Why do so many people reject creation in favor of evolution, despite the complexity of dna?

@Fil Albuquerque,

Yes you are correct people do retreat to childish ideas because it may be more comforting to them, especially if they can't accept a certain aspect of reality. For me as a Christian I only embrace the morality/spirit of Christianity(Lord Jesus) because it does have some clever insights on how it is to be a decent human being that I have not noticed from any other religion or science. But I must admit that some people would class me as a nutcase. But I do know and will never deny the difference between metaphorical (or unrealistic) literature, and scientific (realistic) literature...

1 Reply

@Amoh5,

Amoh5 wrote:

For me as a Christian I only embrace the morality/spirit of Christianity(Lord Jesus) because it does have some clever insights on how it is to be a decent human being that I have not noticed from any other religion or science.

I've always found that being a decent person comes from a rather obvious set of behaviors, no religion required. What exactly do you think Christianity offers which doesn't come from simply having empathy, compassion and respect for other people?

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@rosborne979,

It offers something very dear to human beings....a tangible common fairy tale, a sense of relief from the prison of Reason, social moral and meaningful behaviour, retribution and linear justicialism, etc....it feeds loads of natural instincts and socio cultural needs to the masses...it still is a source of order. The State is weak God is not...

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@Amoh5,

Quote:

Why would any intelligent human being literally believe in ancient metaphorical stories of creation as if they were literally real

What strikes me as remarkable about the creation story (in Genesis) is not how outlandish or childish it is but its basic scientific accuracy.

Given that the science of physics and astronomy was limited to noticing the seasons and that there was no vocabulary to express things like physics of the Big Bang, 'Let there be Light' is as close to the literal truth as you could hope to express at the time. The very idea of 'a Beginning' is as radical and counterintuitive an idea as one could imagine. It would be more logical and 'evidence based' to believe as physicists actually did up until the early 20th century - that the universe was eternal and static.

The only reason that accepting the basic facts of the 'creation story' could be called 'childish' was that it was thousands of years ahead of the science that verified it. The only real bone of contention is the role of God in it. If you want to say that's a childish belief, that's a different story.

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@Leadfoot,

When your belief is based on the bible which has many errors, omissions and contradictions, one needs to balance its veracity against current knowledge and science. The bible fails in too many ways.

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@cicerone imposter,

I was not talking about beliefs, certainly not any based on the book. I was looking at it from a hypothetical POV of an outside observer.

Why would you 'balance it's veracity against current knowledge and science'? In terms of scientific accuracy, why would you expect any thinker or book from 4000 - 6000 years ago to reflect the detail we have today? Especially a book addressed to the spiritual realm. That it shows a picture of the universe and earth's creation in any recognizable fashion compared to what we know now is F'n amazing to me. Keep in mind this is outside of whether you attribute its creation to God or Quantum Physics or the Great Pumpkin.

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@Fil Albuquerque,

Fil Albuquerque wrote:

It offers something very dear to human beings....a tangible common fairy tale, a sense of relief from the prison of Reason, social moral and meaningful behaviour, retribution and linear justicialism, etc....it feeds loads of natural instincts and socio cultural needs to the masses...it still is a source of order. The State is weak God is not...

Yes, I see that.

I guess I was asking more specifically what it provides in the way of "moral" behavior (which you can't figure out on your own). Amoh's post seemed to imply that he had learned some set of moral behaviors from Christianity which he would not have known about otherwise. I was wondering what those were.

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@rosborne979,

Quote:

I guess I was asking more specifically what it provides in the way of "moral" behavior (which you can't figure out on your own)

It is interesting to me that most atheists view Christianity's moral system as either blandly obvious (to the point of being superfluous) or virulently evil (advocating such things as child sacrifice).

As far as I can tell, Amoh's leans toward the former but neither view reflects what I think is unique to the one in the bible.

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@Leadfoot,

Leadfoot wrote:

Quote:
I guess I was asking more specifically what it provides in the way of "moral" behavior (which you can't figure out on your own)
It is interesting to me that most atheists view Christianity's moral system as either blandly obvious...

Why is that interesting to you?

Leadfoot wrote:

As far as I can tell, Amoh's leans toward the former but neither view reflects what I think is unique to the one in the bible.

What is it that you see as unique to the one in the bible?

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@rosborne979,

Quote:

Leadfoot quote:
"It is interesting to me that most atheists view Christianity's moral system as either blandly obvious... [or evil incarnate]"

Why is that interesting to you?

Because of the dichotomy. Same reason why it's interesting that some look at the Grand Canyon and see grandeur and others see desolation. There must be some secret of human nature at the root of it. I'd like to what that is.

Quote:

Leadfoot wrote:
"As far as I can tell, Amoh's leans toward the former but neither view reflects what I think is unique to the one in the bible."

What is it that you see as unique to the one in the bible?

It is unique in that when clearly seen, it resolves the dichotomy between the bland 'family values' view and the 'psychotically mad' view of bible morality. I won't pretend to be able to describe that in an A2k post.

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That's a typical Leadhead dodge. This is what Amoh wrote:

Quote:

What exactly do you think Christianity offers which doesn't come from simply having empathy, compassion and respect for other people?

You haven't answered Roswell's question.

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@Leadfoot,

There are 101 contradictions in the bible based on the internet site. How does one rationalize these contradictions if they are the word of god?
It's not only DNA; it's evolution and a whole host of other scientific evidence. This planet is over 4.7 billion years old based on scientific findings. There was no way for people living 2,000 years ago to have determined this fact.
Humans created many gods over the 2000 years span, because none of them had the wherewithal of science to find them to be wrong. Most gods are imaginary, and cannot be produced. It's based on faith and faith alone.

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@Setanta,

Quote:

That's a typical Leadhead dodge. This is what Amoh wrote:

Quote:
"What exactly do you think Christianity offers which doesn't come from simply having empathy, compassion and respect for other people?"

You haven't answered Roswell's question.

OK, I get that I didn't 'fully' answer ros's question (and I admitted as much I my reply). If he asked me to tell him what was unique about my favorite car or airplane engine I couldn't have fully answered that either in a reasonable length post. That doesn't mean I was unwilling or unable to do it. I figured if he wanted more details he'd ask.

But what is your point about Amoh's statement? That is what I thought his position was. Have I said otherwise? As ros pointed out, that is the same position as many secular humanists, agnostics and atheists take on morality.

What exactly is 'my dodge'?

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

There are 101 contradictions in the bible based on the internet site. How does one rationalize these contradictions if they are the word of god?

If you want to talk about them I'd be happy to. One at a time please.

But I'm sure you have heard me say it before: The bible is not "The word of God" nor does it claim to be. Much of it was letters written by men to other men or the equivalent of journals and 'blogs' of that day.

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@Leadfoot,

In the first place, there are contradictions even amongst christian scholars whether the bible is the word of god or not. If they can't decide, how can you?

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

In the first place, there are contradictions even amongst christian scholars whether the bible is the word of god or not. If they can't decide, how can you?

When you only take responsibility for your own decisions, things get much easier.

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@Leadfoot,

I take responsibility for my own decisions, and I'm an atheist. I don't need no friggen 2000 year old book full of omissions, errors and contradictions to tell me what's right and what's wrong.
There's no need for a book with over 10000 words to tell me what's right and what's wrong. It's very simple; treat all living things with respect and dignity.
Beyond that, it's all mush.

101 Contradictions in the Bible. - Answering...
www.answering-christianity.com/101_bible_contradictions.htm

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@rosborne979,

The denial towards knowing what metaphorical(or unrealistic)literature is, and what scientific literature is by creationists, is pretty startling, but when a person like you says to me, there are no moral lessons or characteristics from Christianity(that is Lord Jesus) I think you're more in denial than what creationists are. Do you live in a Christian country? Do they have a Christmas holiday in your country? Most people in English-speaking Christian countries know what sort of moral character Lord Jesus represents even if they are not Christians. I find people like you highly irrational, especially when you imply "We can all teach ourselves how to be decent human beings" No human being can teach themselves that, thats total fantasy. You are either taught that by your parents or by another source. If your implication was true, we wouldn't need law and order...

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@Amoh5,

The only 'irrational' people are those who profess to know a non-existent person called Jesus. A person described in a 2000 year old book with no other evidence. A character described in a book that claims he performed miracles. A sacrifice that really wasn't a sacrifice: dying and brought back to life. That's not a sacrifice by any stretch. People who have gone into a coma for a longer period and then regained consciousness is more of a miracle.

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@Leadfoot,

You are so consistently dishonest and you just will not answer a direct question--that is your "dodge." No, you did not "admit as much" in your reply to Roswell. This: "What is it that you see as unique to the one in the bible?"--was specifically what Roswell asked you, referring to a moral system, and you did not answer that, either. I doubt if you could sit down at a table and draw a straight line on a piece of paper--it would be too far out of character for you.

1 Reply

Why do so many people reject creation in favor of evolution, despite the complexity of dna?

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