I feel like a lost soul sometimes.

Hey, don't worry. You can always go again without them...

Wait, what I said before--that's not totally true. I refuse to beat myself up about it. A big part of it was the cost. It wasn't all about my crazy family issues. If I didn't do it this way, I also would have had a lot less money with which to use on my future "break away from this crappy job" plan.

What plan, you ask? I don't know yet! But I know I'm going to need a lot of money.

And I WILL go off on my own for a lot of this trip. I don't have to stay with them every minute!

Okay, I feel a little better now.

Lol! Or you could just extend your sans folks part of the trip a bit?

It is lovely of you to take them - and I hope you have a great time together!!!

But you need some serious Kicky time.

I have no doubt you will fall in amongst other travellers when going solo - or meet some fabulous Italians.

So, listen, you are going to need to go to Italy more than once...

I think it will be constraining with your parents, but they may feel constrained too, and actually like some time off each day in the togetherness bit. Hard in any case to get three people together hours on end and agreeing what to do and waiting for the slow one to get a move on or the fast one to relax.

Hmmm, I wonder if they'd like local tours - most hotels have possible tours, oh, say the Vatican... readily available. I think in italy the problem is just picking a tour. This strikes me as a splendid idea since I feel trapped and stifled on tours and would rather just flounder happily by myself, and most other people like and appreciate them. And... they can last all day..

I can picture you walking through Rome easily and they being more timorous. Hah. Talk about projecting stereotypes. But, if they aren't timorous and would cheerfully take off to see what they want on their own, at least part of the time, that would be good.

All this spoken by someone who wanted to strangle a friend who came along for the first week of my last trip there.

kicky, no you didn't screw up. it is awfully nice of you to go with your folks, and even if it will be at times difficult, which it will be, you will not regret it, i'm sure of it.

It took me a long time to write my post for some reason and I hadn't seen Kicky's reply yet. Good on some separateness...


I think it will be one hell of a memorable trip and I'm glad you're taking your parents, cough, well, mostly I think it's nice, as long as you take care of your own sense of self while there...

Thanks guys. I know it will be okay. I still do think it's a screw-up, but I'm not going to let it ruin everything. I'll get out there on my own. Besides, I sort of want to be with them for some of it. I don't live near them, so in some ways I know it will be annoying, but also in other ways, it will be a good thing.

What do you care about? I mean deep down, no-screwing-around,
honestly give a **** about? If you know what you care about, then that's
what you try to bring into your life.

All right, I'm saying "you" a lot here. Who the hell am I to talk about
you? I don't really know you, but I recognize the feeling you describe.
I've wrestled with it a lot. I don't know whether it'll help you, but what
helped me is taking stock of what mattered to me. I realized that I was
spending so much of my time on stuff that just didn't matter, was only
amusing me for while. I found I was too wrapped up in myself, not
enough consideration for other people.

The important part for me was that self-examination. Every so often I
need to be by myself to think. It takes a while. I've got to let the tapes
playing in my head run themselves out. I've got to get past the little lies
and poses I hide behind. No excuses. No stories. Pure honesty. What
the hell do care I about? Who do I care about?

The woods work well for me. A long walk. Alone. Very fast at first, burn
off some energy. Then settle into a regular pace. Let the thoughts come
as they will. Step aside mentally. Watch yourself think. Get some
distance. Then start the real thinking. When the painful thoughts surface,
don't brush them aside. Examine them. Deal with them. What do I
want? What am I doing about it? Who else do I care about? What am I
doing for them?

Enough rambling. Good luck, Kicky. I hope you find what you're looking
for (and find out what you're looking for).

George, I hear what you're saying. I wish I had more time to respond, because there are a couple things I'd like to say about that, but I have this wonderful job (Notice how I didn't call it an infernal hellhole that time?) to do now, and I've already spent too much time not doing it today.

Kicky, I think it's an OK idea to go with your parents... it may be a really good idea. You will get to know them just a little better, and in seeing our parents we often see ourselves, and learn a little more about who we really are.

So it may be really smart to have your parents around for at least part of the trip. They have a lot to teach you about what to do, and what NOT to do. Plus you'll have memories of them that will hopefully last many, many years for you. Could be worse, eh?

Kicky, I'd like to hear your thoughts on that when you have some time.

Hi Kicky, I dont really know what to say, as I havent been round long enough to know you that well, but I think that anyone who has gone through the dreaded Forty, or have reached a crossroads in their life can say "been there, done that".
How each person gets through it is another matter, as we are all different and have our own unique set of problems and situations going on in the background.
It sounds like you are a pretty popular guy on this Forum, judging by the amount of people that have responded, and the concern shown.
When you get down in the dumps, just think of all these people, waiting for the day that you return so that they can resume their verbal jousting with you.
So, I wish you well on your travels Mr K, and hope that you have plenty of time to do your own thing.
I only hope that you have access to a computer while you are in Italy, so that you can give us a regular update.
Good luck mate.

so this is the loners, losers & lost people thread?

<finds himself a cosy corner, sits down>

what'sa matta, young man? are you lost?





Don't worry about eye-tall-ya, kicky. Them folks stay up late, and I'm guessing that your parents do not.

Kicky - I think it's fine that you are going to Italy with your parents. But, definitely do go off and do a coupla few day trips by your self.

Here's a Q - is change good? I have been told that my penchant for moving every year or 3, doing menial jobs, avoiding marriage and children is a sign of me running away from something. I did consider the whole concept - am I running? What from? Why?
I don't think I am. I think that though I resist change sometimes, that it's good.

And, now I have settled down in this apartment for over 5 years now and would love to stay here for another 5. Is that good or bad? <heh>

One of my few regrets in life is when I was 16 my grandparents offered to take me to Europe with them. Thinking I was far too cool to go schelping around Europe with a couple of old people I declined. After they died I thought about the fact I could have had all those extra memories if I had gone. I really regret not going since we would have gone to my grandfather's birthplace. I have been to Europe for various reasons since, but never to my grandfather's hometown- and of course, I can never experience it with him now.

As for the life crisis - I think everyone goes through it on and off and for good reason - it's a form of growing pains. You must always question where you are and where you are going or you will become stagnant. Who ever said life was easy? I like this bumper sticker I once saw: Life is the school, love is the lesson." - it's as a good a life philosophy as I can think of.

I can tell you that acquiring all your material dreams and even a good, loving partner will not stop that little voice in your head from saying "is that all there is?". Spiritual beliefs do help fill the holes, but there will always be doubt - maybe that's the real secret in life - you are meant to keep wondering.

Say hi to Pliny the Elder when you're in there.

He was so much Elder then. He's Junger than that Mao.

Been waiting for the right chance to use that, dog?

I like it.

Well, that's it, then. Gustav likes it. And that can only mean one thing...


















...I've lost my mind.