Religious belief and politics

(PKB retrieves 6 pk from fridge. Passes cold one to Boom, D-Tom, fishin' and Mesquite. Sits and puts feet up. Bottoms up!)

Nietzsche, in Beyond Good and Evil, does a long analysis of the meaning of punitive justice. Condensed (and oversimplified), he points out that criminals tend to view their apprehension as an unfortunate accident, such as hiking in the mountains and being overtaken by a landslide. He cogently points out that criminals do not commit crime in the belief that they will be caught, or do commit crime without a consideration of that issue. He then examines what punitive justice does do which has value to society, and comes to the conclusion that its most valuable social function is revenge.

Ok. I gotta tell you all about this experience I had with a good friend of mine. She was 22 and she got pregnant. Well, she was terrified! I mean you couldn't even talk to her about her situation without her bursting into tears. There was so much going on in her life. Her little sister (16 at the time) had run away from home and her mother was pretty much shattered and was totally consumed with tracking down the runaway. Cyn, was a good girl. She was in college and working. Seeing a really nice guy but there were no intentions of marriage. Just companionship. I think Cyn was really trying to fill a void with the guy because her mother was not there for her and I was out of state at another school and only had contact with her via the internet, phone and occasional trip on long weekends. Well, when she got pregnant, like I said she flipped! She was irrational! I NEVER suggested she end the pregnancy or anything. I almost wish I had given her better advice but like they say, "hindsight is 20/20".
So Cyn went to the doctor and found out she was 6 weeks along. This depressed her even more because she was hoping it was a false positive. She got some kind of cold or something as I recall and I told her to take something for it and her reply to me (which has remained with me for all these years) was that she couldn't take anything because it might hurt the baby! This she says after she has already made up her mind to end the pregnancy. Irrational. I knew she was cracking up and I thought about calling her mother but I didn't. I was no wiser than she I guess.
I ended up going with Cyn that day in '92. I found myself sitting with her in the waiting room that was packed with all types of women. All types. There were prostitutes with their pimps, college girls bubbly talking about their schools and parties and stuff, there were girlfriends and boyfriends, there were women there with other women as support but the most striking thing was this young black girl who entered and seated herself directly across from Cyn and me. She couldn't have been more than 16, maybe 17. She looked so defeated. She sat with this little brown paper sack rolled closed in her lap. She didn't look up. She was alone and just sat there starring at the floor. I tried not to look at her too much but I couldn't help but wonder about what had happened in her life that had led her to this point. We waited about 40 mins and Cyn was called back. I left the clinic and went out front to sit in the car.
Some time later an ambulance pulled into the lot and I sat watching the EMT's as they exited the ambulance with a gurney. I had to go in to check on Cyn. I didnt' want to but I did. It wasn't her. One of the bubbly college girls had sever complications with her procedure and had to be rushed to the hospital for surgery.
On the ride back to her campus Cyn didn't say a word. I think she thought everything would be back the way it was before the pregnancy but apparently it wasn't. She suffered for months with guilt and depression. She moved off campus with her boyfriend and he suddenly abandoned her. She had cracked completely up. She would trash the apartment, dumping garbage in the living room and breaking things. A year later she had finally gotten counselling and had gotten herself back from the brink of despair but to tell you the truth I don't think she has ever really completely recovered from the entire mess.
Do I feel guilt for my part in it? Yeah, I do. I feel responsible to a degree. I say "to a degree" because I was "young and irresponsible". I feel responsible but I also know that what's done is done and there can be no going back. That Cyn has to live with and I have to live with.
So there is ONE story. One story in a million or more that happen yearly. Yes, we do need to reach out to young women and young girls. I certainly wasn't equipped at 21 to counsel my friend on what her choices were. I would not deny Cyn the option of choosing because it was her life. I do however wish there had been better resources available to counsel her. That clinic was like----well, cold. It was like they were there only for the job at hand and the money and aside from that you were ushered in, shown a tape of the procedure, whisked into the back, given Morphine and then it was done and afterwards they booted you out the door. THAT is what should be stopped. There is no counselling, no offering of alternatives. Nothing but give us the money and lie down and it will all be over soon. But for Cyn it all wasn't over soon.
I don't want to go on with this anymore as I have throughly depressed myself.

It's a good story PKB. One people need to hear every now and then even though the subject can get a bit heavy and depressing.

btw, beer = good!

Hey! Thanks for the beer, PKB.

Sentanta, I'm curious if you've ever seen the news footage of the prisioner being taken through the airport, and the father of the child victim pretends to be talking on the pay phone, then turns and shoots the criminal dead? To me, that's revenge.

How anyone can feel satisfaction over the sanatized execution of current criminals is beyond me.

Not that I'm offering up a different method.

But I do think of Gary Gilmore, suddenly Morman again, requesting a firing squad and making it ugly again.

"Vengence is mine" sayeth the Lord. Though I'm not Christian I think we should leave revenge up to him.

But again, perhaps not having ever been the victim of a violent crime I can't really speak of revenge.

PKB, you did the right thing. It wasn't your counsel that was needed - it was your steadfast friendship through a troublesome time.

I know many women who have had abortions and while they always feel a sad about it, they also feel relief.

There should be better resources. Not everyone has a village.

You should not feel guilt or shame for being a good friend. She should not feel guilt or shame for her decision.

No, Boom, i'm not familiar with that, however, i was watching the live television coveage when Jack Ruby shot Lee Harvey Oswald, so i know the feeling all too well. I was also up all night (home alone) when Bobby Kennedy was shot, and saw that live as well . . . not good things for young minds . . . the 60's were a wild ride, and sometimes they were hell on earth . . .

yep, a pretty good beer, man. tastes great, less filling!

i really don't know what else you could have done. it's unfair that a young woman should have her brain scrambled like that. but, wouldn't it be just as unfair to bring an unwanted child into the world?

I don't think anyone who has ever seen that Dallas Morning News photo of Oswald being shot could ever forget it. The 60s were rich with such images.

Speaking of images, there was one in my paper today that I can't shake. It was one of an Oregon delegate at the Republican convention. Her long overly manicured hands clasped in a prayerful mode, her eyes closed and her head thrown back....

I was just waiting for Benny Hin to smack her on the forehead and pronounce her "cured".

That is the image of the current election that will forever be with me.

Sometimes I hate photography.

and thanking jesus for the big tax cut? this is the kind of hystrionics that just screams " look at me ! i AM a good christian".

look, these are the kind of religious zealots that make me nuts. it's all for show. i feel fine with saying that because according to the bible, god knows every mind (my wording). if this be true, there is absolutely no need for all of this amen corner, one nation, UNDER GOD, my faith stuff. or school prayer or the big ten in court rooms, for that matter...

so when these types of christians put on the big show and talk about how much money they give to the church, etc. i have to wonder if they just like feeling superior.

on the other hand, there are many christians i know and respect that you would never know "walked with the lord" from thier rhetoric. one of them being my sister in law. it was nearly 15 years before she mentioned it, and even then i asked her. till then, i just thought she was a plain old decent and moral person.

now, to me, that is a person living the word, not spewing it.

I have posted this before but here goes one again. The republicans have controlled the House and Senate for the last eight years. They have controlled the presidency for almost 4 years. What have they one about abortion except talk it too death. If they were really christian as they claim they would have passed a law declareing it illegal. It is just another emotional issue they can use to thier advantage without really doing anything about it. More lies and useing the stupidity of the common man to keep themselves in power.

Amen to that D-Tom. That is what I call a Thomas Jefferson Christian.

I had to leave for a while, but I'll have that beer now. Thanks, PKB.

You demonstrate a lack of understanding of the law making process. The Congress and President can't simply "pass a law declaring it illegal" and over-ride a Supreme Court ruling saying it's a Constitutional Right. The only way to over-ride a Supreme Court ruling is to amend the Constitution which takes more than just a simple majority in the Congress.

That being the case who is using the "emotional issue" to their advantage and lying - them or you?

Show where the republicans have done more than use retoretic to try to defeat abortion. Have they even introduced a bill to change the constitution or have they done what they do best which is bend the truth to thier politicle advantage. Oh look at me all you religious soilders. Im talking about abortion every day but doing nothing substantial but jack my jaws about it. And before you accuse me of being for abortion im not but I know when Im being emotionally used by politicians both secular and religious.