71
   

Global Warming...New Report...and it ain't happy news

 
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Dec, 2007 09:39 pm
Diest TKO wrote:
Whine all you like, you've in no way established how the scientific community is just going with the flow, and agreeing on what is popular.

You have in no way established whether the scientific community has in fact validly analyzed the data to determine whether its alleged theory is true.

The burden of proof is on you. I don't need to provide proof for your question that exists only in your theoretical world. From what info is given, judge D is incorrect.

T
K
O

"From what info is given" either Judges A, B, and C are correct or Judge D is correct. What info do you perceive me to have given that shows Judge D is incorrect?

By the way, I have not said whether Judges E, F, and G exist, and if they do exist, what their opinions are. I don't even know what the odds are that A, B, and C are correct or Judge D is correct.

Remember you ventured the theory that Judge D is incorrect. I didn't. I never said anything about the correctness of the opinions of Judges A, B, and C, or the opinion of Judge D. It is you that presumes to know whether the critter they are judging is a shaggy dog or not. I don't presume to know that. I never saw the critter. And even if I had seen the critter, I wouldn't know what the official criteria are for deciding whether that critter is actually a shaggy dog or not. So either show your theory is correct, take more time for study, or abandon your theory.
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Dec, 2007 10:39 pm
Pathetic.

You are designing the situation to fit your needs. Judge E, F, G... Z can certainly evaluate the situation how they see fit. You've given no reason to validate your idea that A,B, and C are deciding based on each other.

Judge D, being of decent in opinion, has the purden of proof.

As for Global Warming, you'd love for me to abandon my opinion I'm sure. You'd love to dismiss the greater scientific community for accepting the theory that is man made because they are the majority. The truth is that you like Scientist D, not because he or she is a good scientist, but because they believe as you do. It's easier for you to dismiss others as long as someone validates your opinion.

I'm not impressed.

The evidence continues to converge on human factors being the source.
K
O
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 01:56 pm
Diest TKO wrote:
Pathetic.

You are designing the situation to fit your needs. Judge E, F, G... Z can certainly evaluate the situation how they see fit. You've given no reason to validate your idea that A,B, and C are deciding based on each other.

I do not claim their views are based on each other. I did not say what their views are based on. I did say I do not know what their views are based on. I do claim that what a majority thinks is true, is not necessarily true

Judge D, being of decent in opinion, has the purden of proof.

Nonsense! Each of the four judges have a burden of proof and are not relieved of that burden by whether they are with the majority or with the minority.

As for Global Warming, you'd love for me to abandon my opinion I'm sure. You'd love to dismiss the greater scientific community for accepting the theory that is man made because they are the majority. The truth is that you like Scientist D, not because he or she is a good scientist, but because they believe as you do. It's easier for you to dismiss others as long as someone validates your opinion.

I'm not impressed.

...

I am not dismissing anyone's opinion ... not even your opinion. What I am alleging is that a majority has as much a burden of proof of their opinions as does a minority.

UNDENIABLE FACTS
(1) The earth has been warming over the last 20 years.
(2) The amount of CO2 in our atmosphere has been increasing over the last 100 years.
(3) The amount of CO2 in our oceans has been increasing over the last million years.
(4) The intensity of the sun's radiation has been increasing over the last 100 years.
(5) Over the last 100 years humans are increasing the amount of CO2 they release into our atmosphere.
(6) Earth warming has been causing the amount of the ocean's CO2 to evaporate into our atmosphere.


K
O


You alleged: "The evidence continues to converge on human factors being the source."

I suppose you mean by that statement that humans are the primary cause of global warming. So please provide that evidence you claim "continues to converge on humans factors" are the primary cause of global warming. Remember, opinion is not evidence.

YEARLY AVERAGE TEMPERATURES IN DEGREE C RELATIVE TO A CHOSEN NORM
1850 -0.447
1851 -0.292
1852 -0.294
1853 -0.337
1854 -0.307
1855 -0.321
1856 -0.406
1857 -0.503
1858 -0.513
1859 -0.349
1860 -0.372
1861 -0.412
1862 -0.540
1863 -0.315
1864 -0.516
1865 -0.297
1866 -0.303
1867 -0.334
1868 -0.291
1869 -0.313
1870 -0.302
1871 -0.344
1872 -0.255
1873 -0.331
1874 -0.397
1875 -0.418
1876 -0.403
1877 -0.091
1878 +0.023
1879 -0.265
1880 -0.260
1881 -0.242
1882 -0.246
1883 -0.298
1884 -0.381
1885 -0.362
1886 -0.275
1887 -0.387
1888 -0.337
1889 -0.192
1890 -0.431
1891 -0.378
1892 -0.484
1893 -0.505
1894 -0.444
1895 -0.420
1896 -0.211
1897 -0.243
1898 -0.432
1899 -0.314
===========================================================
1900 -0.223
1901 -0.302
1902 -0.431
1903 -0.509
1904 -0.554
1905 -0.412
1906 -0.329
1907 -0.507
1908 -0.559
1909 -0.564
1910 -0.548
1911 -0.581
1912 -0.491
1913 -0.489
1914 -0.305
1915 -0.213
1916 -0.434
1917 -0.506
1918 -0.388
1919 -0.331
1920 -0.314
1921 -0.261
1922 -0.381
1923 -0.347
1924 -0.360
1925 -0.274
1926 -0.162
1927 -0.254
1928 -0.255
1929 -0.376
1930 -0.165
1931 -0.124
1932 -0.155
1933 -0.297
1934 -0.159
1935 -0.184
1936 -0.152
1937 -0.034
1938 +0.009
1939 -0.001
1940 +0.018
1941 +0.077
1942 -0.031
1943 -0.028
1944 +0.120
1945 -0.007
1946 -0.205
1947 -0.197
1948 -0.204
1949 -0.211
======================================================================
1950 -0.309
1951 -0.169
1952 -0.074
1953 -0.027
1954 -0.251
1955 -0.281
1956 -0.349
1957 -0.073
1958 -0.010
1959 -0.072
1960 -0.123
1961 -0.023
1962 -0.021
1963 +0.002
1964 -0.295
1965 -0.216
1966 -0.147
1967 -0.149
1968 -0.159
1969 -0.010
1970 -0.067
1971 -0.190
1972 -0.056
1973 +0.077
1974 -0.213
1975 -0.170
1976 -0.254
1977 +0.019
1978 -0.063
1979 +0.049
1980 +0.077
1981 +0.120
1982 +0.011
1983 +0.177
1984 -0.021
1985 -0.038
1986 +0.029
1987 +0.179
1988 +0.180
1989 +0.103
1990 +0.254
1991 +0.212
1992 +0.061
1993 +0.105
1994 +0.171
1995 +0.275
1996 +0.137
1997 +0.351
1998 +0.546
1999 +0.296
=========================================================================
2000 +0.270
2001 +0.409
2002 +0.464
2003 +0.473
2004 +0.447
2005 +0.482
2006 +0.421
2007 +0.429
2008 ******
=========================================================================
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 02:16 pm
ican711nm wrote:
I do not claim their views are based on each other. I did not say what their views are based on. I did say I do not know what their views are based on.


ican711nm wrote:
Actually, only Judge D and Scientist D think for themselves. The others just "go along to get along."


Care to clear anything up?

T
K
O
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 02:22 pm
http://www.windows.ucar.edu/tour/link=/sun/images/sunspotnumbers_jpg_image.html
Peaks in Solar Sunspots
1900-1910 = 60
1910-1920 = 100
1920-1930 = 75
1930-1940 = 110
1940-1950 = 150
1950-1960 = 190
1960-1970 = 105
1970-1980 = 155
1980-1990 = 155

Biggest Peaks
1800-1900 = 140
1900-1990 = 190


http://www.ace.mmu.ac.uk/Resources/gcc/figures/2_3.html
Variations in Solar Irradiance Peaks
1890-1910 = 1367.4
1910-1930 = 1367.5
1930-1950 = 1367.9
1950-1970 = 1368.1
1970-1990 = 1368.4
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 02:31 pm
The data you have provided doesn't really help your case.
K
O
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 02:41 pm
Diest TKO wrote:
ican711nm wrote:
I do not claim their views are based on each other. I did not say what their views are based on. I did say I do not know what their views are based on.


ican711nm wrote:
Actually, only Judge D and Scientist D think for themselves. The others just "go along to get along."


Care to clear anything up?

T
K
O

Like I said:
Quote:
I do not claim their views are based on each other. I did not say what their views are based on. I did say I do not know what their views are based on.


But yes, I do believe B just goes along with A to to get along with A regardless of what B's views are actually based on, and C just goes along with A and B to get along with A and B, regardless of what C's views are actually based on. But I also said I do not know what their views are based on. In particular, I do not know what A's views are based on.
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 02:44 pm
Diest TKO wrote:
The data you have provided doesn't really help your case.
K
O

Your failure to provide any data doesn't really help your case. What is it about the data I provided that it doesn't help my case?
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 03:25 pm
ican711nm wrote:
Diest TKO wrote:
ican711nm wrote:
I do not claim their views are based on each other. I did not say what their views are based on. I did say I do not know what their views are based on.


ican711nm wrote:
Actually, only Judge D and Scientist D think for themselves. The others just "go along to get along."


Care to clear anything up?

T
K
O

Like I said:
Quote:
I do not claim their views are based on each other. I did not say what their views are based on. I did say I do not know what their views are based on.


But yes, I do believe B just goes along with A to to get along with A regardless of what B's views are actually based on, and C just goes along with A and B to get along with A and B, regardless of what C's views are actually based on. But I also said I do not know what their views are based on. In particular, I do not know what A's views are based on.


You should try harder to remember what you post in the future. It has to be embarassing. Fact is that you did post their reasons. You're a hack.

As for your data (it's not actually your data) it shows the suns output being very stable while earth's climate changes. Hardly a correlation.

If you want an example of human facotrs... I'l give you one. it took all of 3 minutes to find, and was amongst plenty of others.

http://www.globalchange.gov/

Enjoy.

T
K
O
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 06:07 pm
Diest TKO wrote:


...

As for your data (it's not actually your data) it shows the suns output being very stable while earth's climate changes. Hardly a correlation.

Actually the data I posted shows the sun's radiation increasing and not stable while the earth warms.

If you want an example of human facotrs... I'l give you one. it took all of 3 minutes to find, and was amongst plenty of others.

http://www.globalchange.gov/

Enjoy.

T
K
O

Quote:

http://www.globalchange.gov/
CCSM3 shows global temperatures could rise by 2.6 degrees Celsius (4.7 degrees Fahrenheit) in a hypothetical scenario in which atmospheric levels of carbon dioxide are suddenly doubled. That is significantly more than the 2 degree Celsius (3.6 degree Fahrenheit) increase that had been indicated by the preceding version of the model. William Collins, an NCAR scientist who oversaw the development of CCSM3, says researchers have yet to pin down exactly what is making the model more sensitive to an increased level of carbon dioxide. But he says the model overall is significantly more accurate than its predecessor. "This model makes substantial improvements in simulating atmospheric, oceanic and terrestrial processes," Collins says. "It has done remarkably well in reproducing the climate of the last century, and we're now ready to begin using it to study the climate of the next century."

This model does not include the principle cause of increased CO2 in the atmosphere: that is, evaporation of CO2 from the earth's oceans. Nor does it explain the cause of that increasing evaporation of CO2 from the world's oceans.

Quote:
"In deforested areas, the land heats up faster and reaches a higher temperature, leading to localized upward motions that enhance the formation of clouds and ultimately produce more rainfall," Negri said.

The sun heating regions of the earth's oceans does the same. When ocean water evaporates the CO2 mixed in it also evaporates. When it rains due to cold fronts etc, some of that atmospheric CO2 is precipitated back to the surface of the earth or back into the oceans from whence it came.
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 07:19 pm
Please enlighten me about the soluability of CO2 in H20 and the soluability of CO2 in air.

Pour salt into a glass of water and it will disolve. Keep pouring salt in and at one point, the salt no longer disolves. Do you know why?

Also, I followed on of your sources, and it seems you are being too simplistic. You want to show external forces driving the climate change without giving your data context.

Your source writes 6 full chapters and do you know what their conclusion was?

Quote:

Epilogue
Global climate change results from a combination of periodic external and internal forcing mechanisms, and a complex series of interactive feedbacks within the climate system itself. These climate changes occur over a whole range of time scales from a few years to hundreds of millions of years.
The traditional view of climate change has been one of cause and effect, where the climate system responds, generally in a linear fashion to climatic forcing. Only now is humanity beginning to realise that this view is too simple. In recent years climate models have re-emphasised the complex nature of the climate system and our limited understanding of its behaviour. The very nature of the feedback processes highlights the non-linearity of the climatic system.
External forcing sets the pace of climate change; but the internal (non-linear) dynamics of the climate system modulate the final response. This is true for all time scales. Galactic variations impose external variations in insolation, whilst tectonic movements through mantle convection regulate the climate changes over hundreds of millions of years. Milankovitch orbital variations act as a pacemaker to the internal variations of ocean circulation and atmospheric composition.
Today we may be witnessing one of the most profound climatic changes in the Earth's history. Certainly, larger changes in global climate have occurred in the past, but over much longer time periods. The danger facing the global society today is that anthropogenic global warming may be too fast to allow humans, and other species, to adapt to its detrimental impacts. In addition, through enhanced greenhouse forcing, we may be pushing the climate system towards a bifurcation point, where climatic responses may become highly non-linear through complex feedback processes, driving the system to a completely different, and most probably, inhospitable state for humankind.
The challenge for scientists is to understand the climate system, and ultimately predict changes in global climate. To this end, greater collaboration is required between modellers, empiricists and policy makers. Ultimately, the climate system may be too complex to simulate reliably, and the study of global climate change will remain an imprecise science.
In light of this, the precautionary approach to mitigating the threats of anthropogenic global climate change must be fully recognised and adopted by the international community. In addition, increased emphasis will need to focus on the study and modelling of the impacts of future global warming. Greater integration between scientific and policy scenarios will be beneficial to the management and control of future impacts to society. Greater emphasis on impact scenarios at the regional level is also needed, if society is truly to "think globally" and "act locally". Indeed, the challenge for society as a whole is to respond to current dangers regarding global warming, and ultimately to "manage" the climate system in a sustainable and responsible manner.


Summary - The sun can spike, but the sevarity of the climate's responce is more related to the internal factors. in the last century , tectonic plates haven't made dramatic changes, so the other internal factors are Human ones.

http://www.ace.mmu.ac.uk/Resources/gcc/contents.html

Takes a while to read, but you might learn something.
K
O
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Dec, 2007 07:55 pm
Diest TKO wrote:
Please enlighten me about the soluability of CO2 in H20 and the soluability of CO2 in air.

What do you wish to know about the solubility of CO2 in liquid H2O and the mixability of CO2 in evaporated H2O?

...

Quote:

Epilogue
Global climate change results from a combination of periodic external and internal forcing mechanisms, and a complex series of interactive feedbacks within the climate system itself. These climate changes occur over a whole range of time scales from a few years to hundreds of millions of years.
The traditional view of climate change has been one of cause and effect, where the climate system responds, generally in a linear fashion to climatic forcing. Only now is humanity beginning to realise that this view is too simple. In recent years climate models have re-emphasised the complex nature of the climate system and our limited understanding of its behaviour. The very nature of the feedback processes highlights the non-linearity of the climatic system.
External forcing sets the pace of climate change; but the internal (non-linear) dynamics of the climate system modulate the final response. This is true for all time scales. Galactic variations impose external variations in insolation, whilst tectonic movements through mantle convection regulate the climate changes over hundreds of millions of years. Milankovitch orbital variations act as a pacemaker to the internal variations of ocean circulation and atmospheric composition.
Today we may be witnessing one of the most profound climatic changes in the Earth's history. Certainly, larger changes in global climate have occurred in the past, but over much longer time periods. The danger facing the global society today is that anthropogenic global warming may be too fast to allow humans, and other species, to adapt to its detrimental impacts. In addition, through enhanced greenhouse forcing, we may be pushing the climate system towards a bifurcation point, where climatic responses may become highly non-linear through complex feedback processes, driving the system to a completely different, and most probably, inhospitable state for humankind.
The challenge for scientists is to understand the climate system, and ultimately predict changes in global climate. To this end, greater collaboration is required between modellers, empiricists and policy makers. Ultimately, the climate system may be too complex to simulate reliably, and the study of global climate change will remain an imprecise science.
In light of this, the precautionary approach to mitigating the threats of anthropogenic global climate change must be fully recognised and adopted by the international community. In addition, increased emphasis will need to focus on the study and modelling of the impacts of future global warming
. Greater integration between scientific and policy scenarios will be beneficial to the management and control of future impacts to society. Greater emphasis on impact scenarios at the regional level is also needed, if society is truly to "think globally" and "act locally". Indeed, the challenge for society as a whole is to respond to current dangers regarding global warming, and ultimately to "manage" the climate system in a sustainable and responsible manner.


...

http://www.ace.mmu.ac.uk/Resources/gcc/contents.html
Quote:

http://www.ace.mmu.ac.uk/Resources/gcc/6-11-5.html
6.11.5. Evaluation of the FCCC, the Kyoto Protocol and the UK Programme

The UK is now committed, through the Kyoto Protocol, to a 12% reduction in greenhouse gas emissions by 2008 to 2012 from 1990 levels. The UK Programme of CO2 emission reduction furthermore aims to reduce CO2 emissions by 20% by 2010. Recent energy projections (Dti, 1995) show that the UK is confident of meeting the original commitment of the Framework Convention for a stabilisation in CO2 emissions by 2000, and may exceed it by between 6 and 13 MtC below 1990 levels.

Despite the Kyoto Protocol however, emission reductions of the magnitude shown in Table 6.9 have not yet established themselves on the global or national political agenda. Yet it seems that without more stringent targets for emission reductions, the world will be unable to avert a climate change more rapid than anything that has occurred during geologic time.

Despite current scientific uncertainties regarding the causal link between increased greenhouse gases and a rise in global temperature, it seems probable that current FCCC commitments are at odds with its own underlying objective, to prevent dangerous anthropogenic interference with the climate system in a time-frame sufficient to allow natural ecosystems to adapt.

Although the FCCC aims to be precautionary in nature, just what is required by global policy to prevent dangerous anthropogenic interference with the climate system is far from clear. Comparison of temperature changes observed in the natural analogue, as indicated above, provide a starting framework. Nevertheless, the whole issue of the precautionary principle is at present, poorly defined (O'Riordan & Jordan, 1995). Most usually, it is interpreted to mean the implementation of action to prevent interference with the global climate in spite of scientific uncertainty (Article 3.3, UNEP, 1992). Included within this definition are the ideas of cost-effectiveness and responsibility.

Assigning a monetary (and indeed a moral) value to the impacts of global warming is fraught with the difficulties of ethical subjectivism (Buchdahl, 1997). Turner (1995), and O'Riordan & Jordan (1995) have offered some sort of framework, distinguishing between the weak and strong precautionary standpoints of traditional economists and contemporary environmental analysts respectively. Such plurality of opinion depends to a large extent on differing views on the vulnerability or resilience of the global climate. All parties call for scientific evidence to back up their respective arguments. Ironically, as much of this chapter has illustrated, the greatest scientific uncertainty in climate change prediction is this climate sensitivity or vulnerability to the change in radiative forcing associated with a build up of greenhouse gases. Although the essence of the precautionary principle is its call for preventative action, in spite of existing scientific uncertainty, it paradoxically seems that the very success of the FCCC rests on finding a better understanding of the climate system.

The issue of responsibility for global warming may prove to be even more of a contentious issue as nations try to agree on strategies to protect the global climate. Ultimately, it is not clear how the burden of responsibility should be shared amongst the parties of the FCCC. Article 4.2a of the FCCC recognised the different economic starting points of nations to be considered when drawing up national CO2 reduction strategies. However, should developed nations, such as the UK, be required to shoulder more of the burden of CO2 emission reduction, in light of their substantially greater energy expenditure, present, past and future? Equally, can developing nations reasonably be expected to stabilise or reduce their greenhouse gas emissions to the detriment of their fledgling economies?

Many developing nations regard the developed world as the cause of the global warming problem. Before developing nations attempt to reduce emissions, developed countries, they argue, should implement their own effective reduction strategies. Some see the concept of joint implementation (UNEP, 1992) as a workable solution, but here again, poorer states view this as ineffective at mitigating the threat of climate change.

Perhaps what is really at issue here, and is often conveniently overlooked, is that developing nations, whilst being only minor contributors to the global warming problem at present, are most likely to suffer the severest impacts resulting from any future climate change.

To date, the instruments for achieving policy goals have been solely advisory, as nations have shied away from using legislative measures to implement greenhouse gas emission reductions. This piecemeal approach to climate change abatement could shift the burden of responsibility on to those less able to manage the task (Buchdahl et al., 1995). Clearly, the issue for a nation state is providing the maximum environmental protection commensurate with political acceptability. In the case of the UK the level of acceptable carbon abatement has been defined through a comprehensive consultation process which identified the target reductions, the instruments to achieve these targets and the sectors in which instruments could be deployed with the greatest cost effectiveness and maximum efficiency.
...
K
O
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 05:41 am
You might be able to highlight and change the font size on some words, but do you understand them?
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 06:49 am
steve

Font size does not equal increased comprehension.

Font size is what determines truthfulness or accuracy.
0 Replies
 
miniTAX
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 06:24 pm
Diest TKO wrote:
Please enlighten me about the soluability of CO2 in H20 and the soluability of CO2 in air.

Pour salt into a glass of water and it will disolve. Keep pouring salt in and at one point, the salt no longer disolves. Do you know why?
Because you forgot to stir ? Evil or Very Mad

I've never heard hints that oceans are near CO2 saturation, except from you. Without numbers, you can "prove" anything. Where are your numbers pls?

As to the concept of "solubility of CO2 in air", it's new to me too. I didn't know it exists for gas in gas. Shocked
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 07:01 pm
Steve wrote-

Quote:
You might be able to highlight and change the font size on some words, but do you understand them?


I understand them Steve. It's a salaried work avoidance scheme which leaves them all exhausted.
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 08:58 pm
miniTAX wrote:
As to the concept of "solubility of CO2 in air", it's new to me too. I didn't know it exists for gas in gas. Shocked


Concider yourself told. As for the CO2 soluability in acean water, the burned of proof that this offsets carbon levels in the atmosphere falls on those making that claim.

T
K
O
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 09:13 pm
We know from our personal experience with carbonated drinks such as soda water or ginger ale, that CO2 dissolves in liquid H2O (i.e., water). CO2 also dissolves in water in which other gases such as O2 are also dissolved.

Both H2O vapor and CO2 gas are gases! CO2 gas forms a mixture with the H2O vapor with which it comes in contact in the atmosphere.

Quote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry%27s_law

Henry's law
In chemistry, Henry's law is one of the gas laws, formulated by William Henry. It states that:
At a constant temperature, the amount of a given gas dissolved in a given type and volume of liquid is directly proportional to the partial pressure of that gas in equilibrium with that liquid.

Partial pressure
In a mixture of ideal gases, each gas has a partial pressure which is the pressure which the gas would have if it alone occupied the volume. The total pressure of a gas mixture is the sum of the partial pressures of each individual gas in the mixture.

In chemistry, the partial pressure of a gas in a mixture of gases is defined as above. The partial pressure of a gas dissolved in a liquid is the partial pressure of that gas which would be generated in a gas phase in equilibrium with the liquid at the same temperature.[1] The partial pressure of a gas is a measure of thermodynamic activity of the gas's molecules. Gases will always flow from a region of higher partial pressure to one of lower pressure; the larger this difference, the faster the flow. Gases dissolve, diffuse, and react according to their partial pressures, and not necessarily according to their concentrations in a gas mixture
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 09:16 pm
T
K
Open a can of soda, does it stay carbonated?
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Thu 6 Dec, 2007 09:40 pm
Diest TKO wrote:
T
K
Open a can of soda, does it stay carbonated?

It will for a time which depends on the ambient temperature and pressure. At a constant pressure, the higher the temperature, the less carbonated it will become and the more of it escapes into the atmosphere--the same is true for sea water. As sea water is warmed up, more of the CO2 in it escapes into the atmosphere.
Quote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry%27s_law
Formula and Henry constant
A formula for Henry's Law is:

e^p = e^kc
where:

e is approximately 2.7182818, the base of the natural logarithm (also called Euler's number)
p is the partial pressure of the solute above the solution
c is the concentration of the solute in the solution
k is the Henry's Law constant

Taking the natural logarithm of the formula, gives us the more commonly used formula:[1]

p = kc

Some values for k include:

oxygen (O2) : 769.2 L·atm/mol
carbon dioxide (CO2) : 29.4 L·atm/mol
hydrogen (H2) : 1282.1 L·atm/mol

...

Temperature dependence of the Henry constant
When the temperature of a system changes, the Henry constant will also change.[2] This is why some people prefer to name it Henry coefficient. There are multiple equations assessing the effect of temperature on the constant.

...

The following table lists some values for constant C (dimension of kelvins) in the equation above:

Table 2: Values of C
Gas O2 . H2 . CO2 . N2 . He . Ne . Ar . CO
C= 1700 500 2400 1300 230 490 1300 1300

Because solubility of gases is decreasing with increasing temperature, the partial pressure a given gas concentration has in liquid must increase. While heating water (saturated with nitrogen) from 25°C to 95°C the solubility will decrease to about 43% of its initial value. This can be verified when heating water in a pot. Small bubbles evolve and rise, long before the water reaches boiling temperature. Similarly, carbon dioxide from a carbonated drink escapes much faster when the drink is not cooled because of the increased partial pressure of CO2 in higher temperatures. Partial pressure of CO2 in seawater doubles with every 16 K increase in temperature.[5]
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