Evolution? How?

The way I feel is that BOTH Creationism and evolution should be taught together side by side.

Freedom of speech seems to favor evolution as the U.S. Circus court of appeals says take God and anything to do with God out of the schools. Give me a break! Freedom of speech...Freedom of religion.

If you are going to teach one you have to teach the other AS THEORY. Make the students think. Make them use their brains. Don't brainwash them. Give them options to examine and see where it leads.

How about the true scientist who just happens to believe in Jesus and who developed the MRI (which has nothing to do with creation or evolution) and yet was denied a nobel prize most likely because of his creationist views.

There is no more reason to believe in evolution, than there is to believe in God or Alien astronauts. But since existence is all about belief, one is as good as the other.

Evolution should be taught in a science class as a scientific theory explaining the origin and diversity of species. Creation should be taught in Religious Education classes as the Christians' explanation of the origin of mankind. And never the twain should meet.

Imagine you've got some gazelles living in a savannah, and they're just chillin', no predators, they're all fat, slow, and dumb, just hangin' out eatin' some grass. Cool. Then a lionness moves into that area. Now, there's fast gazelles and there's slow gazelles, and it ain't good to be a slow gazelle. Now, how fast you run can be affected by a lot of things: how much practice or training you've had, how strong your muscles are, etc. But some of those things, like how good your reflexes are, how quickly you can change direction while running, etc., are things you were just born with, not things you got from practice. Well, the gazelles that were born with the kinds of genes that give them useful skills like fast reflexes, ability to change direction quickly, and general coordination (ie, the non-klutzy gazelles) are the ones that are going to do well in this situation. They'll get away. Now, our friends the slow, bad-reflexes, no coordination (four left hooves you might say), klutzy gazelles are going to run in the wrong direction, and be all slow, and trip over their own four left hooves, and they are going to provide food for the lion. Crying or Very sad Unfortunately, such is life. Now, all the gazelles left alive are going to go on with their lives, and HAVE BABY GAZELLES. <-- that's important. So the genes that helped them run away from the lion, as well as all their other genes, will be passed on to their kids. So imagine this keeps up for a while. Lion eats the slowest ones, fastest ones have babies. If you come back every year, you're going to notice that what started out as a group of fat, lazy, slow, dumb gazelles, is going to turn into a stragetic, lean, limber, fast, coordinated bunch of LION-EVADING MACHINES, baby! Cool No single gazelle changed. But the group is different than it was a few generations ago. AND THAT'S EVOLUTION. Evolution is when a group of living things becomes different than their parents, grandparents, great-great-great-grandparents, whatever. Lady peacocks (called peahens, if you wanna get all fancy) like brightly-colored gentlemen. The brightly-colored peacocks get all the girls, and the dull-looking peacocks get left all lonely. So when that year's crop of baby peacocks shows up, guess who the daddies are? If the dads are brightly-colored, so are the babies. And then when they grow up, those girls pick the brightest-colored boys. So over time, the peacocks get brighter and brighter.

Biliskner wrote:

rosborne979 wrote:

Why? How do you know any of this is true? You never met Jesus, and you didn't meet the people who wrote the original bible. How do you know any of what you believe is true?

??? read the book?

how do i know your grandfather is real? i've never met your grandfather, and i didn't meet the people who wrote the original biography(ies) (oh no he has NO biographies? damn, that's gotta be a worse off case for you to prove him real.) how do i know any of it is true? you could've been a cabbage patch baby delivered by pelicans for all i care.

good argument.

Nice try Bill, but comparing "reading a book" to knowing someone has a grandfather just doesn't cut it. Are you really saying that you know the truth of a book as well as you know that someone has a grandfather? You seem smarter than that.

Bili wrote:

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those guys that made the pyramids took it as compensation for building the pyramids.

So much for your requirement of "empirical science."

If they can't verify, it's not a theory.

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By your argument, then phsyics is religion, driving a car is religion, the simple act of breathing becomes religion.

Physics, car, breathing = Falsifiable.

Evolution = UNfalsifiable.

Read Karl Popper.

rosborne979 wrote:

But evolution itself is a system of belief - that we evolved. It is asserted and believed. It is not proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, therefore remains a guess, and evolution if it is to be maintained requires faith in that guess. It is a system of thought and belief.

I second that.

cicerone imposter wrote:

I don't need to validate evolution; all those scientists working confirm it over and over and over...ad nauseum. All you do is make claims that cannot be supported by facts; only your personal suppositions and interpretations that refutes science. You leave nothing to discuss.

We can discuss if you want. It is interesting that you claim I do not leave anything to discuss when in fact I have been very open to discssion and it was you several times that resorted to getting personal for what, I do not know. It is a fallacy to claim that because many scientists say evolution is true, therefore it makes it true. Only human arrogance, and arrogant people claim to know all the answers to everything. This usually springs from an insecure attitude of not knowing the whole truth which threatens ones grip on reality. Thus by creating dogmas it forms a prism that allows them to breath safely within those confines.

How can you say there is no such thing as evolution? I've experienced it myself hundreds of times.

For the most basic evolutions, you just need to get your starter Pokemon to level 16 (usually).

If any of you are having trouble getting a particular Pokemon to evolve, I would refer you to this excellent site by RAMS.

http://db.gamefaqs.com/portable/gbadvance/file/pokemon_rs_evolution.txt

El-Diablo wrote:

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Then a couple chickens are born with, say smaller bodies, that require less nourishment. These chickens are more adapt to survive and soon they become the chicken norm. Then a mutation for needing more water develops but he doesnt survive long. Evolution doesnt involve him in this environment. But then another mutation arise and antoher. Soon these drought chickens are way different from normal chicken; smaller size, beaks, needing less water, more camoflaged, maybe even better flight. These chickens cant even BREED with the old chickens and produce fertile offspring they are so different. And so a new species is born.

Show me examples of where this has happened with ANY animal that has been observed by science(and not tampered with by science). Is it still a chicken? Where did you get this information? I'm very curious?

Thanks for the info, farmerman. One thing I was wondering, how do schools/colleges handle the teaching of Creationism in classes of mixed religion - with Jews, Hindus, Muslims, Sikhs, Buddists etc alongside Christians (and atheists/agnostics)? Do they have to teach each religions' version of Creation, or just the Christian one? And if so, how do Jews, Muslims etc. react to having Christian doctrine forced on their children? (Although the Jewish version is the same or similar to the Christian one?)

And why are the Christians the only ones here and now in this topic defending Creationism? Where are the Jewish and Muslim members that I know A2K has? I'd be interested to hear some religious input from a non-Christian.

I'M BACK!!! Seems I missed lots of good stuff. Thanks Biliskner for taking over. You seem to have a good handle on alot of the scientific stuff. I have to do research because I am not familiar with a lot of the new scientific theories because they seem to have to make up a new one when the one they are using doesn't quite work the way they want it to.