Would open primaries lead to a more moderate government?

@boomerang,

boomerang wrote:

I think you've got to get rid of the party primary if what you want is politicians who will be willing to work with their "rivals"

But how would the law stop parties from having primaries? Parties have a right to peacibly assemble, and to select their candidate at the assembly, if they want to.

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Some states already have "open" primaries. In some of those states it is believed that voters "cross party lines" to vote for candidates they consider inappropriate. I know of no evidence from these primaries that any harm--or any good--is done.

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I am of the opinion that the purpose of a political party
is to offer the electorate candidates who represent
a particular filosofical point of vu, and then to aggressively fight
for its proferred ideals, rather than for it to "get along" with other parties.

I don't remember ANY candidate ever campaigning on the notion
that: "if u vote for ME, then if elected, I will compromize
our ideals with those who disagree with us."

David

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@Frank Apisa,

Being a "Liberal" in America has a stink associated with it. That's why so few will admit to it Frank. they are out there though and you know who they are...

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@McGentrix,

McGentrix wrote:

Being a "Liberal" in America has a stink associated with it. That's why so few will admit to it Frank. they are out there though and you know who they are...

The "stink" is enormous, McG...which is why I questioned what he was saying. It makes no sense. Bragging about being a conservative plays to audiences all across the country; bragging about being a liberal is like bragging about being a jackass. Tons of people do the former...damn near nobody does the latter.

Ya gotta wonder why you conservatives are so spooked...when all you can do is to call anyone who is not bat-**** crazy conservative...a liberal. And...you have got to search them out.

You guys are the beast...the liberals are tiny mice.

I cannot help but laugh when I see you guys going on and on about the dangers of liberalism...when you own the deck!

So...although you seem to think that I know who they are...I barely know any in real life...and very few in my cyber life.

So...they stink; they are damn near non-existent; and the few who do exist hide...yet according to you conservatives they are constantly kicking your ass. You guys are in a war to undo what a teeny, tiny minority manages to get past you...and even though they have almost no warriors, you cannot seem to beat 'em.

Yup, McG...they stink. They stink to high heaven.

I wonder what stinks more than them?

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@Frank Apisa,

This is the sort of exchange that makes me proud to be a liberal. I would never try to disguise myself by claiming to be progressive or moderate. I feel I am better than that.

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@edgarblythe,

edgarblythe wrote:

This is the sort of exchange that makes me proud to be a liberal. I would never try to disguise myself by claiming to be progressive or moderate. I feel I am better than that.

You well ought to be proud, Edgar.

Damn near everything decent and worthwhile about America came as the result of liberals fighting for it...and fighting those non-stinking conservatives who were doing their level best to oppose it.

Luckily...they are incompetent.

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@Frank Apisa,

Well Frank and Edgar, you should both be ashamed to admit to being even a bit liberal. Next you will be claiming that its ok to have medicare, and hospitals, and schools and all that other liberal BS that costs us conservative's money that would look much better in my checking account. If they dont have the money for the privilege of living let them die.

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@RABEL222,

RABEL222 wrote:

Well Frank and Edgar, you should both be ashamed to admit to being even a bit liberal. Next you will be claiming that its ok to have medicare, and hospitals, and schools and all that other liberal BS that costs us conservative's money that would look much better in my checking account. If they dont have the money for the privilege of living let them die.

Said with a healthy dose of sarcasm!

Well played, Rabel.

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@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

The "stink" is enormous, McG...which is why I questioned what he was saying. It makes no sense. Bragging about being a conservative plays to audiences all across the country; bragging about being a liberal is like bragging about being a jackass. Tons of people do the former...damn near nobody does the latter.

On a tangent --- perhaps we should start? After all, we can point to a liberal success story in a culture much like the United States'. Canada has enacted practically every reform that liberals in the States demand --- legal possession of pot, Medicare for all, gay marriage nationwide, barely any legal restrictions on abortion --- and it is clearly attractive. Come to think of it, I have yet to meet any American, liberal or conservative, who has lived in Canada and hated the public policy there. American conservatives, by contrast, are incapable of pointing to any comparable success story for their ideas. So by all means, let the bragging begin!

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@Thomas,

Thomas wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
The "stink" is enormous, McG...which is why I questioned what he was saying. It makes no sense. Bragging about being a conservative plays to audiences all across the country; bragging about being a liberal is like bragging about being a jackass. Tons of people do the former...damn near nobody does the latter.

On a tangent --- perhaps we should start? After all, we can point to a liberal success story in a culture much like the United States'. Canada has enacted practically every reform that liberals in the States demand --- legal possession of pot, Medicare for all, gay marriage nationwide, barely any legal restrictions on abortion --- and it is clearly attractive. Come to think of it, I have yet to meet any American, liberal or conservative, who has lived in Canada and hated the public policy there. American conservatives, by contrast, are incapable of pointing to any comparable success story for their ideas. So by all means, let the bragging begin!

I'd love to see it, Thomas.

But Americans are too in love with the idea of pissing and moaning to ever get to the mind-set of "government is needed and often works just fine."

Reagan started the nonsense. His (misunderstood, for the most part) diatribes against government and his "government IS the problem" has morphed into a monster.

But the left could use some bragging these days...and sure as hell deserve it more than the braggarts from the right.

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@boomerang,

Just consider the term "gerrymander." It sure doesn't sound contemporary, and it's not. It was coined in 1812 to describe the re-districting practice of MA governor Elbridge Gerry.

I didn't know this until I just looked it up, but Gov. Gerry was a member of the Democratic-Republican Party! So who invented the practice? Democrats or Republicans Smile

Since the Republican Party wasn't founded until 1854 there was at least 42 years in which it wasn't a ploy used by the GOP.

It's been used by both parties throughout the years since 1812, and while, currently, it may be more in use by Republicans there is Democratic gerrymandering.

See: http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2013/01/who-gerrymanders-more-democrats-or-republicans

Of interest is this article hardly paints a picture of run-away re-districting.

Assuming the author's methodology is credible, gerrymandering by Republicans has resulted in 11.5 seats. Two other guys mentioned in the article pegged the "unfair advantage" at 7 [And this is Mother Jones!]

So it would appear that all of the hue & cry about gerrymandering is pretty overheated and if a conservative like me somewhat bought into it, you can imagine how influential the propoganda has been with liberals...even to the extent that we have had several posters in this forum accuse Ted Cruz of obtaining his Senate seat through gerrymandering!

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@McGentrix,

Yeah! Both of them!

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@edgarblythe,

Well, that's one liberal.

Is the other one in this forum too?

What are the odds Frank?

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@Thomas,

It's easy with a small population Thomas. Canada has about the same population as California and they are certainly trying to be liberal... It works great so long as no one minds the mountains of debt and taxes.

Canada is a great place to visit, but not such a nice place to be prosperous, though they have managed to make a few billionaires.

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@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

I'd love to see it, Thomas.

But Americans are too in love with the idea of pissing and moaning to ever get to the mind-set of "government is needed and often works just fine."

Reagan started the nonsense. His (misunderstood, for the most part) diatribes against government and his "government IS the problem" has morphed into a monster.

But the left could use some bragging these days...and sure as hell deserve it more than the braggarts from the right.

Those humble, self-effacing liberals!

Just another aspect of the ridiculous argument that liberals are too nice; too civil to come out ahead in a head-butting with conservatives.

By the way, what conservative do you know or know of who has suggested that government is not needed and never works fine?

(Please spare us campaign sound-bites. We can trade those all day)

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Finn dAbuzz wrote:

Well, that's one liberal.

Is the other one in this forum too?

What are the odds Frank?

Beats me. I know I am not a liberal.

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Finn dAbuzz wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:

I'd love to see it, Thomas.

But Americans are too in love with the idea of pissing and moaning to ever get to the mind-set of "government is needed and often works just fine."

Reagan started the nonsense. His (misunderstood, for the most part) diatribes against government and his "government IS the problem" has morphed into a monster.

But the left could use some bragging these days...and sure as hell deserve it more than the braggarts from the right.

Those humble, self-effacing liberals!

Yeah!

Quote:

Just another aspect of the ridiculous argument that liberals are too nice; too civil to come out ahead in a head-butting with conservatives.

Well...they do hide a lot. Almost none around who own up to being liberals.

Quote:

By the way, what conservative do you know or know of who has suggested that government is not needed and never works fine?

(Please spare us campaign sound-bites. We can trade those all day)

Okay, George Bushenby; MaryAnn Strato; Pete O'Garry; Manny Olenski...ahhh...I could go on, but you get the idea. (Some of the names, actually all of them, have been altered to protect identities, since they have not given me permission to out 'em.)

Would open primaries lead to a more moderate government?

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