What does everybody think about the soldier , shooting that?

It is wrong. No, very wrong to condemn everyone in the military for the transgressions of the few. The Court of Public Opinion can also be called a lynch mob, and our servicemen and women deserve better than that.

You have apparently already decided that the young Marine is guilty of murder, of cooly deciding to kill a person that he knew to be an unarmed, wounded prisoner who posed no threat to either himself, or his unit. What you seem to be saying is that there is a policy to mislead the world into believing that we only kill those who deserve to die. No one has in this administration, much less the military, has ever said any such thing.

There is no conspiracy by "hawks" to pursue a war policy, but when war is thrust upon us it must be reluctantly fought.

With every passing day there are fewer of radicals willing and able to attack outside their strongholds.

Forget the issue of whether or not the man is guilty, think about the media issue of how bad it makes us look to have a soldier apparently shooting an unarmed man in the head in a mosque while his friend JOKES about it. Events such as this only add more ammo to the arsenal of the religious leaders and insurgent recruiters who are stirring up Anti-US sentiment in Iraq and the ME in general.

Asherman wrote:

If he did not know that the wounded enemy was unarmed, and reasonably believed that deadly force was appropriate to protect himself and his squad mates, then the killing was justified. It would be murder only if the young Marine knew that the man he killed was unarmed and no threat. What was the Marines state of mind at the time? Was he capable of rationally making the decision to "execute" the wounded enemy, or did his emotional state preclude his forming the necessary intent?

Is this a facet of military law that is so completely different from civilian law?

The definition of murder in the UCMJ is not very different from that in the Common Law.

This is why I am in favor of imbedded reporters. Had that NBC reporter and his camerman not been there to shoot that video, this killing would have gone on and no one would be the wiser. It just makes me wonder how often is this happening, but no one is there to document the killing.

Jessep: You can't handle the truth! Son, we live in a world that has walls. And those walls have to be guarded by men with guns.

Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg?
I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Santiago and you curse the Marines.
You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know: that Santiago's death, while tragic, probably saved lives.

And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives...You don't want the truth. Because deep down, in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that wall. You need me on that wall.

We use words like honor, code, loyalty...we use these words as the backbone to a life spent defending something.

You use 'em as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide, then questions the manner in which I provide it! I'd rather you just said thank you and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon and stand a post.

Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you're entitled to!

Col Nathan R. Jessep {Jack Nicholson), A few Good Men

Good Morning Everybody. The following is an email from my son regarding the NBC report (with embedded reporter Kevin Sites), concerning the Marine who is being investigated for "murdering" the insurgent in Fallaja. I will be sending his mail to every news program's email I can find. I find it sickening that this Kevin Sites is even allowed to be embedded with our Marines, as this isn't the first report I've heard from him that took on a decidely unfriendly tone. My son also gave me permission to release it to anyone that wants to pass it on, as long as it remains unedited.

Quote:

This is one story of many that people normally don't hear, and one that everyone does. This is just one most don't hear: A young Marine and his cover man cautiously enter a room just recently filled with insurgents armed with Ak-47's and RPG's. There are three dead, another wailing in pain. The insurgent can be heard saying, "Mister, mister! Diktoor, diktoor(doctor)!" He is badly wounded, lying in a pool of his own blood. The Marine and his cover man slowly walk toward the injured man, scanning to make sure no enemies come from behind. In a split second, the pressure in the room greatly exceeds that of the outside, and the concussion seems to be felt before the blast is heard. Marines outside rush to the room, and look in horror as the dust gradually settles. The result is a room filled with the barely recognizable remains of the deceased, caused by an insurgent setting off several pounds of explosives. The Marines' remains are gathered by teary eyed comrades, brothers in arms, and shipped home in a box. The families can only mourn over a casket and a picture of their loved one, a life cut short by someone who hid behind a white flag.

But no one hears these stories, except those who have lived to carry remains of a friend, and the families who loved the dead. No one hears this, so no one cares. This is the story everyone hears: A young Marine and his fire team cautiously enter a room just recently filled with insurgents armed with AK-47's and RPG's. There are three dead, another wailing in pain. The insugent can be heard saying, "Mister,mister! Diktoor, diktoor(doctor)!" He is badly wounded.Suddenly, he pulls from under his bloody clothes a grenade, without the pin. The explosion rocks the room, killing one Marine, wounding the others. The young Marine catches shrapnel in the face. The next day, same Marine, same type of situation, a different story. The young Marine and his cover man enter a room with two wounded insurgents. One lies on the floor in puddle of blood, another against the wall. A reporter and his camera survey the wreckage inside, and in the background can be heard the voice of a Marine, "He's moving, he's moving!" The pop of a rifle is heard, and the insurgent against the wall is now dead. Minutes, hours later, the scene is aired on national television, and the Marine is being held for commiting a war crime. Unlawful killing.

And now, another Marine has the possibility of being burned at the stake for protecting the life of his brethren. His family now wrings their hands in grief, tears streaming down their face. Brother, should I have been in your boots, i too would have done the same. For those of you who don't know, we Marines, Band of Brothers, Jarheads, Leathernecks, etc., do not fight because we think it is right, or think it is wrong. We are here for the man to our left, and the man to our right. We choose to give our lives so that the man or woman next to us can go home and see their husbands, wives, children, friends and families.

For those of you who sit on your couches in front of your television, and choose to condemn this man's actions, I have but one thing to say to you. Get out of you recliner, lace up your boots, pick up a rifle, leave your family behind and join me. See what I've seen, walk where I have walked. To those of you who support us, my sincerest gratitude. You keep us alive. I am a Marine currently doing his second tour in Iraq. These are my opinions and mine alone. They do not represent those of the Marine Corps or of the US military, or any other.

Sincerely,
xxxxxxxxxxxx, LCPL USMC

"For those who fight for it, freedom has a flavor the protected never know." -- Written on a C-ration box lid at Khe Sanh, South Vietnam, 1968

"There will be nowhere left for the insurgents to hide. We will fight them until there are none of them left to fight." U.S. Army Gen. John Abizaid, chief of U.S. Central Command


xxxxxxxxxxxx, MGySgt., USMC (Ret.) Not as lean, Not as mean, But still a Marine.

It is clearly time to get the heck out of Iraq. They are fighting an unwinnable battle with a questionable rational, a failing strategy and unclear goals.

Let's bring these kids home. It will save a load of heartache on all sides.

ebrown_p wrote:

It is clearly time to get the heck out of Iraq. They are fighting an unwinnable battle with a questionable rational, a failing strategy and unclear goals.

Let's bring these kids home. It will save a load of heartache on all sides.

We had a national referendum on that on Nov 2. The people selected the candidate who said we would bring the troops home when their job there is finished.

We broke it so we own it (the pottery barn rule). The war is not unwinable but the US has to abandon many of it's assumptions and goals. Iraq under Hussain, and before, was a modern secular state run by a fascist/socialist political movement. If we want to win we have to start where they left off and that is provide security and services. We are doing the first and have completely ignored the second. So to begin with we have to revers our priorities. But that will require a long term commitment and will be expensive.