timberlandko wrote:If avoid rich food, strong liquor, fine tobacco, and loose ways, you won't live any longer, but it will seem like it.
Oh posh, yes you will!
My poor uncle decided to do all those things (starting at a very young age) and he is 40 now and a diabetic alchoholic who has to come up with scams for money and give himself shots on the hour.
I'd rather live longer and be healthy. It's not like you can't enjoy life without dangerous vices.
Oh, I dunno, I'm pushin' 60, and I've never taken moderation to excess :wink:
Foxfyre wrote:I quit going to doctors years ago after observing that just about everybody who goes to doctors are sick!
When we checked my father-in-law into a nursing home, I helped gather up all his prescriptions to show his new doctor. He was taking 27 prescriptions!!!! You can't tell me that several of those were not conflicting with several others with toxic effect. Why was he getting most of them? Because the doctors constantly receive samples with reams of studies re this new drug or that new drug. It's just way too easy for doctors to write a prescription because it 'might' help and if you have several different specialists doing that, it can get out of hand very quickly.
But then I'm a strong advocate for litigation reform so that doctors don't HAVE to over prescribe, order too many tests, etc. etc. etc. to keep from being sued for malpractice.
Many MDs will write an Rx, because it's an easy way out for them, and they don't know what else to do.
timberlandko wrote:Oh, I dunno, I'm pushin' 60, and I've never taken moderation to excess :wink:
Lucky bastard.
Actually, my body moderates my cleanliness. If I eat too much fat it makes my stomach upset, I get terrible hangovers, and I have asthama so smoking is out. - Ill health for healthiness! -
The one thing that puzzles me is that the Atkins diet is high fat, high calorie but with severely restricted carbs yes? Yet those of my friends who really stuck with it this past year ALL report their weight, blood pressure, and bad cholesteral are down with no medication whatsoever. This seems to fly in the face of logic and maybe they are just spoofing me. But these are people I believe to be honest, intelligent, and reliable.
So now we're seeing an increase of reporting on the dangers and tragedies related to the Atkins diet. Is it possible these negative reports are coming from the pharmaceutical companies, the sugar growers, etc.?
Absolutely possible, Foxfyre.
Foxfyre wrote:The one thing that puzzles me is that the Atkins diet is high fat, high calorie but with severely restricted carbs yes? Yet those of my friends who really stuck with it this past year ALL report their weight, blood pressure, and bad cholesteral are down with no medication whatsoever. This seems to fly in the face of logic and maybe they are just spoofing me. But these are people I believe to be honest, intelligent, and reliable.
So now we're seeing an increase of reporting on the dangers and tragedies related to the Atkins diet. Is it possible these negative reports are coming from the pharmaceutical companies, the sugar growers, etc.?
The bad reports are coming from people who know something about nutrition and who say the Atkins diet is bad, in the long term, for people, who want to be thin.
If that is true Miller, why aren't we seeing warnings along with STUDIES from the medical community? We aren't.
Foxfyre wrote:If that is true Miller, why aren't we seeing warnings along with STUDIES from the medical community? We aren't.
Because MDs don't know anything about nutrition.
What always surprises me, is the "call for drugs".
Why not try to eat properly?
Eat properly? We hardly know what that is now. Every few years they tell us that what was eating properly yesterday is now gonna kill us.
Okay, but especially re cholesterol that's very easy - just avoid some food, get enough/not too much and balanced fat ... (that's the first doctors/pharmacies do here [because it is the cheapest way]: give you some brochures, recipes ...).
Walter, I read once that only a small part of the population, if I remember correctly about 10%, can bring cholesterol down markedly with diet. Most can bring the LDS number or triglyceride number down by diet only about 15%, as Eva mentioned, as that is related to the percentage of the cholesterol test total that is floating around in your blood from what you eat; our bodies also produce it.
I read also at some point that it isn't the cholesterol that kills us, it is the plaque formation, and certain things can affect that. One article of fairly long ago said the vitamin b6 was important as, for example, in the cooking of meat, the vitamin in the meat was lost, and the thymine (or homocystine), amino acids in the meat that the b6 will neutralize, is then available for plaque formation. I think that premise was more recently corroborated, about five or ten years ago, by a variety of scientists. The Harvard scientist who had made these observations I had first read probably back in the seventies had had them not accepted and had his career dwindle, and then more recent work by others validated him.
Don't of course trust me on this summary of what I once read, but it makes sense and supports your point that eating
nutriciously is smart - as in eating foods that contain the b vitamins, and I would guess eating some uncooked veggies as well as cooked ones.
And this was in today's papers:
Jul 17, 5:56 AM EDT
Groups Blast New Cholesterol Guidelines
By LINDA A. JOHNSON
Associated Press Writer
TRENTON, N.J. (AP) -- Most of the heart disease experts who urged more people to take cholesterol-lowering drugs this week have made money from the companies selling those medicines.
Remainder of story:
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/C/CHOLESTEROL_CONFLICTS?SITE=FLTAM&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT
ossobuco wrote:Walter, I read once that only a small part of the population, if I remember correctly about 10%, can bring cholesterol down markedly with diet. Most can bring the LDS number or triglyceride number down by diet only about 15%, as Eva mentioned, as that is related to the percentage of the cholesterol test total that is floating around in your blood from what you eat; our bodies also produce it.
I read also at some point that it isn't the cholesterol that kills us, it is the plaque formation, and certain things can affect that. One article of fairly long ago said the vitamin b6 was important as, for example, in the cooking of meat, the vitamin in the meat was lost, and the thymine (or homocystine), amino acids in the meat that the b6 will neutralize, is then available for plaque formation. I think that premise was more recently corroborated, about five or ten years ago, by a variety of scientists. The Harvard scientist who had made these observations I had first read probably back in the seventies had had them not accepted and had his career dwindle, and then more recent work by others validated him.
Don't of course trust me on this summary of what I once read, but it makes sense and supports your point that eating
nutriciously is smart - as in eating foods that contain the b vitamins, and I would guess eating some uncooked veggies as well as cooked ones.
Yes, Ossco, it is the plaques that will kill us. But interestingly, HDL given by IV will dissolve the plaques. There's a new drug on the market ( or in the works) that makes use of this principle. The bottom line, of course is that all cholesterol is not created equal!
Eva wrote:Moderation, Walter?
It'll never sell.
As long as there's a will, there's a way. A new medication in the works today is a vaccine against nicotine, to help people stop smoking. If you want to stop smoking, don't buy cigs and if you buy them, keep them out of your mouth.
That's how I quit the cigs, Miller. Simply didn't buy anymore. 1+1=2.
eoe wrote:That's how I quit the cigs, Miller. Simply didn't buy anymore. 1+1=2.
That's what I did too, eoe. I don't intend on spending my money on them anymore. Not worth it.
