9
   

GOP should allow guns at convention

 
 
Lilkanyon
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 May, 2016 04:57 pm
I find the gun/weapon argument intriguing because those that use them the most as a form of self defense is the urban black population. The NRA consistently says that more guns will lessen violence due to guns. I think he compares them to nuclear weapons. If we all have them, noone will shoot. I would sure like to hear from the inner city communities about how they feel about this.

And Im going to let you in on a big secret. The white populations that go on and on about the 2nd amendment and right to bear arms and all that is purely based of fear of the black man. It has existed since the end of the civil war and will always exist. As long as the white man believes a black man will never break into his home because he will have his chest shot out, the belief guns as a necessity will always exist.

The NRA has fed on that and also in the pocket of big gun manufacturers that have huge lobbying power in this country. Only 5% of gun owners are members of the NRA but their lobby power is unpropotional to the thoughts of the average gun owner.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 12 May, 2016 05:23 pm
@Lilkanyon,
Lilkanyon wrote:
The white populations that go on and on about the 2nd amendment and right to bear arms and all that is purely based of fear of the black man.

Nonsense.


Lilkanyon wrote:
The NRA has fed on that and also in the pocket of big gun manufacturers that have huge lobbying power in this country.

More nonsense.
Lilkanyon
 
  2  
Reply Thu 12 May, 2016 05:28 pm
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

Lilkanyon wrote:
The white populations that go on and on about the 2nd amendment and right to bear arms and all that is purely based of fear of the black man.

Nonsense.


Lilkanyon wrote:
The NRA has fed on that and also in the pocket of big gun manufacturers that have huge lobbying power in this country.

More nonsense.


Prove it! Please tell me the NRA is not financed heavily, if not exclusively by big gun manufacturers!

If the NRA really cared about the rights of all citizens to own guns, why is no black population reached out to to reserve their right to own guns? Maybe there is no empirical proof, but the lack of evidence can also be proof as well.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 12 May, 2016 06:23 pm
@Lilkanyon,
Lilkanyon wrote:
Please tell me the NRA is not financed heavily, if not exclusively by big gun manufacturers!

The NRA's power has nothing to do with financing, and nothing to do with gun manufacturers.

The NRA's power comes from all the people who will vote Congressmen out of office if they dare to violate the Second Amendment.

The gun manufacturers answer to the same set of people. If the manufacturers cross us, we boycott them into bankruptcy.

They've learned not to cross us.


Lilkanyon wrote:
If the NRA really cared about the rights of all citizens to own guns, why is no black population reached out to to reserve their right to own guns?

The NRA is happy to see black people carry guns. It is the NAACP who wants black people to be disarmed.


Quote:
http://www.a-human-right.com/agreement.jpg
Lilkanyon
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 May, 2016 06:25 pm
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

Lilkanyon wrote:
Please tell me the NRA is not financed heavily, if not exclusively by big gun manufacturers!

The NRA's power has nothing to do with financing, and nothing to do with gun manufacturers.

The NRA's power comes from all the people who will vote Congressmen out of office if they dare to violate the Second Amendment.

The gun manufacturers answer to the same set of people. If the manufacturers cross us, we boycott them into bankruptcy.

They've learned not to cross



Lilkanyon wrote:
If the NRA really cared about the rights of all citizens to own guns, why is no black population reached out to to reserve their right to own guns?

The NRA is happy to see black people carry guns. It is the NAACP who wants black people to be disarmed.

"Theyve learned not to cross us." Who do you mean?



Quote:
http://www.a-human-right.com/agreement.jpg



And Im sure you deny white privelege too.
Lilkanyon
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 May, 2016 06:29 pm
@Lilkanyon,
You are not honestly using the words of the KKK to prove your point, are you? I think my point was proven purely by your response.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 12 May, 2016 06:39 pm
@Lilkanyon,
Lilkanyon wrote:
You are not honestly using the words of the KKK to prove your point, are you?

I did not use the words of the KKK at all.


Lilkanyon wrote:
I think my point was proven purely by your response.

My response explained that the truth is completely opposite to your point.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 12 May, 2016 06:47 pm
@Lilkanyon,
Lilkanyon wrote:
oralloy wrote:
The NRA's power has nothing to do with financing, and nothing to do with gun manufacturers.
The NRA's power comes from all the people who will vote Congressmen out of office if they dare to violate the Second Amendment.
The gun manufacturers answer to the same set of people. If the manufacturers cross us, we boycott them into bankruptcy.
They've learned not to cross us.

"Theyve learned not to cross us." Who do you mean?

The gun manufacturers no longer cooperate with gun control. They know that they will end up in bankruptcy court if they do.
Lilkanyon
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 May, 2016 07:42 pm
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

Lilkanyon wrote:
oralloy wrote:
The NRA's power has nothing to do with financing, and nothing to do with gun manufacturers.
The NRA's power comes from all the people who will vote Congressmen out of office if they dare to violate the Second Amendment.
The gun manufacturers answer to the same set of people. If the manufacturers cross us, we boycott them into bankruptcy.
They've learned not to cross us.

"Theyve learned not to cross us." Who do you mean?

The gun manufacturers no longer cooperate with gun control. They know that they will end up in bankruptcy court if they do.


I never said gun makers cooperate with gun control. They cooperate with gun advocates like NRA who are paid to lobby congress to suppress comprehensive gun safety laws like universal backbround checks which the majority of ALL americans agree with.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 12 May, 2016 07:54 pm
@Lilkanyon,
Lilkanyon wrote:
oralloy wrote:
Lilkanyon wrote:
oralloy wrote:
The NRA's power has nothing to do with financing, and nothing to do with gun manufacturers.
The NRA's power comes from all the people who will vote Congressmen out of office if they dare to violate the Second Amendment.
The gun manufacturers answer to the same set of people. If the manufacturers cross us, we boycott them into bankruptcy.
They've learned not to cross us.

"Theyve learned not to cross us." Who do you mean?

The gun manufacturers no longer cooperate with gun control. They know that they will end up in bankruptcy court if they do.

I never said gun makers cooperate with gun control.

Correct. It was my post that I was explaining.


Lilkanyon wrote:
gun advocates like NRA who are paid to lobby congress to suppress comprehensive gun safety laws like universal backbround checks

We are not paid. The reason why we dominate Congress and block gun control is because we care about freedom and civil rights.
Lilkanyon
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 May, 2016 09:14 pm
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

Lilkanyon wrote:
oralloy wrote:
Lilkanyon wrote:
oralloy wrote:
The NRA's power has nothing to do with financing, and nothing to do with gun manufacturers.
The NRA's power comes from all the people who will vote Congressmen out of office if they dare to violate the Second Amendment.
The gun manufacturers answer to the same set of people. If the manufacturers cross us, we boycott them into bankruptcy.
They've learned not to cross us.

"Theyve learned not to cross us." Who do you mean?

The gun manufacturers no longer cooperate with gun control. They know that they will end up in bankruptcy court if they do.

I never said gun makers cooperate with gun control.[/q

uote]
Correct. It was my post that I was explaining.


Lilkanyon wrote:
gun advocates like NRA who are paid to lobby congress to suppress comprehensive gun safety laws like universal backbround checks

We are not paid. The reason why we dominate Congress and block gun control is because we care about freedom and civil rights.


K Trump, the double speak doesnt work on actual intelligent people. Even from one post to the next you are hypocrisy incarnate. Blaming me for bringing up the KKK when you posted the meme, ect, ect...talk me in circles long enough you come out on top. Got your game man, not buying it.
Brandon9000
 
  0  
Reply Fri 13 May, 2016 04:16 am
@Lilkanyon,
Lilkanyon wrote:

I find the gun/weapon argument intriguing because those that use them the most as a form of self defense is the urban black population. The NRA consistently says that more guns will lessen violence due to guns. I think he compares them to nuclear weapons. If we all have them, noone will shoot. I would sure like to hear from the inner city communities about how they feel about this.

And Im going to let you in on a big secret. The white populations that go on and on about the 2nd amendment and right to bear arms and all that is purely based of fear of the black man. It has existed since the end of the civil war and will always exist. As long as the white man believes a black man will never break into his home because he will have his chest shot out, the belief guns as a necessity will always exist.

The NRA has fed on that and also in the pocket of big gun manufacturers that have huge lobbying power in this country. Only 5% of gun owners are members of the NRA but their lobby power is unpropotional to the thoughts of the average gun owner.

Well, I also "go on and on about the 2nd amendment" and I have made no secret of my reasoning. Here it is. I believe that people have an inherent right to defend their lives and the lives of those close to them. If the police are nearby, then fine, let them do it, but they aren't always nearby. In general, I go on and on about the whole Bill of Rights because I believe it is important for people to have a law which states what the government may not do to you or take away from you.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 13 May, 2016 09:12 pm
@Lilkanyon,
Lilkanyon wrote:
K Trump, the double speak doesnt work on actual intelligent people. Even from one post to the next you are hypocrisy incarnate. Blaming me for bringing up the KKK when you posted the meme, ect, ect...talk me in circles long enough you come out on top. Got your game man, not buying it.

Your comment is mostly gibberish, but I am pleased to note that Mr. Zimmerman's gun auction appears to be going well.

Kooks keep flooding the site with fake bids so no one can see the real auction, but it appears that there was a legitimate bid of $485,000 this morning.
0 Replies
 
Lilkanyon
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 May, 2016 10:27 pm
@snood,
snood wrote:

oralloy wrote:

Lilkanyon wrote:
I respect a TRUE need to own guns, not some imaginary boogie man that may or may not break into your house and steal your PS4.

"Need" is a term used by Fascists. Americans have the right to carry guns if we CHOOSE to do so.


Lilkanyon wrote:
Again, use your guns to hunt, and even a pistol on your hip to protect yourself against a rare bear, ok...go ahead and sell me on that. Even those people that need a semi auto to defend farms against wildboar and illegals from the borders. Ok, I will buy that too.

Americans do not have to give anyone a reason for carrying guns. If we
choose to carry them, then it is our right to do so and that is the end of it.




It'd be nice if you gun fucks would be as gung ho about a woman's right to do what she wishes with her own body or with every American citizen's right to vote.







Here here . Sadly thats lost on deaf ears cuz God deemed guns good and personal choice bad somehow...where Im not quite sure...but apparently he did cuz a few people said so.
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 13 May, 2016 10:51 pm
The reasoning seems to be, "because you have the wrong viewpoint on the abortion issue, your argument about guns is wrong." This is illogical. It's like trying to counter someone's debating position by saying, "your mother dresses you funny." Someone's argument about guns is correct if his facts and logic are correct. The only possible way to show that someone's opinion about guns is wrong is to discuss his opinion about guns.
0 Replies
 
Robert Gentel
 
  3  
Reply Sun 15 May, 2016 01:51 pm
@Brandon9000,
Brandon9000 wrote:
You have the right to this opinion, but it is contrary to America's basic creed. For instance, the Declaration of Independence says:

Quote:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.



Yet those people thought it was ok to own other people. This is just another thing they got wrong, we are not magically endowed with rights by a creator, they are all rights negotiated within our society and this is just a hyperbolic way of saying they believe very firmly in some fundamental rights.

Quote:
It is pretty clear from this document that rights are regarded as inherent and not a gift bestowed, or not bestowed, at the pleasure of a government. The Declaration says that:


No, it's clear that those old gents thought so but that doesn't mean it is so.
Robert Gentel
 
  3  
Reply Sun 15 May, 2016 01:55 pm
@Brandon9000,
Brandon9000 wrote:
The founders felt, and expressed during the founding, the idea that rights are inherent and that they were simply enumerating them. The clearest statement of this is the Declaration. They said, for instance, "we find these truths to be self-evident." They also said that governments which are destructive of these rights should be thrown out.


The founders believed all sorts of silly things, including that these rights given to them by their imaginary god only covered white folks. It is self-evident that rights do not magically exist without negotiation within societies as they are entirely a sociological construct (unless you believe in the magical religion stuff that they did).
0 Replies
 
Robert Gentel
 
  2  
Reply Sun 15 May, 2016 01:57 pm
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:
Yes. But there are some rights that all societies must agree to.

If any society does not agree to these rights, then that society must either be destroyed or be forced to change at gunpoint.


This is just an internet-tough-guy way of saying that these are rights you hold dear though. It doesn't in any way refute the notion that all rights are sociological constructs negotiated by societies.
Brandon9000
 
  0  
Reply Sun 15 May, 2016 06:51 pm
@Robert Gentel,
Robert Gentel wrote:

Brandon9000 wrote:
You have the right to this opinion, but it is contrary to America's basic creed. For instance, the Declaration of Independence says:

Quote:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.



Yet those people thought it was ok to own other people. This is just another thing they got wrong, we are not magically endowed with rights by a creator, they are all rights negotiated within our society and this is just a hyperbolic way of saying they believe very firmly in some fundamental rights.

First of all, my point was that in the US, it is generally believed that the Declaration of Independence is our creed, and the Declaration does describe these rights as inherent. Inherent doesn't have to be interpreted in a religious sense.

Secondly, if society negotiated a set of principles which included the government's right to arrest, punish, and even kill, anyone who spoke out against the laws, most of us would have a feeling that this was not morally good. This indicates that the human condition somehow does produce some common ideas about ethics which most people share, so that it isn't really just a matter of negotiation. It is not true that any set of rights or laws which were negotiated would be viewed by society as the end of the discussion. Most people share a few basic ideas of right and wrong which don't depend on the results of a negotiation. For example, most people feel that any creature has the right to defend itself and its family members. If you do believe this, then it follows that people have the right to the means to defend their own safety and the safety of their families.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 15 May, 2016 08:00 pm
@Robert Gentel,
Robert Gentel wrote:
oralloy wrote:
Yes. But there are some rights that all societies must agree to.
If any society does not agree to these rights, then that society must either be destroyed or be forced to change at gunpoint.

This is just an internet-tough-guy way of saying that these are rights you hold dear though.

It has nothing to do with which rights I favor. Some rights are part of the fundamental justification for the existence of government.


Robert Gentel wrote:
It doesn't in any way refute the notion that all rights are sociological constructs negotiated by societies.

If a society were to negotiate away the very rights that justify that society's existence, then that society would become outlaws. Destroying that society would be like hanging pirates.
 

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