is unemployed.
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/03/25/1048354573005.html

Saddam-backed militia groups throughout southern Iraq have executed hit-and-run and sniper attacks on coalition forces, delaying what the Pentagon expected to be a quick capture of Basra, Umm Qasr and Nasiriyah.
They also have sabotaged Basra's water and electricity plants, creating a humanitarian crisis.
http://washingtontimes.com/national/20030326-82854118.htm

Well said, Gelisgesti!

Also, maybe the world is waiting for us dissident Americans to "take out" George Bush.

Careful Tartarin,

Pissed, maybe he'll hide in Alabama again!

Vee haff our planz reddy, Mr. Bill.

Shhhhhhhhhh! Like your avatar, very distinguished today, aren't we? BTW, excuse my ignorance - who is it?

Tartar

Be careful ----- his "vicious" dogs may take you out!

Bill---didn't you recognize Woodrow Wilson? I think Tartar is trying to say how irrelevant the UN is ----just like the League of Nations.

Actually, the only thing I like about Bush is his behavior with his dogs!

Bill, the author of the quote and the man in the photo are the same. He was the leader of the movement to abolish slavery, got death threats from some and gentle warnings from others that, after all, the slaves weren't entirely human. He's there to remind me how wrong Americans can be.

France backed 1441, but then 1441 was never meant to formalise the step to war as retaliation for its breach - hence the need for a second resolution - and certainly did not authorise any one SC state to launch one on its own decision.

Though "leading [a minister] to believe" a future whatever doesnt, I think, really count for anything in itself in law and politics, I'm also sure that France might in fact well have "backed a reasonable second resolution". Pity the US refused to bring any.



That's when Operations French Freedom and Turkish Delight start, right?

Thanks Tartarin, did some reading - an admirable fellow!

Tartar wrote:

Actually, the only thing I like about Bush is his behavior with his dogs!

I'm glad you agree that dogs can tell more about a man's character than humans.

that's not what tartarin said.

Baghdad :: Paul Wood :: 2115GMT

Over the last hour we have had several loud explosions here in Baghdad. It's difficult to see exactly what has been hit but it seems it's government targets being hit once again.

Residents of As-Shaarb - where several people died in a market place last night - are denying strenuously that any military hardware was positioned amid the shops and apartment blocks of their residential district of Baghdad.

They are in no doubt, as are the Iraqi authorities, that this was an attack on civilians.

Whatever the truth - of how this bomb or missile came to land on As-Shaarb and who it belonged to - this is already a propaganda victory for the Iraqi authorities.

BBC reporter diaries

Nimb wrote:

That's when Operations French Freedom and Turkish Delight start, right?

Actually Nimb---when the 4th Infantry division finally get their tanks off loaded in Kuwait from those ships that the Turks wouldn't allow to dock and off load, and they start rolling north.with their high tech epuipment.......they (the Turks ) may reevaluate their cards and may slip quietly back across the border into Turkey.
Gen Franks cannot be feeling very friendly toward the Turks right now and neither is Bush----look for them to stay within the bounds of diplomacy but just like the Turkish Ambassador to the US said the other night ---we will act in our best national interests.

Re: The French ---- when the French citizens realize the full economic impact of Chirac's miscalculation they will probably get the Guilotine out of mothballs.

I try not to sound overconfident about the prowess of our military but damn it's hard to be humble when you're good.

perception, I'm curious, why do you insist on calling Tartarin 'Tartar' and nimh 'nimb'?

LittleK

that's not what tartarin said.

Aw--shucks!

Rumsfeld's strategy under fire:

http://truthout.org/docs_03/032703A.shtml

This article was written by Joe Galloway an armed forces reporter for Knight-Ridder newspapers. Joe wrote a book with Lt. General Harold Moore, "We Were Soldiers Once and Young" of his experiences in battle in the Ia Drang Valley of Vietnam. The book was subsequently made into a movie, starring Mel Gibson..."We Were Soldiers." He was the only reporter ever to receive a medal for bravery...a bronze medal with a "V" on it for saving a soldiers life after a medic was killed in the battle. He wrote for the US News and World Report for years on military affairs.

I read this article this morning and was stunned. If Joe is reporting what the Pentagon generals are thinking and saying at this date, this has got to be serious! Then, this afternoon, Terri Gross interviewed him on "Freshair" on NPR and he was more forthcoming. She asked him how he was able to get this inside information from the military, and he replied that it was "so bad that they want the word to get out."

I met Joe and General Moore at the dedication of the Vietnam Women's Memorial Dedication ceremonies back in 1993 on Veterans Day, their book had just been published. When they found out that the hospital that had cared for their wounded was there, they made us march with the 1st Cavalry in the parade that day and we were invited to their yearly memorial dinner that night.

Some of the comments he made to Terri was that it seemed like the "lessons of the past have not been heeded...Rumsfeld reminds me of Robert Strange MacNamara, he with the very fitting name..."

I just read that the division of armor that he was speaking about that is stationed at Ft. Hood, is being sent to Iraq now. Apparently the equipment has been floating on boats off the coast of Turkey for weeks.

LittleK

Tartar is short for tartar sauce and Nimb is fairly close to Numb.

Just joking ---- don't take offense. Jush like some people calling me perc or percy instead of something more to their liking.