114
   

Where is the US economy headed?

 
 
H2O MAN
 
  -2  
Reply Tue 12 Jul, 2011 03:22 pm
@RABEL222,
So, you are saying Obama is a rich, power hungry greedy son of a bitch - got it.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 12 Jul, 2011 05:48 pm
This is interesting, lets see what happens.

This proposal seems like a win-win for both sides, if this article is to be believed.
I wonder if Obama and the dems will take this offer seriously.
And if they dont, what does that say about this whole mess?

http://customwire.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_DEBT_SHOWDOWN?SITE=DCUSN&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2011-07-12-19-06-39

Quote:
WASHINGTON (AP) -- With compromise talks at a vituperative standstill, Senate Republicans unexpectedly offered Tuesday to hand President Barack Obama new powers to avert a first-ever government default threatened for Aug. 2.

Under a proposal outlined by Sen. Mitch McConnell of Kentucky, Obama could request - and likely secure - increases of up to $2.5 trillion in the government's borrowing authority in three separate installments over the next year, as long as he simultaneously proposed spending cuts of greater size.


Quote:
In essence, McConnell's proposal would greatly enhance Obama's authority to avoid a default, while also virtually absolving Republicans of responsibility if one occurred.

At the same time, it would allow Republican lawmakers to avoid having to support an increase in the debt limit, something many of them find odious.

Cycloptichorn
 
  0  
Reply Tue 12 Jul, 2011 05:50 pm
@mysteryman,
But Obama doesn't WANT to cut spending that much, and his party doesn't, either. They want to cut spending by a small bit, and raise taxes to cover the remaining difference.

So why should he agree to this? How is this a 'win-win' for Obama?

Cycloptichorn
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Tue 12 Jul, 2011 06:19 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
He's missing one big item; the GOP still will not allow an increase in taxes. That's not even an offer of compromise; it's a demand by the GOP. I hope Obama refuses their offer.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  2  
Reply Tue 12 Jul, 2011 06:51 pm
I cant help but wonder why there even is a debt ceiling.
Every time it gets close, congress just raises it.
Why have it if everyone is going to ignore it?
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 12 Jul, 2011 06:57 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Thats just it, they dont want to cut spending.
If they were serious, they would want to cut the ENTIRE federal budget, not just pick and choose tiny amounts, designed to make themselves look good.


0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 12 Jul, 2011 06:58 pm
Maybe this opera between the two parties needs to go on a bit more, so the EU doesn't come to us hat in hand?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Tue 12 Jul, 2011 07:36 pm
@mysteryman,
mm, How much knowledge do you have about macroeconomics? I think very little to none based on your questions and opinions.

All levels of government have been cutting workers and benefits; that translates into less consumer spending.

When that happens, many businesses go bankrupt.

Get the picture?
0 Replies
 
realjohnboy
 
  1  
Reply Tue 12 Jul, 2011 07:37 pm
@mysteryman,
mysteryman wrote:

I cant help but wonder why there even is a debt ceiling.
Every time it gets close, congress just raises it.
Why have it if everyone is going to ignore it?

It is an exercise in silliness, MM. The debt ceiling in current dollars will always go up as the economy expands. That has happened dozens and dozens of times.
The metric de jour is national debt as a % of GDP. It was 120% as of the end of WW2 but got down to 33% at the end of the Carter administration. It grew rapidly under Reagan and Bush 1 before settling at 60% at the end of Clinton's 2nd term. It was 80% at the end of Bush 2's term and is now at 100% under Obama.
The big issue for me is we have 2 variables: Debt and GDP.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 12 Jul, 2011 07:53 pm
@realjohnboy,
rjb, Correct; the issue when looking at debt is what percentage is the debt vs GDP. Even today after all the bailouts and the stim bill that helped save jobs and kept Americans with pocket money to buy food, it also helped the US maintain a slow growth pattern since 2009, because those monies that went into the pockets of Americans were spent almost immediately - which stabilized consumer spending all while government jobs were being decimated. It's a wonder that our GDP continued to grow - although at very small increments.

Curbing spending on unemployment, social security, and Medicare will only exacerbate the economic problems we are struggling with, and that will only create worse conditions for our economy.

According to most economists, the US debt to GDP is still manageable, and we're in better shape than many other developed countries.

CISCO just announced they will be laying off 5,000 workers, but that's based on poor management, and not the total effect of the world economy.

0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  -3  
Reply Wed 13 Jul, 2011 05:32 am


Obama must cut spending and shrink the size of Government.

Obama should kill Obamacare in it's entirety, that single move would boost our economy.
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 13 Jul, 2011 05:48 am
"Our Dear Ruler, Barack Obama, has come up with yet another excuse for the current state of our economy. Are you ready for this one? He claims that the current economic slump is “evidence” that his stimulus plan worked … because as the stimulus phases out, local governments are shedding jobs.

Oh my!

We have the worst unemployment picture since the Great Depression because Obama’s stimulus worked!

Over two million fewer people are working in private sector jobs in our economy because Obama’s stimulus worked!

We are still seeing record levels of foreclosures because the stimulus worked!

The only thing that Barack Obama’s stimulus plan is evidence of is that government spending does not foster a climate of economic prosperity, particularly in the private market. The economy does not thrive when the government is making the economic choices.

But it was never Obama’s goal to bolster the private marketplace, but rather to keep union government workers and Democrat office holders afloat. So look around, America … this, what we are experiencing right now, is proof that Barack Obama’s stimulus plan worked!"
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jul, 2011 12:49 pm
What's happening in MINN can happen to other states where they are unable to agree on the state budget. This can also extend to the US government with the budget crisis. Do you know how to spell SECOND GREAT DEPRESSION?

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-07-13-minnesota-shutdown-bars-restaurants_n.htm?csp=YahooModule_News
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jul, 2011 01:05 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

What's happening in MINN can happen to other states where they are unable to agree on the state budget. This can also extend to the US government with the budget crisis. Do you know how to spell SECOND GREAT DEPRESSION?

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-07-13-minnesota-shutdown-bars-restaurants_n.htm?csp=YahooModule_News

it is as I have been saying for awhile.....the real problem is the breakdown of the political process which sinks the economy. We are seeing that in Europe right now as the contasion(sp?) spreads like wildfire as those with the money decide the European leaders are either unable or unwilling to deal with the Eurozone debt problems.

Depression in the near term is now extremely likily..I'd say we are 1 min 10 seconds from midnight on the economic doomsday clock....where do you have it?
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jul, 2011 01:08 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
contasion(sp?)


Contagion

Cycloptichorn
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jul, 2011 01:19 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Thanks....I am on my Android which prob can do spell check but I have not figured out how...and my spelling sucks.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jul, 2011 02:53 pm
@hawkeye10,
As the clock ticks, any agreement in a solution will be too slow, and the return to a stable economy becomes impossible.

The doomsday clock is ticking as we speak, but trying to forecast when that doomsday bomb explodes is a fools game.

All levels of government are making the mistake that "we have time on our hands." If you've been keeping up with the latest on the perception of the GOP on the debt ceiling, they believe August 2 is only a minor date, because the government can continue to pay on the debt with current income.

Most media pundits don't understand the seriousness of our government not meeting its obligations on debt and payments.

Moody just declared Portugal's debt as "junk." Do you know how that is going to harm all of the Euro countries, and the effect on interest rates?

Most people do not understand or appreciate the dynamics of economics, and how the world marketplace has changed their impact on the whole world.

On June 30, I transferred $75k of bonds into equity, because interest rates are going to increase on US treasuries when they default on their loan. This has happened to Greece, and the same will happen to Portugal. That means prices on bonds are going to nose-dive into new territory.
If you know anything about bonds, principal and interest work in opposite directions.

It's a gut-feeling, but my guesses have been pretty accurate in the past.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jul, 2011 03:02 pm
@cicerone imposter,
The latest from the NYT.

Quote:
McConnell Warns of Risk to Party, and Country, of Default
By CARL HULSE and JACKIE CALMES
Published: July 13, 2011

WASHINGTON — The Senate Republican leader, Mitch McConnell of Kentucky, warned Wednesday that allowing a federal default could have disastrous political consequences for his party and “destroy” the Republican brand.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jul, 2011 03:15 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Most people do not understand or appreciate the dynamics of economics, and how the world marketplace has changed their impact on the whole world
My Aunt used to work for the FED 9th district and several times she forwarded studies that show that American ignorance on economics is staggering. The Fed actually has a program to try to teach school aged kids a few basics, but it is mostly a pissing into the wind exercise.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jul, 2011 03:20 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
It's a gut-feeling, but my guesses have been pretty accurate in the past.


His gold bubble bursting prediction made at $1495 is not even remotely accurate. It hit about $1590 today. He really ought to be destitute but he didn't bet on it. He just advised A2Kers to do.

My guesses on the result of horseraces have "been pretty accurate in the past". Not enough of them I'll admit.

I don't think there will be a default. They can do things with numbers that is too much for us saps to understand.
 

Related Topics

The States Need Help - Discussion by Robert Gentel
Fiscal Cliff - Question by JPB
Let GM go Bankrupt - Discussion by Woiyo9
Sovereign debt - Question by JohnJD
 
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.09 seconds on 11/26/2024 at 10:54:17