The anti-gay marriage movement IS homophobic

The point is that people NEVER admit to being homophobes. So it is like the boy who cried wolf. Now do you get it?

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As of this morning, Spain too...

Quote:

Spain Legalizes Same-Sex Marriages

By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: June 30, 2005
Filed at 6:38 a.m. ET

MADRID, Spain (AP) -- Parliament legalized gay marriage Thursday, defying conservatives and clergy who opposed making traditionally Roman Catholic Spain the third country to allow same-sex unions nationwide. Jubilant gay activists blew kisses to lawmakers after the vote.

This, two days following Canada, will send certain US groups right over the edge.

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Scrat wrote:

Chrissee wrote:
You still don't get it.

That's fine. I'm pretty sure I don't want it. ;-)

Chrissee-
You may find this hard to believe, but you aren't the Catholic Church.

I was REALLY surprised and pleased at Spain's decision. I thought they were too Catholic to ever approve gay marriage, so that was a good thing, IMO.

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Religion has nothing to do with that laws are made ... by a social-democratic mayority in parliament and a left government Laughing

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Chrissee wrote:

Hey, I found some help for Baldy, there is a surgeon who works next to one of my best friends who can do the face anyway, supposedly he is the best.

Here is a before and after:

Wow. He does do good work.

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Lash wrote:

Scrat wrote:
Chrissee wrote:
You still don't get it.

That's fine. I'm pretty sure I don't want it. ;-)

Chrissee-
You may find this hard to believe, but you aren't the Catholic Church.
.

Yes I am. What kind of gall does it take for a non-Catholic to lecture a devout, prcaticing, activist Catholic on the doctrines of her faith?

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Walter Hinteler wrote:

Religion has nothing to do with that laws are made ... by a social-democratic mayority in parliament and a left government

Despite being voted down in the Senate, the Spanish parliament passed the law legalizing same-sex marriage and allowing same-sex couples to adopt and inherit each other's property.
The Spanish Senate serves an advisory function only, with the Congress of Deputies having the final say. The 350-member body voted 187-147 to approve, despite protests from the Roman Catholic Church, which officially endorsed protests against the Spanish government for the first time in 20 years.

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Chrissee wrote:

The point is that people NEVER admit to being homophobes. So it is like the boy who cried wolf. Now do you get it?

And you and Debra Law think me a liar and that you've stumbled onto the one homophobe in the world who supports same-gender unions? Top work that! Give yourself a nice pat on the back, genius.

With you as spokesperson for the effort, I do believe you could turn the tide of public opinion AGAINST same-gender unions. (Fortunately, my opinion isn't tied to whether or not I get treated decently by one arrogant, ignorant individual.)

Feel free to insult me all you like from here on out; I won't be reading anything with your name next to it. I'm done with your foolishness. I come here for intelligent and civil discourse, and you seem up to neither.

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Wow! You still don't get it and you denigrate my ability to converse intelligently.

Pot. Kettle. Black.

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Walter Hinteler wrote:

Walter Hinteler wrote:
Religion has nothing to do with that laws are made ... by a social-democratic mayority in parliament and a left government

Despite being voted down in the Senate, the Spanish parliament passed the law legalizing same-sex marriage and allowing same-sex couples to adopt and inherit each other's property.
The Spanish Senate serves an advisory function only, with the Congress of Deputies having the final say. The 350-member body voted 187-147 to approve, despite protests from the Roman Catholic Church, which officially endorsed protests against the Spanish government for the first time in 20 years.

That is damn interesting. I must say, I am surprised that Spain is so progressive on this issue. Good on them - and for resisting the Church on this matter.

I wonder how influential the church usually is in Spanish politics?

Wow!!!!

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The Church is not the Bishops or the Pope, the Church is the people. Non-Catholics get a distorted view about the Church from sensationally reported pronouncements from Rome. Only the fundamentalists listen to that BS from the Pope on birth control and the like.

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Throughout most of moder European history, Spain has been synonymous with conservatism. England, Holland, Austria and their German allied fought a long, bloody war against Louis XIV to prevent his grandson from mounting the Spanish throne. Of course they did it in their own political interests, but they claimed they were acting in the interest of Spain. Since their crazy old, late King Carlos II had willed the throne to the Duke d'Anjou, however, the ungrateful Spaniards supported their new King. Thereafter, they supported the Bourbons through thick and thin, even after Napoleon removed them from the throne. Spain became Napoleon's Vietnam-like quagmire, eating up by some accounts a half-million French and allied troops. When, after those wars, Isabella presided over the election of a liberal government, another Carlos lead a long and bloody civil war against the Crown, largely aided and abetted by the peasants of remote area and their priests. Most intelligent people are aware of the bitter and tragic civil war fought in Spain in the 1930's.

I don't suggest that all Spaniards are and always have been conservative--i am saying this represents a profound and significant departure from the historical mold of Spanish society.

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Setanta--

Thanks. We agree. I was under the impression that the Catholic Church was very influential among the people of Spain, and also thought this was a surprising departure.

Walter--
I still fail to understand why you always seem to feel the need to disagree with me whether I am right or wrong.

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Lash wrote:

... and also thought this was a surprising departure.

It is not that surprisng that Non-Catholics would have a skewed view about what Catholics REALLY believe.

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Lash wrote:

Walter--
I still fail to understand why you always seem to feel the need to disagree with me whether I am right or wrong.

Did I disagree (here) with you? Sorry - I just wanted to give some more facts besides that Spain is catholic.

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Chrissee wrote:

Wow! You still don't get it and you denigrate my ability to converse intelligently.

Pot. Kettle. Black.

and according to earlier posts.... that would make you racist. Not necessarily my opinion, but if you go back on the thread you will see many indicating such.

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Chrissee wrote:

Lash wrote:
... and also thought this was a surprising departure.

It is not that surprisng that Non-Catholics would have a skewed view about what Catholics REALLY believe.

Of course not. Some Catholics don't know what Catholics believe.

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I was born and raised in the Catholic religion.

As a family, we departed from the Catholic religion when our long-time priest refused to allow my older pregnant sister and her boyfriend to get married in the Catholic church. I guess, my pregnant sister and her boyfriend committed a sin by engaging in premarital sex resulting in a pregnancy and were thus unworthy of God's blessing of their union.

Accordingly, my sister and her boyfriend were married in a non-religious civil ceremony before a state judge.

This demonstrates that the Church is not bound or forced in any manner to perform or recognize marital unions that the Church finds to be morally reprehensible.

This demonstrates the religious freedom of citizens--my family was FREE to leave the Catholic church when our right of individual religious conscience did not conform to our chosen religion.

This demonstrates that my pregnant sister and her boyfriend still had a fundamental right to marry recognized by the State even when their marriage was frowned upon as morally reprehensible by the Catholic church.

Conclusion: The moral disapproval of the religious folk with respect to who may or may not be married in their church cannot serve as a legitimate basis for laws of general application.

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Chrissee wrote:

Lash wrote:
... and also thought this was a surprising departure.

It is not that surprisng that Non-Catholics would have a skewed view about what Catholics REALLY believe.

LOL...! Talk about skewed view...LOL!!!

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Chrissee wrote:

The Church is not the Bishops or the Pope, the Church is the people. Non-Catholics get a distorted view about the Church from sensationally reported pronouncements from Rome. Only the fundamentalists listen to that BS from the Pope on birth control and the like.

Perhaps - but I would guess that it is the hierarchy that attempted to change the government's mind.

I would also have guessed - based on nothing, probably, but a perceived hyper-anxiety and homophobia about male homosexuality in countries like Spain (as there seems to be in its colonies in South America) that Spain would have passed such laws later than many countries.

Well, yah boo sucks to me!!!!

Seldom been happier to be wrong and clearly ignorant.

Here's hoping that my country will pass such laws when we finally get rid of the right wing mob running us right now. If we don't, we shall know just how homophobic we are.

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The anti-gay marriage movement IS homophobic

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