restrictive clauses

Forums: English, Esl, Grammar, Language, Writing
Email this Topic • Print this Page

In the following sentence, s it correct for me to assume that Darci is the only daughter in the family but that Steven isn't the only son?

A sister, Darci, and her brother Steven are going to an event.

Thanks!

Topic Stats
Top Replies
Link to this Topic

Type: Question • Score: 2 • Views: 1,065 • Replies: 11

No top replies

@perennialloner,

No.

"A sister" would indicate there is more than one.

There's nothing to indicate that Steven is the only son.

1 Reply

I should like to introduce you to my sister, Amanda, who lives in New York, to Mark, my brother who doesn’t, and to my only other sibling, Evelyn.

I found this sentence online. Apparently I can grammatically determine that Evelyn is a guy (another brother) not a girl but I don't see how. It's something about the commas. I get that the sentence implies that there's another brother, but I don't see how it excludes the possibility of another sister???

1 Reply

@perennialloner,

1. Amanda, who lives in New York
2. Mark, my brother (who does not live in New York)
and
3. Evelyn, another sibling (it's not mentioned where she lives).

Evelyn is a woman's name.

2 Replies

@PUNKEY,

Evelyn is also a man's name.

Just like Marion, Ashley, Daryl, Noel, Kim, Shannon, Joyce and others.

If this sentence was constructed to determine gender, I'm sure it was used on purpose.

0 Replies

@chai2,

I don't see how "a sister" indicates there's more than one sister, within a family, that is. "A sister and brother go to the event." There could be more than one, but I don't think it specifically indicates that.

0 Replies

Quote:

Update: There has been a “correction”. Gwynne accepts that the original sentence didn’t rule out other brothers called Mark. The new version reads:

I should like to introduce you to my sister Amanda, who lives in New York, to Mark, my brother who doesn’t, and to my only other sibling, Evelyn.

And the new justification for Evelyn’s being male is:

The absence of a comma before “who doesn’t” makes that clause part of the definition of “Mark, my brother”, implying that there are other brothers. A comma after the words “my brother” would mean that there was only one brother.

It’s still wrong.

I agree that “Mark, my brother who doesn’t” implies that he’s not the only brother. But, using the same approach to commas and restrictive clauses, “my sister Amanda” still implies that she’s not the only sister. So poor Evelyn’s sex is still unknowable.

Adding a comma after “sister” would fix the sentence:

I should like to introduce you to my sister, Amanda, who lives in New York, to Mark, my brother who doesn’t, and to my only other sibling, Evelyn.

Although it would still be too ponderous and intricately self-satisfied to count as an effective piece of communication.

This is a piece from the website I got the sentence from https://stroppyeditor.wordpress.com/2013/04/15/the-telegraphs-incompetent-grammar-test/

It says that if "my sister Amanda" doesn't have a comma to make it "my sister, Amanda" then it would still be appropriate to assume that Amanda isn't the only sister.

I want an explanation of that, if possible.

1 Reply

@PUNKEY,

PUNKEY wrote:

Evelyn is a woman's name.

Some basic checking can be a good idea.

Some notable male Evelyns...

Evelyn Waugh (1903–1966), English satirical novelist, whose first wife was also named Evelyn

http://www.nndb.com/people/836/000079599/waugh-1.jpg

Evelyn Baring, 1st Earl of Cromer (1841–1917), Consul-General of Egypt from 1883 to 1907

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c2/LordCromer.jpg/220px-LordCromer.jpg

Evelyn Wood (teacher) (1909–1995), American advocate of speed reading

Evelyn Baring, 1st Baron Howick of Glendale (1903–1973), Governor of Kenya from 1952 to 1959

Evelyn King (politician) (1907–1994), British member of Parliament

Evelyn Owen (1915–1949), Australian inventor of the Owen submachine gun

Evelyn Pierrepont, 1st Duke of Kingston-upon-Hull (c. 1655 – 1726)

Evelyn Seymour, 17th Duke of Somerset (1882–1954)

Evelyn Webb-Carter, former advisor to Elizabeth, the Queen Mother and current Controller of the Army Benevolent Fund

Evelyn Wood (British Army officer) (1838–1919), British Field marshal, Victoria Cross recipient

Evelyn Robert de Rothschild, British financier and member of the prominent Rothschild family.

0 Replies

Quote:

I should like to introduce you to my sister Amanda, who lives in New York, to Mark, my brother who doesn’t, and to my only other sibling, Evelyn.

We cannot deduce Evelyn's gender from this.

0 Replies

@perennialloner,

perennialloner wrote:

I want an explanation of that, if possible.

Simply put, he is wrong.

0 Replies

Curious contrex, is the male and female Evelyn pronounced the same?

I ask because as you probably know, in the U.S. we pronounce the name differently than in the UK.

1 Reply

@chai2,

chai2 wrote:

Curious contrex, is the male and female Evelyn pronounced the same?

I ask because as you probably know, in the U.S. we pronounce the name differently than in the UK.

Same for male and female in the UK. I didn't really know that US pronunciation differed, but a quick Google confirms that you Yanks don't say it eve lyn like we do for both men and women. You say the Ev like the start of 'ever'; we say it like the name of Adam's wife. The second e tends to be rushed or skipped, making the name two syllables. Apparently there is a male character on Downton Abbey named Evelyn Napier, pronounced Eev-lin. (I don't watch Downton Abbey).

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/downtonabbey/images/8/8c/-Evelyn_napier.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20130308190240

0 Replies

restrictive clauses

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know