Which Religion is the One True Religion?

Well, no....

Intensely, deliberately, secular ideologies have caused more mayhem; massacres; wars; death and destruction in the last century than all the crazy religions combined for the last thousand years...

The world would be hell without religion.

Bereshis bara elokhim....

Moishe3rd
Sorry but I can't agree with you.
Horaits hasamayem horaites hoerets. [sp]

mrmcplad, I have been considering how best to post, what would be the best way for the discussion to go forward. To recap, your belief in your religion has been received by divine inspiration (please correct me if I am wrong).

Despite my earlier attempts to define god more broadly and not just as "he" or "him" and my stating I do not accept this christian definition of god, it would seem you have difficulty in accepting my view on this.

So, I was looking around this site. Some excellent posts from some very intelligent people (yourself included too, of course) and in the "other languages" section there is a thread called "foreign languages and their idioms".

Now I had a look but never found the one which from Chinese is "Ching de dz wha" translates as "a frog in a well" and here is a link to the childrens story to better explain it. http://www.taiwandc.org/folk-fro.htm

I wonder in the context of what we have been discussing , does this idiom have relevance?

My only point was that, in actual fact, the secular philosophies of communism, marxism, fascism, and whatever, (and yes, even capitalist democracy) have literally caused hundred(s) of millions of death and untold destruction in the twentieth century.
For sheer quantity, they have been more destructive than religion.
(The Bereshis was as a counterpoint to your "Fini" :wink: )

mrmcplad, "thee" and "thou" are actually informal versions of the word "you." It was the informal version that was dropped and the formal "you" was adopted as universal.

Therefor, usage of "thee" and "thou" in prayers was originally intended to show familiarity, since we are in fact talking with our father.

Actually, SCoates, we are both wrong. In Middle English "you" is the objective 2nd person plural pronoun. "Thou" is the nominative 2nd person singular. See this website for the full explanation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thou

Originally, it wasn't a matter of formal/informal. But now since we use "you" ubiquitously to mean one or many people as the subject or the object of a sentence (and "your" as the possessive) "thou," "thee," "ye," "thy," and "thine" have all fallen into a new pile of compost. We only open this compost bin nowadays on special occasions (such as scripture reading, viewing Shakespeare, or occasional meetings with the Society of Friends).

I humbly submit that bringing these words out only on rare occasions has made them "feel" more formal in our society's collective unconscious. (I regret to admit that I have not yet tested this hypothesis with double-blind, statistically sound surveys and tests to determine the mindset of our modern society).

-MrMcPlad

That may have been true if it all originated in english. But english is trying to fill a mold. In studying other languages, which, in fact, have both formal and informal (often the formal is also plural), the informal or familiar case is reserved for prayers. This is in languages where both cases are still active, unlike english.

This holds true, even for restored churches, such as the LDS church. When the gospel is taught to other countries, LDS missionaries are instructed to have converts pray in the informal language for whichever language they are native to, just as english speaking members do. I can explain why I chose this example if need be.

I realize that is an isolated example, but I am assuming nothing. The "feel" that it is informal is based on assumption.

I hope I don't sound ruthlessly opinionated. But I don't believe that my opinion could be changed, and that may make me seem rude, but I'm only stating my case for the fun of it.

Michael_S, I appreciate your concern. I am well aware of the danger of keeping one's mind closed, content to accept that which is placed before him. Plato had a similar idiom as the one you described: "The Allegory of the Cave."

Suppose I gave you a Christmas present. It comes in a large box wrapped in paper and ribbon and has a big bow on top. You might sit in front of it for hours at a time, pondering and wondering what might be in it. You might even take some guesses at it: a teddy bear! a new guitar! a collection of hit records! Soon your hopes get the best of you and you're convinced that its the Red Ryder BB gun you've begged Santa for every year since you were five.

You have defined your Christmas present in your mind. Imagine your dismay when you finally open it and discover a box full of encyclopedias.

Instead of making definitions based on speculation and supposition, let's just open the package and find out for ourselves. Have you asked Him yet, Michael_S?

--MrMcPlad

I find that Augustinian and Hegelian philosophy convince me pretty well of Christianity as a good model. I'm amazed at how little the philosophy found in the Bible is mentioned. Until after I started studying a little philosophy and actually picked up the Bible and read parts of John I didn't know that there much beyond "God loves us all; pray to Him when you need help" in terms of intellectual backing. Granted, I read the Bible for TRUTH, not facts, so I allow myself to discount contradictions that are irrelevant to the truth that the religion contains.

how best to answer has had me thinking. Firstly you had said,
and I had replied,
In your next post you asked and I had replied and then in the next you say and on this one I tried to suggest that God may mean much more to many more than just myself, to which you asked.

Now, obviously I am not wishing to enter a "oh yes it is, oh no its not" type of discussion, and since I do not accept the question you are asking, an answer cannot be forthcoming.

So on the surface it would seem we have agreed to disagree. However, having respect for what you have written before which I feel is very much the complete truth from your heart , it would seem as have suggested that there is much more to god than the christian definition, the onus is on me to back up what I am saying.

My fear is . that if you are more interested in promoting the Christian view , rather than having an open debate. Our discussion won't last long. Would you like to take a roundabout route of discussion ?

My approach was a bit pushy; I apologize.

Instead of merely promoting my view, and rather than debating endlessly back and forth 'til we're blue in the face, let's have an open-minded discussion...between friends. I have some more I would like to say about the progression of religious ideologies through the ages; what can I learn from you?

--MrMcPlad

I haven't read this entire thread but would like to answer.

Who said there was a "true" religion? Religions are rather limited in what they can "teach." When we mature we must put away this following of what someone else has told us and study any and all that we question and/or are curious about. I read the entire Bible myself when in my 40's, plus hundreds of books to follow. I know what to do now, how to live, but learned that mostly from experience. Can't say I would have learned from experience if I never studied all that I studied and thought about, comparing one thing with another, reaching for answers, remembering and making connections, stretching my brain.

All anybody needs is themselves and their willingness to learn and experience. We WILL get what we want and we WILL eventually want the right thing, do the right thing. Most of us backstep, make up, backstep again. T'ain't easy.

I havent read the entire thread either, but i have a question o the person who started it.

Before asking what is the rue religion, shouldnt you first ask whether there is a God? Actually lets use the word Creator beccuase from what i have seen, the word God gets some poeple energized. So shouldnt we first ask if there is a Creator of this universe first? It wouldnt make sense to assign a religion to a Creator if we dont even know the Creator exists.

Can you all Imagine the world how it was before religion, 1,000 BC humans were degraded cave-dwelling savages, we would still be eating people righ now if it wasnt for Religion which created "humanity" ....Please Respect ALL religions

Gimme a break!

Please consider all religions to most likely be superstition gone apeshyt.

Rafick wrote



Best laugh I had all week. "Religion created Humanity." Religion fosters hatred, intolerance, war, genocide, massacre as well as being a detriment to progress.

Which Religion is true
Which religion?
I have gone through some of the interesting discussion on this thread, Here's my view on the subject, I hope that atleast some of the participants will have the patience to go through all of it & offer comments

If one agrees that we need religion to guide us through our lives than the question arises which religion out of the many to choose?
Looking around us we find a diversity of religions,
What do the major religions have in common?
1-The concept of a creator, even in religions believing in more than one God there is the concept of a 'supreme God' (the most powerful of all gods)
2-Prophets or messengers of God.
3-The concept of good and evil.
4-The do's and don’ts and other concepts described in a “holy book” revealed to the prophet, and the prophet’s own teachings to mankind.
5-Some concept of life here after.
6-The concept of some form of accountability for one’s deeds in this word “the judgement day”.
7-Mention of other religions in the holy books.
8-Mention of a common event in the various religious books (e.g.” The great flood")

Why do the various major religions have things in common?
Could it be that the source of all the major religions and many of the minor ones is the same? Even though they are widely separated in terms of time and geography.
It is clear that there are many religions having many things in common (with many differences as well). Where do we go from here? How do we choose a religion? Which religion is right?
For most of the people in this world, there is an “inherited religion”, the religion followed by their parents, and the majority follows it blindly to a greater or lesser degree for the rest of their lives. But let’s be honest, when we are so choosy about even minor things (like the color of the dress that will suit me best). How can we go on with our lives without ever thinking about which religion is the right one to follow?
Throughout the history of mankind and in all parts of the world the creator has sent many “instruction manuals” in the form of holy books & many “friends” or the Prophets who told us the do's and don’ts of life and much more. All the Prophets and the holy books, (at least of all the major religions) were true and authentic as and when they were revealed to the prophets. But the problem now is that all the prophets are gone only the books are left. Which one should be followed?
As a Pediatric surgeon I come across many unfamiliar, unusual or rare abnormalities in my patients and I have to look up in the available medical literature, I look for the most authentic and the latest of the materiel available in order to best manage the case.
Having considered what I have said above, the question arises, which is the most authentic and the latest of the book sent by our creator? The answer is undoubtedly “The holy Quran” which is the latest of all the holy books still available in its original form. With no “versions”(Though some people with a deliberate intention to mislead quote the manuscripts of Quran written in different scripts as “Versions” full explanation of this allegation is available at http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Text/Qiraat/hafs.html#1), additions or subtractions (even of a single word). and Islam is the last of all the great religions revealed by our creator “Allah” upon a friend of mankind named Muhammad (may peace be upon him). (You can read about the many features of Quran that logically and scientifically prove its authenticity even to “a nonbeliever” at www.hyahya.org ) Quran is the biggest miracle of Islam that we can witness for ourselves today, unlike miracles of many older religions (like Jesus resurrecting people from dead that occurred about 2000 years back, or Moses competing with the magicians of Pharoh).
There exist in the Taurat (Torah) & Injeel (Gospel), even after the original text has been distorted, clear prophesies indicating the coming of Muhammad (peace be upon him) e.g. Deut. 18: 18,21:21; Psl.118: 22-23; Isa. 42:1-13; Hab. 3:3-4; Matt. 21:42-43; Jn.14:12-17,26-28,16:7-14.

Here I would like to highlight the fact that Islam also endorses and recognizes all other major and minor religions as and when these religions were revealed on to the respective prophets before the advent of Islam. (The number of prophets quoted is about 124,000!)
The Quran say’s in Quran Soorah e Baqarah Chapter 2 verse 136.
"We believe in Allah and the guidance which has been sent down to us and which was sent to Abraham, Ishmael, Isaac and Jacob and his descendants and which was given by their Lord to Moses and Jesus and to all other Prophets. We do not discriminate against any of them and we have completely surrendered to Allah as Muslims"
But Islam also tells us that these revelations or books as well as the teachings of the prophets were modified or tempered with and changed by the followers of those religions and therefore lost their authenticity and value. For this reason prophets were sent repeatedly to the various parts of the world.
Also the humankind and means of communication were evolving throughout the early part of human history and there was a need for “updates” of religious teachings in the various parts of the world. But by the time teachings of Islam were revealed upon Muhammad (Peace be upon him) both humankind as well as the means of communications had evolved to the extent that conditions were ripe for the “final version” of religious instructions from God to be released and the final prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him) be sent who’s teachings would be valid till the end of this world. For this reason Allah (The one and only God with no partner, relative or offspring of any kind) has guaranteed in the holy Quran that Allah himself will protect this book in its original form till the end of this world. (A guarantee that has stood the test of time with the same book holy Quran without the difference of even a single word dispersed through out the world.)
Whether we start our quest looking at the Holy Quran to see if there is evidence of its divine origin, or whether we examine other divine books and scriptures (or whatever is left of them) the evidence in favour of truthfulness of Quran is overwhelming even overpowering. Denying the truthfulness of Quran is like standing outdoors in broad daylight and denying that it’s daytime.

An invitation for thought
This brings me to the last part of my discussion, which is an invitation to think about what I have said and to find out more about Islam and it’s teachings.
Today Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world. Like all other religions there are extremists and fanatics among its followers. But let me say that Islam is the most tolerant, practical, scientific and logical of all religions.

Today many non Muslim people are mislead due to the activities of Islamic extremists (I differ with the term “Islamic fundamentalists” because the fundamentals of Islam do not preach violence and intolerance and neither is Islam a retrogressive religion that demands turning the clock 1400 year back!).

The arguments that some aspects of Islam are contrary to or incompatible with modern day life are found to be baseless if examined with an open mind. One example is the allowance of polygamy in Islam. Islam does allow polygamy (as a better alternative to adultery) but if you look at the strict conditions imposed you will find that they are practically impossible to fulfill, so Islam in practice advocates monogamy. If you look at the state of “sexual freedom” of the non-Islamic world, you will find out who is really practicing polygamy and at what price! . Yes Islam does impose restrictions on sexual freedom but this is the “Manufacturers instruction” (Remember the warning on electrical gadgets that says “WARNING! No user serviceable parts inside. Do not open while connected to the electric mains”). It’s up to us whether we heed the warning or learn our lesson after getting the shock of our life!

What Islam demands from it’s believers
Contrary to the common concept of religion as a set of beliefs and rituals, Islam encourages its followers to create a state of mind based on the firm belief and submission to Allah’s will and his teachings as conveyed and practically demonstrated to us by his prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him). This state of mind then helps the believer to lead a peaceful life in harmony with the world around him and to view this world not as an end in itself but as a mean towards an end, that is the life hereafter.
Islam does not preach a “leave this dirty world alone” attitude, (as professed by some other religions).
A good Muslim is basically a good human being with the above described state of mind who can have a career, a family, a well defined & constructive role in the society and can enjoy all good things of life within the guidelines set by Islam.
The reality of true Islam is quite different from the picture portrayed by movies like "The Siege" and "Executive Decision" and the impression given by the acts of terrorism carried out by extremist Muslim groups, the 9-11 attack or the destruction of the statues of Buddha in Afghanistan.


My message for the “unaware”

I believe that most of the non-Muslim world is simply unaware of this beautiful way of life that Islam teaches us. I reserve the terms of “non believers” and “infidels” for those who even after gaining correct knowledge about Islam deliberately deny or try to redicule its teachings when they view Islam as
1- A threat to their way of life.
2- A threat to their ancestral religion, which they love so dearly.
Or
1-They are simply too arrogant and proud about their own way of thinking.

One very important aspect of Islam is that there are no compulsions to accept its teachings. Allah has mentioned repeatedly in the holy Quran that the duty assigned to all prophets and the rest of their followers is to convey his message to other human beings and Allah will guide only those who accept his teachings through their own free will. As for those who do not accept, Allah says

“It is the same to them whether you warn them or you warn them not, they will not believe. (Verse No.10 Soorah Yaseen,).

(And on the Day of Judgment) they (non-believers) will say: Woe to us! Who has raised us from our place of sleep? (It will be said to them): this is what Allah had promised, and the messengers spoke truth!
(Verse no.52 Soorah Yaseen)

Re: Which Religion is true


But why would anyone agree that we need religion to guide us through our lives???

We most assuredly do not.


Perhaps you can better understand that if I rephrase that proposition:

"If one agrees that we need mythology and superstition to guide us through our lives...."

Rational-Muslim
To you I have but one think to say. And it's not merry christmas.

Oh, Au, I know what you're thinkin'. :wink: