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Are there any peaceful muslim nations?

 
 
vikorr
 
  1  
Sun 7 Sep, 2014 08:19 pm
@Buttermilk,
Quote:
seriously I hate armchair scholars trying to interpret Islam and the Islamic faith.
A common feeling...almost as common as the accusation of 'hater' commonly thrown against those who think it's a dangerous religion.

Of course the nonsense of throwing 'hater' at anyone who recognises something as dangerous is seen with many peoples love of:
- (anything from) bears, sharks, tigers, lions, hippos, crocodiles, etc
...even while recognising them as dangerous. Hate isn't necessary to recognition of danger (and that is the only point. I am not comparing any to Islam)

If you want other examples...have a look many peoples love of just the looks of guns, swords, and other weapons...even while recognising them as dangerous...so yet again, hate isn't necessary to recognition of danger.

...but I note how you personally claim to hate.
Quote:
Seriously I hate


Quote:
When it comes to hate Christianity and Judaism combined has a longer history of hate than Islam
The common argument of those who apologise for evil done today in the name of islam. How does the evil of one religion excuse the evil of another religion? It doesn't...no evil in the name of religion should be acceptable.

Comparison of the nature you use is only useful to identify hypocrisy (where a poster is for example, excusing christian evil while denouncing islamic evil). Are you using it for that purpose? Or are you using it to excuse evil in the name of religion? (in this case, islamic)

It's fine to have an opinion...it's not fine to hate others based on ignorance, and flawed beliefs.

(and before you get upset about any perceived 'hypocrisy' regarding any supposed hate on my part...you had better have a look back through my posts and see if you can find something that is hateful, rather than just recognition of an issue)
coldjoint
 
  0  
Sun 7 Sep, 2014 08:45 pm
@Buttermilk,
Quote:
I realize those of you speaking out against Islam don't know ****.. Seriously I hate armchair scholars trying to interpret Islam and the Islamic faith.


Why don't you just ask me about Islam, or better yet tell me what I don't know about Islam.
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  0  
Sun 7 Sep, 2014 08:47 pm
@Buttermilk,

Quote:
Let's not forget how Jews sterilize Africans due to the fear of losing their identity due to the influx of African immigrants.


I would like to see some proof of that.
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Sun 7 Sep, 2014 08:47 pm
@vikorr,
The biggest problem for most Americans are the one-sided media reporting we get about Muslims and the Middle East. Those impressions are never balanced about most of the Muslims that live in this world.
On the other side of the coin are those that spew hatred at most cultures they don't even come close to understanding.

It's a human disorder of needing to feel superior over others based on ignorance.
coldjoint
 
  0  
Sun 7 Sep, 2014 08:48 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
We've been friends for over two decades.


No accounting for tastes.
0 Replies
 
vikorr
 
  1  
Sun 7 Sep, 2014 09:04 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
The biggest problem for most Americans are the one-sided media reporting we get about Muslims and the Middle East. Those impressions are never balanced about most of the Muslims that live in this world.

Quote:
On the other side of the coin are those that spew hatred at most cultures they don't even come close to understanding.

Quote:
It's a human disorder of needing to feel superior over others based on ignorance.

Yes, CI, all of these issues are a real problem. All of them (when generically based) are found in the lead up to many wars.

The media issue alone is worth several threads...what it doesn't report and why...how it reports what it reports, and why...and the social basis for the prior choices, and the social repercussions of the totality of the media reports.
0 Replies
 
One Eyed Mind
 
  -1  
Sun 7 Sep, 2014 09:21 pm
If we're going to speak of the ill-content of countries, we need to speak of our own ill-content as well, else the intentions are now ill.
0 Replies
 
vikorr
 
  1  
Sun 21 Sep, 2014 12:58 pm
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/opinion/opinion-dangerous-comments-by-hizb-uttahrirs-wassim-doureihi-ignored/story-fnihsr9v-1227065826478
Quote:
WASSIM Doureihi said something very frightening to Muslims protesting in Lakemba against last Thursday’s anti-terrorist raids.

Even more frightening is that no one – no politician, commentator or academic – condemned him.

Doureihi, a veteran leader of the Hizb ut-Tahrir movement, brushed off police claims that the men they’d arrested had planned to behead Australians on the orders of the Islamic State.

“Let me say clearly, even if a single bomb went off, even if a thousand bombs went off in this country, all it will prove is that Muslims are angry,” Doureihi said.

Put his comment in context. It was Doureihi who last November told 600 supporters at Hizb ut-Tahrir’s conference in Lidcombe they were victims of “a war on Islam – a war that is being waged in this country as it is in the rest of the world”.

And what does the Koran say to Muslims who believe themselves at war? Not to turn the other cheek but fight: “To those against whom war is made, permission is given (to defend themselves), because they are wronged.”....
0 Replies
 
WhyIhateReligion
 
  1  
Sun 28 Sep, 2014 05:54 pm
@MyOwnUsername,
"plenty of peaceful islamic nations - Qatar, Kuwait, United Arab Emirates, Bahrein, Tunisia..."

While agree with you they are peaceful. They also are oppressive governments that enforce Sharia Law and have ties to extremist groups. Unless your a Sunni muslim man your freedoms are very limited.

http://www.answers.com/Q/What_countries_use_Sharia_Law
coldjoint
 
  -1  
Sun 28 Sep, 2014 08:37 pm
@WhyIhateReligion,
Quote:
Unless your a Sunni muslim man your freedoms are very limited.


Islam is the ultimate boys club. It is designed to make each man a tyrant that enjoys himself while those around him suffer. Sharia gives him the right to kill his family.
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  1  
Sun 28 Sep, 2014 08:39 pm
Quote:
Aceh Approves Lashes for Homosexual Sex


Quote:
Indonesia’s conservative Aceh province passed a law on Saturday making gay sex punishable by 100 lashes of the cane, in a decision described by rights activists as “an enormous step backwards”.

Aceh, the only part of the world’s most populous Muslim-majority nation that is allowed to implement Islamic sharia law, already carries out public canings for gambling, drinking alcohol and fraternising with the opposite sex outside of marriage.

Lawmakers began deliberations on Friday night and unanimously agreed in the early hours of Saturday to pass the law. The law explicitly outlaws anal sex between men and “the rubbing of body parts between women for stimulation”, making homosexuality technically illegal for the first time in Aceh.


http://jakartaglobe.beritasatu.com/news/aceh-approves-lashes-homosexual-sex/
0 Replies
 
Buttermilk
 
  1  
Mon 29 Sep, 2014 02:23 am
@izzythepush,
Exactly that is my point...Let's call a spade a spade
0 Replies
 
Buttermilk
 
  1  
Mon 29 Sep, 2014 02:25 am
@vikorr,
Evil of one never excuses the evil of another. I don't blame "religion" for the evils that men commit. Now, I understand many people think that Islam promotes violence. However people forget that during the middle ages, Muslims, Jews, and Christians (and even some pagans) all flourished under Islamic rule. Unfortunately extremism has evolved due to the advancement of technology. I'm not saying what so-called Muslim terrorist do is right, I'mn saying those that profess to be of the Christian faith have very little criticism when it comes to Islam.
Buttermilk
 
  1  
Mon 29 Sep, 2014 02:26 am
@coldjoint,
Israel Forcibly Injected African Immigrants with Birth Control, Report Claims

"This weekend, a report revealing that African women immigrating to Israel were subjected to mandatory contraceptive injections, effectively amounting to forced (if temporary) sterilization made global headlines.

Some 130,000 Ethiopians, most of them Jewish, live in Israel. The community experiences higher poverty and unemployment rates than the rest of the country’s Jewish population. In the past decade, the birth rate among Ethiopian-Israelis has declined by at least 20 percent. Advocacy groups now claim this decline is the result of a birth control regimen forced upon Ethiopian immigrant women.

According to an article in Haaretz, an Israeli news source, one Ethiopian immigrant said that the doctors who injected her claimed that “people who frequently give birth suffer.” While it is possible, if highly unlikely, that doctors genuinely had the women’s health in mind when they forcibly injected them with contraceptives, there is no excuse for depriving women sovereignty over their own reproductive choices.

Israel has acknowledged the issue (without admitting any wrongdoing) and has vowed institutional changes in healthcare for immigrants. By decree of Israel’s health minister, gynecologists have been ordered “not to renew prescriptions for Depo-Provera for women of Ethiopian origin if for any reason there is concern that they might not understand the ramifications of the treatment.” Still, intense scrutiny should be applied by women’s groups and international organizations to make sure these changes are implemented in full. Moreover, more attention must be paid to the plight of vulnerable African immigrants around the world.

That Israel should allegedly engage in this activity is particularly shocking, considering the practice was widely used by the Germans throughout the Shoah. While the scale and effects of these operations cannot be compared, Israel’s implicit intent to limit ‘burdensome’ (read: undesirable) portions of the population recalls the dark eugenics experiments of World War II.

Immigration, legal and otherwise, is a difficult and invariably sticky issue for developed nations. Israel, like the United States, has struggled to find a way to secure its borders and its population while dealing with a constant stream of immigrants from neighboring countries and, increasingly, the African continent. While admitting the difficult security issues that Israel faces, the international community must loudly and unanimously rebuke the systematic violations of human rights inflicted on women immigrants of African origin.

From a sociological perspective, this incident shows the strain between Israel’s religious heritage and its modern political agenda. “Behold, the heritage of the Lord is sons, the reward is the fruit of the innards. Like arrows in the hand of a mighty man, so are the sons of one’s youth. Praiseworthy is the man who has filled his quiver with them,” the Torah proclaims. The involuntary sterilization of African immigrants suggests that the Jewish moral code (inextricably connected with Israel’s domestic legal codes) can be selectively applied to those with ‘desirable’ backgrounds. It is hard, indeed almost impossible to believe that an American Jewish woman immigrating to Israel would be forced to take birth control."

See:http://www.forbes.com/sites/eliseknutsen/2013/01/28/israel-foribly-injected-african-immigrant-women-with-birth-control/
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Mon 29 Sep, 2014 03:08 am
@Buttermilk,
Whereas i agree with the premise that Christians have shaky moral ground to criticize Muslims, the idea that Muslim extremists are a product of technology is absurd. Pan-Arabist movements began even before the 20th century--the Muslim Brotherhood is one of the oldest continuously existing pan-Arabist organizations, dating back to 1928. More than anything else, the collapse of the Turkish empire in 1918 is responsible. The two main western powers concerned in the middle east--France and Great Britain--broke their promises to Arab triabl leaders/warlords, and rushed to gobble up the real estate. One of the most potent images in Islamist propaganda for most of the 20th century was European powers in the middle east cast as crusaders. Technology really had nothing to do with the rise of the Islamists--it has just facilitated recruitment and fund-raising.
0 Replies
 
vikorr
 
  0  
Tue 30 Sep, 2014 04:36 am
@Buttermilk,
Quote:
I'm not saying what so-called Muslim terrorist do is right, I'm saying those that profess to be of the Christian faith have very little criticism when it comes to Islam.

Err, your exact words were:
Quote:
After scrolling through the comments I realize those of you speaking out against Islam don't know ****.. Seriously I hate armchair scholars trying to interpret Islam and the Islamic faith.

Your comments are very clearly aimed at all posters against Islam - so excuse me if I call your ‘I was trying to say’ not fully honest.

Your comments later on Christian and Jewish evil are too easily taken to be excusing evil done in the name of Islam - for it follows directly on from you saying how you hate critics of Islam...and most posters here are neither Jewish nor Christian.
Quote:
Evil of one never excuses the evil of another.
Thank you for the clarification.
Quote:
I don't blame "religion" for the evils that men commit.

I don’t buy into blame. Everyone bears responsibility for their own decisions. That said, decisions are not reached in isolation of the external environment - which contributes to those decisions. Islam is a clear and strong contributor to all evil done in its name – with the breadth and severity of evil done in its name, appalling.

Comment: when it comes to problem solving, blame is detrimental, while looking into the contributing circumstances (without removing personal responsibility for your own actions) is beneficial to solving the problem. In reverse, ignoring the contributing circumstances is akin to blame, and detrimental to problem solving.
Quote:
Now, I understand many people think that Islam promotes violence. However people forget that during the middle ages, Muslims, Jews, and Christians (and even some pagans) all flourished under Islamic rule.
I doubt that those who know of such forget it.
Quote:
Unfortunately extremism has evolved due to the advancement of technology.

Have you read into the life of Mohammed? Are you aware that the man who wrote ‘the book of peace’ was a warrior prophet? That he lead raids on caravans? That he lead battles? That he condoned ethnic cleansing, and assassinations? That versus that supported his actions went into the Quran? Are you aware that many of those versus are open ended, and as applicable today (eg against infidels) as back then? Extremism is not a new concept in Islam – it’s been around since it’s founding.

P.S. There is quite a bit of blurring of the lines between fundamentalism and extremism...depending who who you are talking about in relation to any given violent incident.
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  1  
Tue 30 Sep, 2014 10:46 am
Read up on Mohammed.

Quote:
The work is divided into sections:


Early life of Mohammad

His birth, upbringing and the life until the call for prophethood.


Meccan period of Mohammad

His call to preaching, first converts, and treatment from his tribe. 611-622 AD.


Medinian period of Mohammad

His escape to Medina. Establishing the muslim community, treaties with the Jewish tribes. Raids against the Quraysh caravans, conquest of surrounding cities, destruction of the Jewish settlements & tribes. Conflicts and truce with the Meccans, breaking of the truce, conquest of Mecca, and Mohammads illness and death. 622-632 AD.





http://politicalislam.pbworks.com/w/page/17540732/Life%20of%20Mohammad
0 Replies
 
vikorr
 
  0  
Tue 14 Oct, 2014 08:09 pm
Few westerners are aware of the degree of intolerance Islam holds towards Polytheists (if you don't know about this, do some research before commenting)

Quote:
THE Islamic State jihadist group says that it has given Yazidi women and children captured in northern Iraq to its fighters as spoils of war, boasting it has revived slavery...

The latest issue of its propaganda magazine Dabiq released on Sunday was the first clear admission by the organisation that it was holding and selling Yazidis as sex slaves...

In an article entitled “The revival of slavery before the hour”, Dabiq argues that by enslaving people it claims hold deviant religious beliefs, IS has restored an aspect of Islamic sharia law to its original meaning...

“This large-scale enslavement of mushrik (polytheist) families is probably the first since the abandonment of this sharia law,” it said.

“The only other known case — albeit much smaller — is that of the enslavement of Christian women and children in the Philippines and Nigeria by the mujahedeen there.”

Dabiq argued that while the “people of the book” — or followers of monotheistic religions such as Christians or Jews — can be given the option of paying the “jizya” tax or convert, this did not apply to Yazidis.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/world/isis-gives-yazidi-women-and-children-to-fighters-as-prizes-in-horrific-slave-trade/story-fnihsmjt-1227091010209

Similar Islamic intolerance to polytheists existed at the time of Mohammed, including convert or die.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Tue 14 Oct, 2014 08:44 pm
@vikorr,
What percentage of Muslims are extremists like the jihadist group? What percentage are peaceful?
coldjoint
 
  -2  
Tue 14 Oct, 2014 09:15 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
What percentage of Muslims are extremists like the jihadist group? What percentage are peaceful?

Actually according to their own holy literature there is no way to tell. Muslims can lie to advance Islam. And those lies are encouraged because deceit is a weapon of war
 

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