Lash
 
  3  
Reply Tue 8 Mar, 2016 08:22 pm
@Lilkanyon,
Hillary Clinton is intelligent.

Not as intelligent as Bernie Sanders.

Bernie has been focused on his infrastructure plan for decades - and he's intelligent enough to have worked out how his plan can work together to produce the effect he talks about.

I know it requires investment from those of us who vote him in. He is pushing for big changes, and Bernie supporters like me are in for the long haul. We demand money out of politics, returning to Glass-Steagall, and making several other changes that require voting some fuckers out, but his plans will work.

If my taxes go up at the rate proposed, but I don't have to pay for classes or stupid ******* high insurance premiums and co-pays, I'm SAVING money.

I get it.

Lilkanyon
 
  3  
Reply Tue 8 Mar, 2016 08:48 pm
@Lash,
What you fail to consider is him passing all that through congress. Hes a hope and a prayer for the suffering youth with no real chance of success.

He has no better chance then Trump and his wall, or removing 11 million people or even curtailing negative media by admendment. Politicians promise grandiose things, its what is realistic that counts.

I have nothing against Sanders, I believe his intentions are geniune, I just think they are too idealistist and unrealistic for our country, in this poltical climate.
As much as people distrust Clinton, I think she can get us as least SOME of what we want instead of nothing, due to idealist ideas alone. Politicians must sell a piece of their souls, even if we dont like it. I think Clinton understands and accepts that game more then Sanders does. The "idealism" idea is a Tea Party Pipe Dream. Dont let it become a dem pipe dream too.
ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Tue 8 Mar, 2016 10:06 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Yes, agree re money for education, re the relative waste we have made with our big feet in the world.

0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 01:03 am
Whoooommp! There it is!

Bernie beats Hillary in a historic victory!

Thank you, Michigan.

0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 01:07 am
@Lilkanyon,
People with those views of what can and can't be done are just an irritating roadblock to progress. Can't land on the moon, either. Can't fly. Can't build a railroad across country.

Yes, we can.

0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 01:14 am
http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/what-the-stunning-bernie-sanders-win-in-michigan-means/

Bernie's win is a big deal.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 01:28 am
Black voters are finally picking up on Bernie.
http://www.rawstory.com/2016/03/bernie-sanders-wins-michigan-democratic-primary/
Just in time.
Cali and Florida just got a lot more interesting.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  3  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 01:52 am
Interesting stats: 81% of under30s voted for Bern. 64% of Arab Americans. Twice as many blacks as he's ever gotten before. (Wish I knew that number)

The message is getting out, despite the DNCs best efforts.
0 Replies
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 05:06 am
http://i1305.photobucket.com/albums/s545/biscuitface3/Robert%20Reich%20Bernie%20quote_zpshfv3cli7.jpg
0 Replies
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 05:11 am
http://i1305.photobucket.com/albums/s545/biscuitface3/Clinton%20Beats%20Sanders%20Dewey%20Newpaper%20Meme_zpssautizdb.jpg
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  3  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 08:00 am
To give credit to where it is due, Bernie fought hard for Michigan and gained a win when all the polls showed Clinton should have won by more than twenty points. Apparently that hasn't happened since 1984 according 538.

What The Stunning Bernie Sanders Win In Michigan Means

0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  5  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 08:19 am
I am in the minority here among liberals, most like Bernie hope he actually wins but thinks he won't therefore they vote for Hillary. I actually hope he doesn't win because I don't think he will be good for the country. It is not that I like Hillary so much, (would have had Biden)but I think Bernie is too simplistic and too intractable in his positions.

Take for instance his stand on the prisons population in this country. He doesn't go over and make decisions based on study but just makes sweeping solutions.

Here’s the Herculean effort Bernie Sanders would have to undertake to try to keep one of his campaign promises

Quote:
After the US, China has the second-highest number of incarcerated people in the world, according to the International Centre for Prison Studies.

If Sanders wanted to reduce the US prison population to a point that was below the total number of incarcerated people in China, he would have to eliminate 600,000 inmates.

However, the only area he could exert direct control over would be the federal prison system.

Federal prisons house just north of 180,000 prisoners, per the Bureau of Prisons. Sanders could pardon each individual prisoner in the federal system, and still be about 400,000 short of being below the total prison population in China, where about 1.6 million are behind bars.

And, in that hypothetical scenario, Sanders would have to free more than 5,000 people behind bars for either homicide, aggravated assault, or kidnapping, more than 31,000 who are in federal prison for charges stemming from weapons crimes, arson, or explosives, and north of 12,000 for extortion, bribery, or fraud.

But the most interesting group Sanders would have to pardon? Based on his campaign platform, it'd be the roughly 650 people in federal prison for banking and insurance, counterfeit, or embezzlement charges.

"It's completely implausible, what he's proposing," John Pfaff, a professor of law at Fordham University, told Business Insider. "I don't think we can get 600,000 people out that quick, it's not remotely possible."

Aside from pardoning all federal prisoners, Pfaff said Sanders could try to get legislation through that would encourage states and localities to lower their prison populations. But, he added, that rarely makes any difference.

"In terms of what the president can do, there is very, very, very little the president can actually do when it comes to criminal justice," he said, calling what the federal government could do "financial carrots and sticks."

"They can offer states money if they try to reduce the prison population," he said. "They can threaten to withhold money if they don't want to reduce populations. But that hasn't worked that much."

As for pardoning the approximately 180,000 federal prisoners, Pfaff said Sanders could carry it out — but it would cost an extreme amount of political capital.

"It'd be politically impossible," he said. "I mean he could, there's nothing legally binding him from doing this. But, the political cost of that would be staggering."

Even if he managed to pardon every federal prisoner, Sanders would have to put pressure on lower-level politicians to release the remaining 420,000 local and state inmates necessary to get below the prison population of China.

"Neither of those is a plausible proposal," he said. "It's a profoundly difficult task and he oversimplifies it far too much."
snood
 
  3  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 08:47 am
@revelette2,
It's what I've said over and over. Bernie's promises would be called outright lies if Hillary made them. Ending institutional racism? Decreasing the prison/jail population by millions? Free college? Universal healthcare? And otherwise reasonable people all dutifully repeat "the political revolution" when asked HOW he intends to make these things happen.
It's so frustrating that those same people want to accuse everyone who's not rhapsodizing about Bernie as lazy, unimaginat I've or corrupt.
0 Replies
 
Blickers
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 10:30 am
@revelette2,
Not to mention that the increase in prison population coincided with a dramatic drop in crime. The US murder rate in 1993 was 9.3 per 100,000 inhabitants. By 2014 it had dropped to 4.5. That's more than half.

And what of the consequences of putting convicted murderers back on the street? Even allowing that some of the laws were unfair and counterproductive-much more jail time for crack instead of powder cocaine, for instance-putting convicted criminals back on the street is a recipe for disaster. Remember the damage the Willie Horton case did to Dukakis back in 1988? Well, just imagine the political damage to a Sanders Administration if we end up with thousands of Willie Horton-like cases.
maxdancona
 
  3  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 10:45 am
@Lilkanyon,
Lilkanyon wrote:

My opinion? I was on the fence about Clinton or Bernie till an interview with Chris Matthews. He tore Bernie up. This isnt a FOX dude, you all know Chris, and bernie stuttered and fell back to a "young person revolution". Like some 60's PTSD. Really? Is idealism was as far fetched as Trumps wall. I'm sorry, we need realists in the white house and Bernie is as far crazy left as Trump is far crazy right. The difference is, the dems arent as stupid, thats why Clinton is stomping right now in delegate votes.


Did we see the same interview?

In the interview I saw Sanders was quite impressive against Chris Matthews. Chris was arguing for the establishment and he was unable to make any ground.

I suspect that if you were actually "on the fence" you would have felt that Chris Matthews fell flat and that Sanders made his points quite well in that interview.
maxdancona
 
  0  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 10:50 am
@Lilkanyon,
Lilkanyon, are you willing to be swayed by facts?

If I provide likes to several speeches where Bernie talks about the need for money in our public school system, will you change your mind?

Or have you already made up your mind in spite of the facts.
maporsche
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 11:03 am
@maxdancona,
Any evidence of him actually doing anything?.....or just speeches? Honestly curious.
Miller
 
  -3  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 12:34 pm
Is that big (!) guy always standing behind GrandPa, his out- of- wedlock son, Levi?

Well, whoever Levi is, he surely doesn't look like the brightest bulb on the tree...
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 02:39 pm
@maporsche,
I'm wid you; political promises of a free college education is pie in the sky.
0 Replies
 
RABEL222
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Mar, 2016 06:04 pm
@maxdancona,
Your prejudiced. Bernie could declare us all millionares and you would agree with him. When he declares that he going to get all this free stuff he is lying through his teeth. Only a blind man would believe he can get even one of his ideas through a republican house. You have let hatred for clinton color your outlook just like the Trumpites.
 

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