Why Must Some Sacrifice And Some Not?

Business is good, despite the cries to the contrary by the Bushwhacking crowd.

When we were in Europe a couple of weeks ago we paid $5/gal for Regular Unleaded. I filled up yesterday $1.75 here in the Nashville area.

Now, if we were being truly being gouged, I guess we would be paying closer to the $5/gal we paid in Europe.

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If the oil companies weren't gouging we'd be paying 1.35...and they'd still be rich....

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Bi-Polar Bear wrote:

If the oil companies weren't gouging we'd be paying 1.35...and they'd still be rich....

If state & fed government taxes on gasoline were not in the vicinity of 40 cents per gallon or more (sorry, don't know the exact amount at this time in my state) then we'd be paying about 1.35 per gallon.

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will you agree with me that it's a combination deal?

Want to show your patriotism Exxon-Mobil?

Don't take a cut in profits...no one reasonable expects that if you can help it....how about just keeping your profits flat as part of the effort to rid the world of terrorists and help the economy?

riiiiight.. Laughing

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Taxes...taxes...taxes....

In addition, factor in a weak government officials not forcing Detroit & Oil Co's to make efficient autos or alternative fuel source and hear we are, sucking up to the oil co's.

Citizens have been bitching for 30 years about costs of fuel and those we elect have done nothing for 30 years.

Still want to support Democrats and Republicans in this regard??? Every 4 years we hear the same knuckleheads like Kerry saying "I HAVE THE PLAN TO REDUCE DEPENDENCY...YADA YADA YADA>>"

Our elected officials have no guts in this regard (or are on the take).

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Woiyo,

What planet are you on?

Here on Earth we have been doing a fair amount about the costs of fuel. In my country on Earth (the United States) politicians have past many measures aimed at reducing dependency.

We have passed laws to reduce emissions. We have spent money and given tax breaks for alternative fuels. We have worked to raise awareness.

As a result, not only are cars today much more efficient and less polluting than 30 years ago-- we are starting to see dramatic new technology, like hybrid vehicles, on the mass market and are moving forward toward even better advances , like hydrogen.

Now there is plenty more we could do. Taxes on SUV's would seem like a good start to some of us. But, that's the nature of politics. You can accomplish quite a bit... but not everything.

But to say that we have "done nothing" over the past 30 years is simply ridiculous -- at least on my planet.

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" Oil prices surged again this week..."

"Refining (profit) margins are the best in almost 15 years, oil prices are at record highs, and gas prices are near records. It doesn't get any better than this."

"Chairman and chief executive Lee R. Raymond noted that second-quarter earnings improved in all three main areas of Exxon Mobil's business - production, up 39 percent; refining and selling, up 31 percent; and chemicals, up 38 percent."

What part of this do you not understand, larry, woiyo and coastal? It has nothing to do with taxes, motor effeciency, or what is being charged in other countries. If there is a 39% profit on refining, WE ARE BEING GOUGED! Oil companies are profiting while everyone else sacrifices.

Is there another industry (besides Haliburton / War related industry) making that kind of profit in the current economy?

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ebrown - There has been little to no improvement in the internal combustion engine since it was developed over 80 years ago. Piston engines operate then same way today as they did then. Raising the MPG is not going to significantly reduce consumption when you factor in expanding population not only in the US but in emerging nations. China for example has increased their needs 10 fold in the recent years.

Most States and the Fed assess at least a 25% tax at the pump. Is that revenue spent on Research and Development for alternative sources?? Hopefully not since nothing has been created to date.

Over the past 80 years, the airline industry went from piston to jet engines, rails from diesel to electric..automobiles????NOTHING.

If we can put a man on the moon in 10 years, use solar energy to power satelites and spacestations, I would expect that the best and brightest to have developed an alternative fuel source for automobiles and trucks. Yet they have not and I just wonder why?
You state we are making progress?? Where? A few busses running on natural gas is not the answer.

Are we not smart enough to do that? Do you think we do not have the knowledge?

So before you attack me for questioning the intentions of the govt and the auto/oil industries, you might want to expand your though process.

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http://www.toyota.com/prius/

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There have been plenty of other advances to the internal combustion engine in the past 30 years. In fact, engines today look very different to those of 1975.

Computers in cars have been a major change. A computer now controls and monitors how your engine runs.

Your car probably has fuel injection instead of a carbeurator. This is a very big difference in how a engine looks and runs.

There are now synthetic lubricants that make engine run better, and changes to the formulation of gasoline. (When is the last time you had a car that excepted leaded gas. Hint it was probably about 1975.)

Since 1975, the average gas mileage of a US auto has doubled (from 15 mpg, to 30 mpg) and with the advent of new hybrid technology, this number is about to rise signifcantly again.

And before you repeat that mileage doesn't matter, let's do the math. If a car goes 15 mpg, that means it needs 2 gallons to go 30 miles. Now with 30 mpg it only needs 1 gallon.

So with the improvements over the last 30 years, I can use one half the gas to go the same distance.

Are you saying that using half the gas is not a good thing?

Or are you saying that without these improvements, people would just drive less?

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"So with the improvements over the last 30 years, I can use one half the gas to go the same distance.

Are you saying that using half the gas is not a good thing?

Or are you saying that without these improvements, people would just drive less? "

You are missing my point. Regardless of the minor improvements in efficiency, more oil/gas is consumed today then "yesterday". We will continue to consume more as population increase and emerging tech nations begin consuming.

Current economic and political environements provide NO INCENTIVE to business to bring alternative sources to market. Unless govt creates that incentive, stop complaining about 39% profits by Oil companies. Detroit complains it needs YERAS to create and redesign assembly lines. HOGWASH!!

During WW2, assembly line were modified in "weeks" to convert auto line to military lines.

It can be done with an effective govt working in hand with business.

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I repeat...

squinney wrote:

" Oil prices surged again this week..."

"Refining (profit) margins are the best in almost 15 years, oil prices are at record highs, and gas prices are near records. It doesn't get any better than this."

"Chairman and chief executive Lee R. Raymond noted that second-quarter earnings improved in all three main areas of Exxon Mobil's business - production, up 39 percent; refining and selling, up 31 percent; and chemicals, up 38 percent."

What part of this do you not understand? It has nothing to do with taxes, motor effeciency, or what is being charged in other countries. If there is a 39% profit on refining, WE ARE BEING GOUGED! Oil companies are profiting while everyone else sacrifices.

Is there another industry (besides Haliburton / War related industry) making that kind of profit in the current economy?

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woiyo wrote:

ebrown - There has been little to no improvement in the internal combustion engine since it was developed over 80 years ago. Piston engines operate then same way today as they did then.

You must be a young'n and never fiddled with the governor on an old hit n miss engine with it's open crankcase and huge flywheels. But you are partially right in that most of today's IC engines do still have a piston which moves back and forth.

http://antique-engines.com/chase-engines/MVC-010S.JPG

http://antique-engines.com/chase-engines/MVC-008S.JPG

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Smaller does not mean better.

It still runs on gasoline or diesel fuel.

They still have flywheels!

Why has there never been any expansion of the Wankel engine which was much more efficient that en the piston engine?

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squinney wrote:

I repeat...

squinney wrote:
" Oil prices surged again this week..."

"Refining (profit) margins are the best in almost 15 years, oil prices are at record highs, and gas prices are near records. It doesn't get any better than this."

"Chairman and chief executive Lee R. Raymond noted that second-quarter earnings improved in all three main areas of Exxon Mobil's business - production, up 39 percent; refining and selling, up 31 percent; and chemicals, up 38 percent."

What part of this do you not understand? It has nothing to do with taxes, motor effeciency, or what is being charged in other countries. If there is a 39% profit on refining, WE ARE BEING GOUGED! Oil companies are profiting while everyone else sacrifices.

Is there another industry (besides Haliburton / War related industry) making that kind of profit in the current economy?

I fully understand that the oil companies, over the entire history of the industrial age, has been among the top in profits, and a very good investment for stock and futures speculators.

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woiyo wrote:

Smaller does not mean better.

It still runs on gasoline or diesel fuel.

They still have flywheels!

Why has there never been any expansion of the Wankel engine which was much more efficient that en the piston engine?

Sounds like you should have been questioning the advancement of alternative fuels rather than IC engines. Fuel supply drives engine design, not visa versa.

If you want a Wankel, buy a Mazda RX. Then you can tell us all why it is not more popular.

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Larry434 wrote:

squinney wrote:
I repeat...

squinney wrote:
" Oil prices surged again this week..."

"Refining (profit) margins are the best in almost 15 years, oil prices are at record highs, and gas prices are near records. It doesn't get any better than this."

"Chairman and chief executive Lee R. Raymond noted that second-quarter earnings improved in all three main areas of Exxon Mobil's business - production, up 39 percent; refining and selling, up 31 percent; and chemicals, up 38 percent."

What part of this do you not understand? It has nothing to do with taxes, motor effeciency, or what is being charged in other countries. If there is a 39% profit on refining, WE ARE BEING GOUGED! Oil companies are profiting while everyone else sacrifices.

Is there another industry (besides Haliburton / War related industry) making that kind of profit in the current economy?

I fully understand that the oil companies, over the entire history of the industrial age, has been among the top in profits, and a very good investment for stock and futures speculators.

Your political affiliation has clouded any and all rational thinking on your part.

Oil in my area is at $2.00 a gallon. It will mark a 100% increase from four years ago, it has increased each and every year. They are GOUGING the American public, why you ask? Because they know there will be no investigation into their tactics by this administration. Does California and Enron ring a bell? It sounds like the same deal, except for a screwingover a state, they're screwing the entire American public.

But this is OK in your book, you'll stand by and watch the American public starve, loose health care and jobs while these guys force grandma and grandpa on a fixed income to choose between staying warm or eating.

Yep, you're a true American all the way, screw over anyone and everyone as long as you get your way, it's just utterly disgusting.

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What's with all the YADDA YADDA, woiyo? Do you miss Seinfeld?

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Larry434 informs us:

Quote:

I fully understand that the oil companies, over the entire history of the industrial age, has been among the top in profits, and a very good investment for stock and futures speculators.

Well, thank god you know something. But when you talk about gas being more expensive in Europe, you failed to mention the current rate of exchange. The American dollar doesn't go very far over there.

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Why Must Some Sacrifice And Some Not?

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