What are these threats really worth? Last week we had Code Orange back here in this lovely country called the Netherlands, presumably because of the fact terrorists wanted to strike us. Now, what came out though, was that the threat was partly based on the actions of a 17TH YEAR OLD (although that does not mean you are stupid, I do believe some are extremely intelligent
) who had made all sorts of maps where he would bomb things etc. (but did not seem to be a real 'threat' - lacking of resources). I mean, how can we know for sure that a terror threat is for real? I understand that the secret services don't want to give away any of their information, nor their way of working, but how can we - as 'outsiders' - know when we REALLY should be scared, or when it is just a hoax?
Their tactics are kind of like the drill seargent who punishes everyone in the platoon EXCEPT the person who caused the trouble... it makes the platoon pressure the guy to straighten up.
dlowan wrote:
Anyway - we have an active terrorist group linked to Al Quaeda merrily active in Indonesia - and there have been very large thefts of fertiliser going on here - the kind used in the Bali bombings perpetrated by that group.
I would say that we are very likely to have some terror incidents here - if our police and such folk can't track 'em down before they hit.
i think this is unfortunately true. indonesia has been a problem area for years, and the bali bombings were not that long ago.
something else that never leaves my mind is guam's fairly close proximity to indonesia.
Hmmm - small group - by the way - but of increasing concern to the Indonesian government - esp[ecially since the conviction of some of the Bali bombers is now in doubt.
Indonesia chose to prosecute them under anti-terror laws that were not in operation when they committed the acts of terror - instead of getting them for murder and conspiracy and such - (heavier penalties, I think???) - it has now been decided by Indonesia's Supreme court that it was unconstitutional to do this.
Not sure where this leaves their criminal convictions...
Here I was expecting a fine thread about rabbit slaughter, and it's yet another Iraq topic. <sigh>
You can shoot me if it will make you happy.
Nah, I'm as bored with shooting as I am with terror alerts.
Whatever works
Terrorism and threats of terrorism have persuaded or at least influenced several nations to withdraw troops. Hence the stepped up activity of kidnappings in Iraq and threats of terror. Giving in to terror only breeds additional terror. It feeds the habit.
yep, ditto to what au said.
BAGHDAD As insurgents moved with rapidly increasing sophistication to develop hostage-taking as their most powerful weapon against foreign nations in Iraq, two Pakistanis working for a Kuwaiti-based company were believed kidnapped on Sunday, and fresh threats against other countries warned that their citizens were at risk unless they pulled out as well..
The U.S. military also reported that 13 insurgents had been killed by American and Iraqi forces in a major battle north of Baghdad that involved small arms fire, rocket-propelled grenades and artillery. No Iraqi or American fighters were reported killed..
The missing Pakistanis, a truck driver and an engineer working for the Al-Tamimi Group, vanished as they were driving to Baghdad along heavily traveled supply routes. In an often-repeated scene that the insurgents seem to rely on to apply pressure, the family of one of the missing men made an emotional appeal for his release from their village 88 kilometers, or 55 miles, south of Islamabad, Reuters reported..
"I miss my father very much," said the 21-year-old daughter of one of the missing men, Azad Khan, as she wept. "I urge the Pakistani government and Iraqi people to help find my father.".
In another display of their increasing skill, hostage-takers seized an Egyptian diplomat as he left a mosque on Friday..
Three days before, insurgents enjoyed perhaps their greatest tactical success when they released a Filipino hostage, Angelo dela Cruz, after his government pulled 51 Filipino soldiers and police officers out of the country..
The insurgents - in what has also become a standard, if macabre, technique - had threatened to behead dela Cruz if his countrymen did not pull out..
About 20 foreigners are either being held hostage or have already been killed by their captors in Iraq..
Abducting foreigners "is like putting pressure on the painful parts of the body," said Abdul Sattar Abdul al-Jabbar, deputy spokesman for the Muslim Scholars Association, a moderate group that has condemned the kidnappings but that criticizes what Jabbar calls the continuing U.S. occupation of Iraq..
"It's very easy to kidnap foreigners in Iraq," Jabbar said. "It doesn't cost them anything," he said of the insurgents..
George Sada, a spokesman for Prime Minister Iyad Allawi, asserted that the outbreak of hostage-taking had come about as insurgents had recoiled from what he called the increasing power of Iraqi security forces..
But Sada conceded that each hostage turned into a highly visible statement by the insurgents that Iraq is a dangerous place to live and work..
"Of course, they are embarrassing the government by these acts," Sada said..
The firefight between insurgents and the American and Iraqi forces took place at Buhritz, 50 kilometers north of Baghdad, the U.S. military said. It followed a raid by the Iraqis in farm country there..
U.S. troops participated in the battle with artillery fire, observation aircraft and soldiers who were described as "providing security" during the fighting..
But the taking of hostages has emerged as the low-tech analog of the American "nuclear option" - a weapon of unparalleled power, and one so effective that even the threat of using it carries great influence..
The tactic emerged in a major way during the first intense outbreak of insurgency in April..
Since that time, at least 60 hostages have been reported freed, while others have been reported killed or are still missing..
More important, the taking of hostages has separated itself from the generalized violence in Iraq and become a prime weapon on its own..
The method has the advantage, from the terrorists' point of view, of being cheap and almost entirely free of the risk that insurgents run when they confront American or Iraqi troops directly in the field..
The personal nature of the tactic, usually involving video of the individual hostages with their captors and the grotesque threat of beheading, also ensures that each incident is given enormous exposure in the international media..
As demonstrated by the pullout of the Filipino soldiers, which took place in the face of overwhelming public pressure in the Philippines to save dela Cruz, that exposure translates into a force that can move nations..
More specifically, the truckers who have been the focus of several recent incidents are part of an indispensable series of supply lines that bring materials in from surrounding countries. If those lines are disrupted, the entire American-backed effort to create stability and the conditions for a new government in Iraq could suffer..
"It's difficult to stop it, but we are trying to find the measures to decrease the number," said Hamid al-Bayati, the deputy foreign minister for political affairs and bilateral relations..
"We regret that some countries are really giving up to the terrorists," said Bayati, who is also a member of the central committee of the Supreme Council for the Islamic Revolution in Iraq..
"But we respect their decisions," he said..
The New York Times
I wonder...
In the First World War the British used "Q" Ships against German submarines. They looked like innocent merchant ships, but were actually quite well armed.
I wonder if they're considering something similar in Iraq. Seemingly innocent passenger cars with foreign civilians - who have tracking transmitters, are follwed by drone aircraft and ground units etc.
