132
   

Why do people deny evolution?

 
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 02:22 pm
@farmerman,
There's a lot termed "Chaos" or "chaotic" in both science and engineering. In concrete applications such as fluid mechanics, or as is increasingly arising in the various DNA & genetic analyses, Chaos simply refers to something that can't reliably be predicted, even in situations in which the model for it (or the differential equations involved) are well known. In short it arises from shortcomings in our ability to solve the governing equations or reliably predict a specific outcome. It's a fascinating topic.

My first involvement in it was an early attempt to numerically model the (highly non-linear) Navier Stokes equations for viscous flow at high Reynolds numbers. My model did its work crunching the numbers and yielding an unfolding picture. However the slightest change in initial conditions quickly yielded an entirely different detailed result. I had stumbled on "Sensitive Dependence on Initial Conditions" - a hallmark of the Chaos Theories that were very soon developed by smarter folks than me.

Thunderstorms are chaotic, but if there's a God I think he knows how they work.
OldGrumpy
 
  -1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 02:25 pm
@georgeob1,
Quote:
I find this debate, which has continued here for a very long time, to be a bit perplexing.


I totally agree here. It is sooo strange to see people blinded by this very idiotic theory!

Quote:
In the first place Darwin's theory indicating that species survived over time by the, usually slow, physical adaptation to their environment and the various survival threats they faced - a process he called "natural selection" is confirmed by a host of experimental, and even ordinary, observations.


Are you really , really , really sure, or are you just repeating the official storyline? I bet it is the latter!

Quote:
In this sense evolution is an observable fact, and not a theory at all.


Uh? of course it is a theory! in 'science' it is always a THEORY.

Quote:
Indeed, even at the microbial level, such natural selection can be observed among bacteria and viruses, which, over time, adapt to evade the effect of medicines we apply to destroy them.


ahhhhhhhh, and you call THAT evolution???? Hmmmmmmm, funny indeed!

Quote:
The tests and scriptures of nearly all religions are involve largely metaphorical references to creation and the spiritual live & consciousness associated with it. To use these details to imply a conflict with this, or other works of science, or, alternatively, to suppose that science refutes all ideas associated with a creator is to seek a conflict where none exists. My impression is that there is a lot of pretense and folly on both sides of these questions.


Sigh, I have stated numerous times that I am not into religions, bibles and other non-sense. You don't need to be to see how flawed evil-lotion theory is!

It is a scam and a hoax and I find it extremely entertaining to see people, like farmerman, defending a fairy tale, thinking that it is all real.
0 Replies
 
OldGrumpy
 
  -1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 02:28 pm
@georgeob1,
Quote:
There's a lot termed "Chaos" or "chaotic" in both science and engineering. In concrete applications such as fluid mechanics, or as is increasingly arising in the various DNA & genetic analyses, Chaos simply refers to something that can't reliably be predicted, even in situations in which the model for it (or the differential equations involved) are well known. In short it arises from shortcomings in our ability to solve the governing equations or reliably predict a specific outcome. It's a fascinating topic.

My first involvement in it was an early attempt to numerically model the (highly non-linear) Navier Stokes equations for viscous flow at high Reynolds numbers. My model did its work crunching the numbers and yielding an unfolding picture. However the slightest change in initial conditions quickly yielded an entirely different detailed result. I had stumbled on "Sensitive Dependence on Initial Conditions" - a hallmark of the Chaos Theories that were very soon developed by smarter folks than me.

Thunderstorms are chaotic, but if there's a God I think he knows how they work.


Well, sorry to say but the 'official mainstream' fluid mechanics is also very very wrong and flawed (otherwis it wouln't be in 'science') . But don't take my word for it, but please research the beautifull and highly intelligent works of Victor Schauberger. Of course, because of his sheer genius he is never mentioned in academia, because the academia are here to close people off, dumb them down and kill their creativity.
Such is the state in the affairs of men.
Yes, it is a sad thing, but, unfortunately, true.
0 Replies
 
OldGrumpy
 
  -1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 02:35 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
Darwin's argument about "only slow changes" may be needing a major cleanup.


Nope, the whole damned idiotic thing needs a cleanup. Ahh well let's face it, it is actually obsolete! Throw away the whole mess and let's do some real research instead of trying to proof a fable!!!

'science' at the moment is very very very sick! we need to leave this area till the whole mess is cleaned up, but I won't hold my breath!
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 02:39 pm
Old Grumpy appears to be fascinated by his own vague bits of hyperbole and non specific criticisms.

I'm not.
coldjoint
 
  0  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 02:52 pm
@georgeob1,
Quote:
Old Grumpy appears to be fascinated by his own vague bits of hyperbole and non specific criticisms.

The knowledge explosion predicted in the Bible is here and it has backfired. If there is a God he knew it would.
OldGrumpy
 
  0  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 02:55 pm
@georgeob1,
Quote:
Old Grumpy appears to be fascinated by his own vague bits of hyperbole and non specific criticisms.



Fascinated? lol, you have no clue what so ever. What are the 'vague bits' and what is my 'non specific criticism'?
Always funy to see how people edit things and leave bits out and put bits in, just to rescue their religion isn't it?
0 Replies
 
OldGrumpy
 
  0  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 02:56 pm
@coldjoint,
Quote:
The knowledge explosion predicted in the Bible is here and it has backfired. If there is a God he knew it would.


?
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 02:57 pm
@georgeob1,
My fluids mostly seep.
farmerman
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 03:03 pm
@georgeob1,
The Grumpter visits under various names, but all with the same fascination with his own brand of untestable science. The fact that we can repeat, predict, and model and design, means nothing .
I think he started off as a science major, flunked out, and has been trying to validate his own shortcomings on the backs of those whove worked hard to contribute




georgeob1
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 03:24 pm
@farmerman,
Well frankly speaking I've often wished I had studied more geology. In many applications it's pretty far removed from the mathematics that defines most physics, however, it is truly the study of how our world works, and geologists made significant contributions to both the development of the theory of Evolution, and modern physics, as it delved into the subatomic issues that were required to deal with an earth that, as geology revealed, was billions of years old.
farmerman
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 03:34 pm
@farmerman,
AHHHHHH Viktor SChauberger.(Weve had this fellow pop up from another series of sources when some guy was pounding on about zero point energy. As I recall (it was several years ago). Schauberger had severl Austrian (or maybe Australian), patents regarding his assertion about the differential of energy using water at 4 degrees C ,the densist , >Yet, there was no evidence presented, just bald assertions with nothing behind them.Maybe the grumster is easily impressed with this guys self promotion, other folks are not. It is so easy to laud some person in a supercilious style built on nothing, than it is to actually go out and LARN something.

We give da Vinci a lot of honor for being one of the first Europeans who studied "hydraulics and hydrology". The fact that he got so much wrong doesnt matter to me because he spent time thinking about the problems of head and pressure. Darwin, sorta the same thing. Ive always dwelt on his errors when , in reality, his lifes products constitute some fo the best thinking and study of the past millenium. (I even think it was so voted)


In my mind, you earn the right to critique. Similarly you need to earn yer bones to totally dismiss . Grumster has only shown me that, whatever you got---HES AGAINST IT,


PS, george ob, you are way too kind.
georgeob1
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 03:43 pm
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:

PS, george ob, you are way too kind.


I get over it easily.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 03:44 pm
@georgeob1,
"concept engineering" came as close to applied physics without hving to pray it doesnt go off.
I grew into geo after working as a chemist in rare earths after grad school.I think the concept of doing my science OUTDOORS was a dream. SO back to grad school to meld the disciplines. Fun, and like any pHD , theres the act of total mindless repetitive data gathering and testing of the hypotheses.
Would you do it again? Ignore the jet fighters thing.
OldGrumpy
 
  0  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 03:50 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
The Grumpter visits under various names, but all with the same fascination with his own brand of untestable science. The fact that we can repeat, predict, and model and design, means nothing .
I think he started off as a science major, flunked out, and has been trying to validate his own shortcomings on the backs of those whove worked hard to contribute


trying irrelevant ah's again, farmerboy? won't work. Wink
georgeob1
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 03:55 pm
@farmerman,
Good question. My nest assignment after getting the PhD was in a fighter squadron on USS Constellation in the Tonkin Gulf. I requested it because I feared becoming diverted from flying, and was a bit fed up with some untoward aspects of academia. Once back it was hard to get out and I did two subsequent tours there.

In retrospect I found both challenging in different ways, and was formed by them as well. Looking back, I wouldn't have changed the script.
georgeob1
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 03:56 pm
@OldGrumpy,
OldGrumpy wrote:

[trying irrelevant ah's again, farmerboy? won't work. Wink


Who's the judge of that? I thought it worked well.

farmerman
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 06:03 pm
@georgeob1,
You flew f-4's ? .

Remember, all those in side airstrips were sited dozed and set by a small bunch of engineers. Usually they were led by a jr lieutenant geologist to pick out laterite soil deposits that would set like concrete. The guys that made it back mostly wound up with ptsd.


georgeob1
 
  2  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 07:04 pm
@farmerman,
I did all my flying from aircraft carriers: no concrete & no laterite. However the two very different worlds we inhabited from the ship to the air & war could be a bit disorientating. Most of us who experienced this it retained a sense of it -- very hard to express or describe -- but it often seems that we all remained entangled with it and each other. Perhaps Bohr was right after all.
farmerman
 
  1  
Thu 10 Jan, 2019 09:01 pm
@georgeob1,
did you ever meet up with , say, Marine pilots who flew F-4's onto cly runways??
Did they ever have any comments about the stability and construction?
Those were my boys
 

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