0
   

2004 Elections: Democratic Party Contenders

 
 
Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:05 pm
nimh wrote:
As for color - yes, we're still waiting for a person of color to get to run for Vice-President or President for either major party ... that's sad.

Why? Perhaps the government should create an affirmative action program and force people to elect someone based solely on the color of their skin. ??? Do you doubt that Republicans would vote for Colin Powell if he were the party's candidate for P or VP? What does his skin color have to do with it?
0 Replies
 
Sofia
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:17 pm
Scrat--
I'm guilty, too. I'm just looking forward to the day the White Man Syndrome is past us. There are finally more than a few women and blacks qualified for the position. I think it's just a matter of time--and I don't think it will be long.

Interesting thought CI and BillW raise. I am not aware of any Asians or Native Americans ...etc who are poised/qualified.

<Guess this would be another thread.>
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:22 pm
Sofia wrote:
Nimh-- Has Netherlands had a person of color in the top spot yet?


Goooood question.

No, we haven't had a Prime Minister of color yet. Of course, we've only had a minority population of some size since fairly recently - but by now, we are talking some 15% of the population, so ... we should at least start considering it!

Shamefully, we've never had a woman Prime Minister either, yet.

The first woman to get into Parliament was Suze Groeneweg, of the Social-Democratic Workers Party, the Labour Party's predecessor. That was in 1918 - when women weren't even allowed to vote yet! 1922 was the first time women got to vote in national elections ...

The first woman to become Minister was Marga Klompe, in 1956. For the Catholic People's Party, ironically enough (the CPP had been among the opponents of women's right to vote in '18). The first female Chair of Parliament was Jeltje van der Nieuwenhoven (Labour), in 1998 ...

Getting back to people of colour ... the first person of colour to come into parliament since WW2 (or so he says in an interview, in any case) was John Lilipaly, for the Labour Party again. That was in 1986 ... <shakes head>.

But it was the "stop-immigration" List Fortuyn, going out of its way to dispel the association with extreme-right parties elsewhere in Europe (and to embarass other parties, heh), which in 2002 appointed the first person of colour to a government position - a woman, too, Philomena Bijlhout. She became Deputy Minister of Emancipation.

Unfortunately she also was to break the record of shortest-time-in-office, as she had to resign after one day, when it came to light that she had been in Surinamese dictator Bouterse's militia in the 80s. In her place the List Fortuyn, however, appointed another person of minority background, Khee Liang Phoa.

To underline its point, the List Fortuyn also had a higher proportion of people from minority groups among its MPs than any other party, in 2002 ... up till then it had always been the Labour Party. By the 2003 elections, however, most minority group List Fortuyn MPs had been demoted or disappeared ...
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:28 pm
Didn't you forget something, nimh? I can understand that Pim Fortuyn was noone to be proud of, but the one aspect that fascinates me about him is that he was the first radical right-wing leader who was openly gay. If he hadn't been shot shortly before the election, he would have become a minister too.

Only in the Netherlands .... how long do you think it will take America before it produces its first gay Buchanan?
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:29 pm
I want Condoleeza Rice and Hillary Clinton to be the candidates in 2008. Wouldn't that be fun?
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:31 pm
Scrat wrote:
Do you doubt that Republicans would vote for Colin Powell if he were the party's candidate for P or VP? What does his skin color have to do with it?


Yes, I do doubt that Republicans would as easily vote for Powell as for a white candidate. I think there is a considerable number of Republicans that would have to 'swallow something away' before voting for an African-American. I also think there are many white Democrats that would hesitate to vote for an Afro-American candidate for the Presidency.

I think that that is part of the reason why there hasn't been a person of colour on the ticket yet, apart from, apparently - thanks for the info, BillW! - the Native Kansan Charles Curtis.
0 Replies
 
Sofia
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:31 pm
3078 AD

And, she/he will be followed by the plinking of bullets all around them.
0 Replies
 
BillW
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:32 pm
2012 Wink
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:37 pm
Thomas wrote:
Didn't you forget something, nimh? I can understand that Pim Fortuyn was noone to be proud of, but the one aspect that fascinates me about him is that he was the first radical right-wing leader who was openly gay. If he hadn't been shot shortly before the election, he would have become a minister too.


Doh! <grin> You're so right. Or Prime Minister, even. You don't know how many votes he would have gotten ...

Thomas wrote:
Only in the Netherlands .... how long do you think it will take America before it produces its first gay Buchanan?


Heh ... and this wasn't just an "openly gay" politician, either - he really flaunted it. We're talking a gay Buchanan who talks of his darkroom experiences in TV interviews; who, when asked on TV if he has anything against Moroccans, replies "me? I've slept with lots of Moroccan boys!"; who, when asked on a TV program for young people whether he is "as bald down below as on his head" responds, "I invite all boys of Holland to come and check for themselves!" ...

<big grin> Yeah, he was quite something! :wink:
0 Replies
 
Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:37 pm
nimh wrote:
Scrat wrote:
Do you doubt that Republicans would vote for Colin Powell if he were the party's candidate for P or VP? What does his skin color have to do with it?


Yes, I do doubt that Republicans would as easily vote for Powell as for a white candidate.

Well, that's evidence of your bias, not theirs.
0 Replies
 
Sofia
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:38 pm
I think Colin would be nominated and elected by the GOP. I just don't think he'll do it.

Hey. Its just hard to find a black guy (or woman) who agrees with the GOP planks on AA and a couple of other issues. Most blacks allow those one or two issues to prevent them from looking further into the party. And the peer pressure from other blacks is withering. A man as courageous and principled as Colin has been called an Uncle Tom.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:38 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
I want Condoleeza Rice and Hillary Clinton to be the candidates in 2008. Wouldn't that be fun?


<grins> That would be fun ...

Almost as much as Schwarzenegger vs Hillary ... ;-)
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:40 pm
nimh wrote:

<big grin> Yeah, he was quite something! :wink:


Hmmh: and a Catholic as well Laughing
0 Replies
 
Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:40 pm
Sofia wrote:
I think Colin would be nominated and elected by the GOP. I just don't think he'll do it.

Hey. Its just hard to find a black guy (or woman) who agrees with the GOP planks on AA and a couple of other issues. Most blacks allow those one or two issues to prevent them from looking further into the party. And the peer pressure from other blacks is withering. A man as courageous and principled as Colin has been called an Uncle Tom.

Let's not forget that the Democrats don't seem to be pushing any blacks for the top two slots either.
0 Replies
 
Sofia
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:43 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
Just wondering why this discussion doesn't include the other 'minorities.'


Just wanted to clarify. For me, person of color means any color/race other than 'white'. (Yes, I know, I'm beigy-pinkish, but ...)

I included all 'minorities'.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 03:49 pm
Minority groups will be 49.9 percent of the populat.ion in 2050, the Census Bureau said on March 17, 2004.
0 Replies
 
BillW
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 04:05 pm
There have been a few attempts for minority groups to link for power. If they ever achieve this, the coalition would be a power to behold. And, it only gets more so each year - as Walter just pointed out....
0 Replies
 
timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 04:06 pm
Condi -
The RIGHT
Candidate for '08


Hmmmm ... that does sorta have a nice ring to it ....
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 04:11 pm
nimh wrote:
Yes, I do doubt that Republicans would as easily vote for Powell as for a white candidate. [..] I also think there are many white Democrats that would hesitate to vote for an Afro-American candidate for the Presidency.


Scrat wrote:
Well, that's evidence of your bias, not theirs.


If you read up a little about the demonisation that the first Catholic candidate, for example, faced (try the link above for example) ... There's a historical tradition (and no, not just in the US) of the first candidate from whichever minority group facing severe "head wind", also from within his/her own party.

There's plenty examples out there of statistical anomalies in election results, where a coloured candidate got a distinctly smaller percentage of votes than would normally be expected for someone of his/her party in that seat ...

And re: the Republicans, we're talking a party in which a candidate like Buchanan got a quarter to a third of the votes in battleground states in the primaries against Dole ... and 3 million votes in total against Bush Sr. A party which put up David Duke as candidate for the Senate in 1990, in which race he got over half a million votes ... If you think there is not a section of this party (as there is of the Democratic Party) that would strongly prefer not to vote for a candidate of colour, you're just being naive.
0 Replies
 
timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 04:18 pm
Pretty much with ya there, nimh, even though it puts me with you in opposition to Scrat; a rare occurrance indeed, eh?
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Snowdon is a dummy - Discussion by cicerone imposter
TEA PARTY TO AMERICA: NOW WHAT?! - Discussion by farmerman
 
Copyright © 2025 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.05 seconds on 01/30/2025 at 02:23:44