What Have We Learned From The Schiavo Case?

call me for a campaign contribution for any elected official running on the mind your own damn business and I'll mind mine platform

Hey, yall.

Cyclops; this is my thought exactly. Why would you allow a human being to starve to death ON PURPOSE. I understand that it is argued that letting her die is the humane thing to do, but why not kill her quickly instead of starving her. Atleast I have heard that she is in a continually pain-free-morphine-induced state.

Other comment: Does anyone see the resemblance between this case, which started c. 5yrs ago, and the new movie Million Dollar Baby? I cannot think that it is entirely coincidence.

I agree that, with the outcome foregone, they should put her out of her misery. But if they can't do that, why can't they give her water? Is she not able to swallow water?

I guess they believe that would prolong her life, when they were trying to end it as quickly as possible with no interference

What have I learned from the Schiavo case?

1. Individuals in this country used to have an inalienable right to life -- a fundamental, substantive due process right to life -- that the state could not infringe upon unless the state had a compelling interest in doing so and the means used were necessary and narrowly tailored to serve that compelling state interest. We don't have that right anymore.

2. Individuals in this country used to be protected by an overwhelming presumption in favor of life. That presumption -- that an individual would choose LIFE over death -- could not be rebutted except by clear and convincing evidence to the contrary. That presumption no longer applies. People now assume that all persons with a "substandard" quality of life would want to die in order to maintain their "dignity" and to spare their families the financial and emotional "burden" of caring for them in this "substandard" state.

3. The law requires far more protection of an individual's intentions concerning her PROPERTY than it does concerning her LIFE.

If you intend to lease your property for a period of one year or more, the law requires a written contract evidencing the property owner's intent. Oral declarations of a lessor's intent to lease property for a period of one year or more are absolutely void and unenforceable. If you intend to distribute your property to specified beneficiaries upon your death and you make clear and convincing oral declarations of your intent to several hundred disinterested persons and they all march into court to testify concerning your intent, a court still will not honor your intentions concerning the distribution of your property. The law requires a written will that is executed before disinterested witnesses.

Although the law will not honor your oral declarations concerning your property, the taking of your life requires only one hearsay statement from one interested party.


4. Because the protections for those who would choose life over death have been watered down into nonexistence, if an individual in this country chooses to LIVE -- despite the social and economic pressures on them to choose the opposite -- it now imperative for a person to place an "I WANT TO LIVE" directive in their medical records.

5. The eventual targets of the "right to die" movement will be elderly patients in nursing homes who are suffering from Alzheimer's disease when their family members come forward and proclaim that their elderly family member had expressed wishes not to live in that mindless, confused state. Even though these people may not be terminally ill, the the odds are that they will never recover from Alzheimer's disease. Accordingly, we can justify allowing the "death process" to take its "natural course" by withholding nuitrition and hydration from these people. They won't feel any pain because we all know that death by starvation and dehydration brings these people into a state of euphoria.

6. From there, it will be a simple leap to reach people who born incompetent and/or incapacitated. Even though these people had never expressed their wishes, we can assume that they wouldn't want to live like that . . . .

When my father was in a PVS my mother was routinely asked if she were dating.

Many of the men and women she knew facing similar situations did indeed date.

That didn't mean that any of these people no longer cared for their spouse or that they were in any rush to have them die or that they wanted anything less than the best for their spouse.

It certainly didn't mean that they were incompetent guardians.

I doubt that there are any formal records kept regarding this topic but I think it is very, very, common.

I agree it does not automatically mean there is a lack of care, or they would be in a rush to have them die. But I question that such a spouse ought to be in the role of guardian over the objections of the incapacitated's parents. That's all. That seems to be a big issue in this Shiavo matter.

More correctly -- YOU DON'T have the RIGHT TO DIE unless you are aware of the significance of your declarations of your desires through the act of executing a formal document. If the law requires as much from you before the law will give effect to your desires concerning the distribution of your property -- the law ought to require as much from you before the law will give effect to your desires concerning the termination of life-saving medical treatment and life-saving nutrition and hydration.




In Re Estate of Gates

Moral of the story:

Do a living will... and send a copy of it to Tom DeLay's office.

All I know, is that I will be an organ donar with express wishes(stated in a will) That I not be kept alive when brain-dead, and I am only allowed to live in a coma until the usual time of recovery (it's like 3yrs, I think) then, burn me, put my ashes in a vase, and send me to my worst enemy.

I have learned that as far as news goes, the acrimony and heartbreak of a family fight over the slow agonizing death of their loved one beats an alleged pedophile pop star trial anyday.

And either one of those stories will automatically trump any story about how your government is f*cking you every day of your life.

In general, that is.

Tico
What laws must Florida change. Can they enact a law that does not allow the Governor, Congress and President to interfere with the judicial process?

I know where you're coming from, Tico, but really such things are a big deal in many family discussions regarding end of life issues. Most of them are settled quietly within the family.

As I am the guardian of a little boy, I find this whole issue of questioning guardianship very interesting.

When my boy's parents abandoned him at my house the state wasn't very interested at all. The state was perfectly happy to leave him in legal limbo.

I would love to see politicians be so interested in guardianships of the people in this country who are truly vulnerable and who really need guarding.

To not have much faith in humanity.

http://durrrrr.blogspot.com/

Here is another low point.

http://www.messedup.net/terry/

What did you learn in school today, dear little boy of mine?
I learned that Washington never told a lie
I learned that soldiers seldom die
I learned that everybody's free
That's what the teacher said to me
And that's what I learned in school today
That's what I learned in school

What did you learn in school today, dear little boy of mine?
I learned that policemen are my friends
I learned that justice never ends
I learned that murderers die for their crimes
Even if we make a mistake sometimes
And that's what I learned in school today
That's what I learned in school

What did you learn in school today, dear little boy of mine?
I learned that war is not so bad
I learned about the great ones we have had
We fought in Germany and in France
And someday I might get my chance
And that's what I learned in school today
That's what I learned in school

What did you learn in school today, dear little boy of mine?
I learned that our government must be strong
It's always right and never wrong
Our leaders are the finest men
So we elect them again and again
And that's what I learned in school today
That's what I learned in school
Tom Paxton

I learned that I can stop sending my hard earned money to charities that help feed hungry people because starving to death is a "peaceful" way to die.

jpn, I love you man but your post is off topic and in the context of Teri Schiavo off the mark. I'd hate to see you reprimanded for TOS violations...I live for your SOTD thread.

JP these children REALIZE they're starving and with food and nutrition could lead normal lives, neither of which is the case with Terri Schiavo.

I don't see a TOS violation in his post though.