What do the insurgents want?

Does "Might make Right"?

Quoting Outofthesky:





"Domination Theory" in a nutshell!

Our policy of subjugation is rationalized!

Rather than cut wasteful consumption, we must "Secure" the supply; and our right to do so is mandated by The Law Of The Wild... "The BIG Fish eats the little fish"!

What rankles me is when the the Big Fish try to pretend that it's a battle between Jesus, Moses and Mohammed... that started with Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and Esau !

When you say that they don't want to live in Little America, are you referring to voting? They don't want to live in a country that allows them to have a say in their government? You do not seem to have a very high opinion of democracy. Voting doesn't make them Little America. Self-determination is a right of all people everywhere.

Self-determination is a right of all people everywhere and people should have a say in their government. The people of Iraq had the right to overthrow their own government - IF THEY WANTED TO. They also had the right not to have someone else do it - IF THEY DIDN'T ASK THEM TO. It's easy to assume that people want what you have - but you may be wrong. Besides, you can only help people who help themselves.

I read the other day that up to a million Iraqis living outside the country will be allowed to vote, including thousands who have settled in the United States. I fear this will do little to reduce the suspicions of the world community regarding the fairness of the election, and may well be used to challenge the legitimacy of the results.

We can debate what the Iraqis really want (or should want) all day, but the truth will come out in the wash.

One thing we can count on, though: No matter how successful or absurd the election is later this month, the Bush Admin will claim a victory. I have every confidence in that prediction!

Let me tell you who these "insurgents" actually are. According to Joe Lieberman, there are about four to twelve thousand of them, total. They amount to leftover fedayeen-Saddam with a smattering of imported jihadis thrown in. The fedayeen-Saddam are remnants of a personal samurai which Uday and Qusay Hussein threw together from the dregs of the streets and prisons of Iraq, and who owe loyalty to the Hussein family and to nothing else in this world. They are like Ceaucescu's orphan brigades which had to be killed out after the fall of the Ceaucescu regime in Romania.

They are men with no options. They have no options in life other than death, and attempting to resubjugate the country which their job was to bully into submission under the baathist regime. They are universally hated in Iraq, and no other country is going to take them. As is plainly evident from their actions, they have zero qualms about killing Iraqis and would gladly kill off two thirds of the population of Iraq to achieve their goal of resubjugating it. Their goal and methods are those of a pure power trip.


Any westernor who claims to "empathize" with these animals is seriously, seriously mixed up.

I have seen estimates upwards of 200 000 by several different sources.


Any westernor who claims to "emphasize" with these animals is seriously, seriously mixed up.[/quote]

...emphasize?

I'm telling you what I heard from Lieberman about three days ago on the radio. Probably just because he's a neocon...

Yep...

...only four to twelve thousand of them, total...they are just leftover fedayeen-Saddam with a smattering of imported jihadis thrown in...they owe loyalty to the Hussein family and to nothing else in this world...they have no options other than death, and attempting to resubjugate the country which their job was to bully into submission under the baathist regime...they are universally hated in Iraq...and they are animals!!!

Yep...and the guys who commandeered airplanes and flew them into buildings were cowards...and stupid cowards at that!!!

No wonder we are going to suffer one of the most devistating, humiliating defeats ever...and that the world is going to be a much more dangerous place as a result.

People like Snake...and the idiots who are pretending to lead us....simply cannot look reality in the face.

They would rather think in these pathetically simplistic...and obviously erroneous...terms.


We are getting what we deserve.

Apparently in your world, the Iraqi people loved Saddam Hussein and the little foibles of gassing people, torturing people, and grinding people up in plastic shredders alive were viewed as the eccentricities of an aging philanthropist, which were tolerated with a smile because of the overall good he was doing for his country.

Am I missing anything?

Are you missing anything?

The point, perhaps.

BINGO! :wink:

You're missing the fact that no one on this board denies Saddam Hussein was a very bad man.
You're also missing the point that many Arab countries despise America, American values, and especially detest American occupation.
You're also missing the point that although Hussein committed these crimes against humanity, he was not universally
despised . As difficult as it is for many of us to imagine a leader such as he with even an infinitesimal amount of support boggles the mind...but combine that with the anti-Americanism of the region, and some sense can be made from the insurgency.
Heck...Saddam even had wavering support (or a self-serving agenda) for Saddam.
Link
Transcript

WOW
I Think it would be safe to say that history repeats itself, it like looking into the future.

http://usinfo.state.gov/usa/infousa/facts/democrac/1.htm
1776 -The history of the present King of Great Britain(Bush is HeavyBlue BLood) is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world. He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

He has forbidden his Governors to pass Laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his Assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them.

He has refused to pass other Laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of Representation in the Legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.

He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable and distant from the depository of their public Records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.

He has dissolved Representative Houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people.

He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the Legislative powers, incapable of Annihilation, have returned to the People at large for their exercise; the State remaining in the mean time exposed to all dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within.

He has endeavoured to prevent the population of these States; for that purpose obstructing the Laws of Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither, and raising the conditions of new Appropriations of Lands.

He has obstructed the Administration of Justice, by refusing his Assent to Laws for establishing Judiciary powers.

He has made Judges dependent on his Will alone, for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries. He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our People, and eat out their substance. He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislature.

He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil Power.

He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation:

For quartering large bodies of armed troops among us:

For protecting them, by a mock Trial, from Punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States: For cutting off our Trade with all parts of the world:

For imposing taxes on us without our Consent:

For depriving us of many cases, of the benefits of Trial by Jury: For transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended offences:

For abolishing the free System of English Laws in a neighbouring Province, establishing therein an Arbitrary government, and enlarging its Boundaries so as to render it at once an example and fit instrument for introducing the same absolute rule into these Colonies:

For taking away our Charters, abolishing our most valuable Laws, and altering fundamentally the Forms of our Governments: For suspending our own Legislatures, and declaring themselves invested with Power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever. He has abdicated Government here, by declaring us out of his Protection and waging War against us.

He has plundered our seas, ravaged our Coasts, burnt our towns, and destroyed the lives of our people.

He is at this time transporting large armies of foreign mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation, and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy the Head of a civilized nation.

He has constrained our fellow Citizens taken Captive on the high Seas to bear Arms against their Country, to become the executioners of their friends and Brethren, or to fall themselves by their Hands.

He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavoured to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers, the merciless Indian savages, whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes, and conditions.

In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Prince, whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people.

Nor have We been wanting in attention to our British brethren. We have warned them from time to time of attempts by their legislature to extend an unwarrantable jurisdiction over us. We have reminded them of the circumstances of our emigration and settlement here. We have appealed to their native justice and magnanimity, and we have conjured them by the ties of our common kindred to disavow these usurpations, which, would inevitably interrupt our connections and correspondence. They too must have been deaf to the voice of justice and of consanguinity. We must, therefore, acquiesce in the necessity, which denounces our Separation, and hold them, as we hold the rest of mankind, Enemies in War, in Peace Friends.

We, therefore, the Representatives of the United States of America, in General Congress, Assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do, in the Name, and by Authority of the good People of these Colonies, solemnly publish and declare, That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be free and independent states; that they are Absolved from all Allegiance to the British Crown, and that all political connection between them and the State of Great Britain, is and ought to be totally dissolved; and that as Free and Independent States, they have full Power to levy War, conclude Peace, contract Alliances, establish Commerce, and to do all other Acts and Things which Independent States may of right do. And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the Protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes, and our sacred Honor.