NBA

Just a word about the Miami Heat's defense:

When asked why he thought the Heat would take the East from the Pistons (its rightful owner), a Heat fan declared: "Two words: Heat defense...."

Heat defense??? Let's see what the great Heat defense allowed in 04-05 & compare them to a totally randomly chosen team like the World Champion Detroit Pistons.

Heat Defensive (Pistons Defensive)

by opponent-lower is better:
Points PG: 95 (89.5)
Asissts PG: 19.8 (19.7)
Rebounds: 40.5 (39.6)
Offensive Rebounds: 11.2 (11.3)
Defensive Rebounds: 29.2 (28.3)

by opponent-higher is better:
Turnovers*: 13.2 (13.8)

by team -higher is better:
Steals Per Game: 6.4 (7.4)
Blocks Per Game: 5.8 (4.5)

Edit (Moderator): Do not post links to your blog here.<---too late.

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Yeah, I remember. Beat Houston in 5. Houston only challenged in one loss. Beat A in 6. SA jumped out to a 2 game lead, and then fell apart, only keeping one more game close. Beat Minnesota in 6. Minnesota was coming off a tough series with the Kings, Sam Cassell was banged up -- and it still took the Lakers six games. Do you remember how the series actually went? The teams in the west were intimidated by the Lakers, lacked the confidence to man up to them (like the Kings those couple of years). Detroit wasn't scared, and they whooped their ass.

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Nice try, but that number for turnovers forced belongs to Memphis. Detroit forces 13.1 per game -- the same number they give up. Look again: CLICK ME

Moreover,

Miami is outscoring opponents by 6.5. Detroit is outscoring opponents by 3.9. Edge: Miami.

Miami is holding opponents to 42.7% on FG. Detroit is holding opponents to 43%. Edge: push.

(Meanwhile, Miami shoots 48.6% compared to Detroit's 43.0%...)

Miami is securing 51.5% of available rebounds. Detroit is securing 52.0% of available rebounds. Edge: push.

You give gross numbers, but the Heat play a much faster game than Detroit does --> more possessions --> more shot attempts --> more rebounds by both teams.

Not that I put a lot of stock in regular season statistics, but you've got to look at the whole picture.

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Miami's opponent TO # is wrong, too. Bad source, is that blog.

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Quote:

Nice try, but that number for turnovers forced belongs to Memphis. Detroit forces 13.1 per game -- the same number they give up. Look again: CLICK ME

Moreover,

Miami is outscoring opponents by 6.5. Detroit is outscoring opponents by 3.9. Edge: Miami.

Miami is holding opponents to 42.7% on FG. Detroit is holding opponents to 43%. Edge: push.

(Meanwhile, Miami shoots 48.6% compared to Detroit's 43.0%...)

Miami is securing 51.5% of available rebounds. Detroit is securing 52.0% of available rebounds. Edge: push.

You give gross numbers, but the Heat play a much faster game than Detroit does --> more possessions --> more shot attempts --> more rebounds by both teams.

Not that I put a lot of stock in regular season statistics, but you've got to look at the whole picture.

Just for a moment, don't be insane. And I mean that in a 'trash talking' jovial way.

My blog's source is NBA.com. Let's not forget this SIGNIFICANT point.
(Miami's regular season TO stat isn't wrong. Detroit's was wrong. The Piston's don't force 15 TOs per game, but 13.8. I'll correct the Detroit Stats immediately...okay, it's corrected & the World Champion Pistons still have better defense than the Heat)
Detroit makes & forces 13.8 TOs per game. Since we're talking DEFENSE, only the forced TOs are important--13.8, higher than the Heat's. The Pistons make 13.8 TOs per game, seemingly breaking even.
Miami makes more TOs than they force (makes 13.7 TO/ forces 13.2). Since we're talking DEFENSE, they don't break even. Their defense loses the TO per game war to their opponents' defense.
People who are afraid of what looking at *tangibles* rely on "percentages".
Miami allows more points per game (95 PPG) than the Pistons score per game. (93 PPG). Notice, the Heat who have a 101.5 PPG, were held to 79.3 PPG by the Pistons, allowing the Pistons to win the regular season series 2-1 (note the Piston's lower PPG):
Pistons bring down the Heat's points scored per game by 22.2 PPG. Heat bring the Piston's points scored per game down by 14.4 PPG.
Fast Paced Team vs. Slow Paced Team: Detroit's defense can slow down the fast-paced Heat offense. But, the Heat's defense can't *speed up* the Pistons' offense, especially considering the Heat's defense already allows what the Pistons normally score. Slow Paced team win's the *defensive* battle.

If we're talking Defense, the Pistons are in a class well above the Heat. Plain & simple.

As for stats being wrong. You list the Piston's FG% at 43%. Wrong.

FG%:

Heat 48.6 Piston's 44.4

FG% by opponent:

Heat 42.7 Pisont's 43.0

Here we see the Heat allowing 42.7 FG% & the Piston's score 44.4 FG%. The Heat allows 1.7% lower than the Pistons score. However, the Piston's defense allows 43.0 FG% & the Heat score 48.6%. The Pistons allow 5.6% lower than the Heat score.

The Piston's defense will have a greater affect on the Heat's offense than the Heat's defense will have on the Piston's offense.

Whether the Piston's defense is better than the Heat's defense should never be a question on a sane man's mind.

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Easy there, guy. A fast team gives up more points than a slow team. And it doesn't matter what the blog's source is, they got it wrong. Anywho, I linked to espn.com.

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patiodog wrote:

Easy there, guy. A fast team gives up more points than a slow team. And it doesn't matter what the blog's source is, they got it wrong. Anywho, I linked to espn.com.

You easy there, guy. That the Heat give up more points per game *IS* exactly the point (at least, one of them). Or, do you miss that glaring reality? Heat's defense gives up more points than the Pistons' defense. 'Nuff said right? Apparently, not.

And you questioned the blog as a source. The blog's source is the NBA.com. So take THAT! Of course you could question whether *I*, the blog's author relayed those stats from one place to the next:

1) You said I got Heat stats wrong. You were wrong. I got Piston's stats wrong & recorded their playoff stats. 2) You went on to get your stats wrong. You said Pistons' FG% scored is 43. You were wrong. It's 44.4% with 43% by opponents. Trying to build your argument by correcting others, then going on to make similiar errors in the same post is very, VERY, bad form.

So go easy there guy. The only thing I'm pointing out is the Pistons' defense is better than the Heat's defense.

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1. According to espn.com, the Heat force 12.4 TO per game. According to your post, they force 13.2 TO per game.

2. I said the following:

Quote:

Miami is holding opponents to 42.7% on FG. Detroit is holding opponents to 43%. Edge: push.

That's not a claim about the Pistons' FG%.

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Hey, Omar, I have a question for you...how much time does it take that little girl Tayshawn Prince to shave his vagina every week?

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patiodog wrote:

1. According to espn.com, the Heat force 12.4 TO per game. According to your post, they force 13.2 TO per game.

2. I said the following:

Quote:
Miami is holding opponents to 42.7% on FG. Detroit is holding opponents to 43%. Edge: push.

That's not a claim about the Pistons' FG%.

1) Yeah, let's argue over who has more accurate stats, NBA.com, or ESPN.com (good god). And, ironically, Detroit out ranks Miami on both sites for forcing opponent TOs. This takes us right back to my point: Detroit's defense is better than Miami defense.

2) You said the following

Quote:

Miami is holding opponents to 42.7% on FG. Detroit is holding opponents to 43%. Edge: push.

(Meanwhile, Miami shoots 48.6% compared to Detroit's 43.0%...)

This parenthetical comment compares Miami FG% to Detroit FG%, but you got it wrong. Detroit's correct FG% is 44.4 (by the way, you were wrong according to both sites). And you did it, as I pointed out, in a post correcting me about inaccurate stats. Bad boy....

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Aright, you got me there. I is a bad boy (like the old Pistons, heh). Forgive me my haste. And espn.com and nba.com have different numbers for Miami's opponents' turnovers. I'll have to have a word with the espn brass about that.

By the way, I'm sorry I stepped on your toes about your blog. I didn't know it was yours, and, it turns out, there was a mistake there. So be it.

And we disagree over how to rate a defense. I grew up watching the "Showtime" Lakers win 5 championships, playing up-tempo ball when they could, grinding it out when they had to, and winning either way. But if you looked at their defenive number in terms of totals and not percentages, they were not so impressive.

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patiodog wrote:

Aright, you got me there. I is a bad boy (like the old Pistons, heh). Forgive me my haste. And espn.com and nba.com have different numbers for Miami's opponents' turnovers. I'll have to have a word with the espn brass about that.

By the way, I'm sorry I stepped on your toes about your blog. I didn't know it was yours, and, it turns out, there was a mistake there. So be it.

And we disagree over how to rate a defense. I grew up watching the "Showtime" Lakers win 5 championships, playing up-tempo ball when they could, grinding it out when they had to, and winning either way. But if you looked at their defenive number in terms of totals and not percentages, they were not so impressive.

I feel you. Remember, playoffs without a little trash talk is called "Preseason". Laughing

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Sucks being a Kings fan right now. I gotta get at it where I can.

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enjoyable posts guys...

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Is rooting for Pheonix too far a stretch for you? I guess it would be about as bad as me rooting for the Bulls, here.

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Patiodog, I feel for you...to think that just a couple years ago the Kings were there. They had the team to win it, and they were just one little Robert Horry buzzer-beating three-pointer away from it...oh, man, that's gotta hurt!

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By the way, nobody responded to my earlier question, so I assume that we are all in agreement that Tayshawn Prince is, in fact, a little girl...

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Twist the knife, pour in the salt, and, er, how did Philly look last night?

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Yeah, Philly's not looking like the team to beat either, are they...hehehe.

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Tayshaun Princess.

Funny thing is, that dude, looks just like a girl I knew in college, right down to the long face, the creepy long eyes, the slack jaw, the loping walk, the freckles. If she put on about eight inches and no weight, it would have been a perfect match.

Dunno about her and shaving, tho.

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