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Your thoughts on John Kerry

 
 
Sofia
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 06:10 pm
That's the first time I've heard any of this.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 06:20 pm
Ummm I didn't say that Heinz was the family business of John & Mrs. Kerry though that is the source of at least her money and a hefty chunk of their income now. The question remains whether John Glassman's information or Snopes information is the most accurate here. Snopes never posts its sources and does screw one up now and then though they are generally reliable.

The real issue is that Kerry has been all over the map on the issue of outsourcing and to accuse GWB of hastening this is at best pure politics, at worst disingenuous.

Most sources agree that most of those houses were the Mrs.' prior to the marriage, but even Snopes concurred that the marriage gave Kerry some interest in them. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

The fact that Kerry is wealthy doesn't bother me. You have to be wealthy or be backed by big money to run for president these days.

It was funny though that my initial post did not criticize him in any way but the assumption was that it did. Smile
0 Replies
 
JoanneDorel
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 06:25 pm
I blame Jimmy Carter.
0 Replies
 
Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 07:09 pm
safecracker wrote:

Well let me see here, you have said it is not true but provided nothing to show me such.


That's laughable, most of what's on this thread has been shown to be false.

To cite just one example of you posting a falsehood and claiming it's fact is the outright lie that Kerry went AWOL.

Try to substantiate your lie.
0 Replies
 
emclean
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 07:13 pm
yes Kerry served, he receved medels, some of which he threw over the gate at the captal, and yet still turned up on his office wall. they are tossed one day, and tresered the next. (ok, so not days, just when it is popular to be)
0 Replies
 
Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 07:15 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
Ummm I didn't say that Heinz was the family business of John & Mrs. Kerry


<raises eyebrow>

Foxfyre, in post 637026, while posting an article wrote:
But look at H.J. Heinz & Co., the family business of Kerry and his wife, Teresa.


Quote:
The question remains whether John Glassman's information or Snopes information is the most accurate here.


It's a convenient question to raise. But the snopes facts are verifiable.

Quote:
Snopes never posts its sources and does screw one up now and then though they are generally reliable.


False.

LOL! Snopes always posts their sources. You are grasping at straws. Look at the bottom of the page. Their sources are listed as they always are. I'll quote them for you:

Quote:
Sources:
Ackman, Dan. "Kerry Would Be Third-Richest U.S. President."
Forbes. 13 February 2004.

Lindeman, Teresa F. "Online World Wonders: If Kerry Wins, Will Heinz Benefit?"
Pittsburgh Post-Gazette. 10 February 2004.

Schoenberger, Karl. "Offshoring Jobs a Hot Topic."
San Jose Mercury News. 5 February 2004.


When trying to avoid the embarassment of having your "facts" shown to be falsehood you should not continue to make false statements. All you had to do is take a look at the page to see that your claim that "Snopes never posts its sources" is simply false. Snopes always posts their sources.

You've shown a complete disregard for facts, and a willingness to make demonstratably false claims. It's damn ironic that you attempt to indict snopes through yet another false claim.
0 Replies
 
suzy
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 07:19 pm
Uh huh.
And as I've already pointed out on another thread, the Heinz company sells the products it makes overseas to it's customers overseas, not to Americans.
It's FOOD, for gosh sakes. Fresh is good, right?
That's not really "outsourcing" in the sense you're trying to make it.
And if Kerry truly didn't deserve honors and awards, how did he get them? The same way Bush got an honorable discharge? (money)
0 Replies
 
suzy
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 07:21 pm
He threw his ribbons, not the medals. It's no secret!
0 Replies
 
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 09:00 pm
safecracker,

In your last post you offer an account of Kerry's medal that differs from the official military account and the accounts of the men with him.

I was wondering why you didn't provide a source. But a quick search revealed that this article is posted from the site

www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnkerry.com

I don't know why, but every time you all need to resort to this partisan drivel to discredit Kerry, I feel a bit better.
0 Replies
 
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 09:09 pm
Here is an article from the New York Times about the link I just posted (from which safecracker posted that article from). It is full of fabrication and is the source of one of the now infamous faked pictures that was manufactured to show Kerry with Jane Fonda.

http://www.independentsforkerry.org/info/index.php?category_id=1123

Quote:

Senator John McCain came to the defense of a fellow Vietnam War veteran, Senator John Kerry, on Friday by attacking the credibility of a North Carolina veteran who has dedicated himself to defeating Mr. Kerry in his campaign for president.

Mr. McCain, an Arizona Republican, called the man, Ted Sampley, "one of the most despicable people I have ever had the misfortune to encounter."

Mr. Sampley, a businessman from Kinston, N.C., has gained some attention in recent days for operating a Web site devoted to attacking Mr. Kerry, a Massachusetts Democrat, for his opposition to the war in Vietnam after his military service. The Web site, www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnkerry.com, includes pictures from the 1970's showing Mr. Kerry at antiwar protests. One shows Mr. Kerry at a rally, sitting several rows behind Jane Fonda, who was so outspoken against the war that she was labeled a Communist by her political opponents.

In response to Mr. McCain's remarks about him, Mr. Sampley said in a telephone interview: "It's not the first time he said that. That's his opinion. It's unbecoming of a senator to say things like that, but I'm fair game just like he is."

In 1993, Mr. Sampley was convicted of misdemeanor assault and sentenced to 180 days' probation for attacking a legislative aide to Mr. McCain.

...



Why do people who support Bush have to act so sleazy?
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 09:26 pm
Craven writes:
Quote:
LOL! Snopes always posts their sources. You are grasping at straws. Look at the bottom of the page. Their sources are listed as they always are. I'll quote them for you:


You mean Snopes' sources are magazine and newspaper articles? Well shoot. I can post a half dozen newspaper and magazine artciles that directly contradict Snopes' sources then.

So where does that leave us?
0 Replies
 
littlek
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 09:27 pm
This is good reading....
0 Replies
 
littlek
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 09:28 pm
foxfyre - go ahead.
0 Replies
 
suzy
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 09:35 pm
LittleK, You go girl! Very Happy
What I would especially like to know is this:
If what that site says about Kerry is true, why does he have the support of so many VietNam veterans? if I were one, I'd be furious if I believed those allegations!
Burkett is just a sour grapes republican, I bet.
0 Replies
 
Tarantulas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 09:47 pm
Quote:
Kennedy: Kerry's Actions Prove Iraq is Bush's Vietnam

(2004-04-05) -- In a major policy address at the Brookings Institution today Senator Edward M. Kennedy said that Democrat presidential candidate John Forbes Kerry's actions prove that "Iraq is George Bush's Vietnam."

"The parallels between Vietnam and Iraq are stunning when seen through the actions of one man who lived through both eras," said Mr. Kennedy. "Thirty-some years ago John Kerry fought in Vietnam, then later protested U.S. involvement in Vietnam. In October 2002, John Kerry voted to support war against Iraq, then later protested U.S. involvement in Iraq. Clearly, Kerry's actions and public statements demonstrate that Iraq has become a quagmire for Bush."

White House spokesman Scott McClellan responded to Mr. Kennedy's remarks by saying, "Ted Kennedy is John Kerry's Chappaquiddick."

ScrappleFace

And, as I posted elsewhere:

Quote:
HISTORIAN: NAVY COMMANDERS TO CAST DOUBT ON KERRY'S WAR RECORD

-- Never Spent A Day In Hospital For Self-Reported Wounds!

http://www.iconoclast.ca/images/AJOHNKERRY-OUR%20HERO--smaller%20255X.jpg

With Carl Limbacher and NewsMax.com Staff

Several Navy officers who supervised Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry when he commanded a swift boat in Vietnam are preparing to publicly question his war record -- including the circumstances under which he was awarded three Purple Hearts -- a noted Vietnam War historian revealed this past weekend.

Burkett, whose book, "Stolen Valor," is considered to be the definitive history of falsified Vietnam War claims, told WABC Radio's Steve Malzberg that Kerry's former commanders would allege that the top Democrat's Purple Hearts were awarded for "self-reported injuries that were virtually nonexistent." Burkett's book was among the first to expose many of the phony claims made by John Kerry about U.S. war atrocities. In "Stolen Valor" Burkett also revealed that Kerry did not discard his war medals, as he claimed in the 1970s.

"He never got a day of treatment, he never spent a day in a medical facility," Burkett said, commenting on Kerry's "wounds."

"These were all self-reported wounds, which you're going to hear from some swift boat guys in the future as to the nature of those wounds." Burkett said he had personally spoken to the Navy commanders who were preparing to go public about Kerry's decorations.

"You're going to get quite a showing [of those speaking out]," Burkett told Malzberg. "I don't know [the number] yet. They're trying to get it to be unanimous of every swift boat guy who ever served."

As to the timetable for the upcoming revelations, Burkett said that Kerry's superior officers "were still discussing that." "You've got some major rallies being planned against John Kerry by Vietnam veterans on the mall, at the convention -- this type of thing," he said. "And we're going to make America aware of John Kerry's military record."

Reproduced with the permission of NewsMax.com. Copyright 2004. All rights reserved.
0 Replies
 
suzy
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 09:51 pm
Yeah, so? A couple of mean-spirited attacks proves what?
Answer: Nothing!
But play again soon.

Sorry, it's late and my sarcasm is showing.
Although you asked for it!
Goodnight.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 10:02 pm
I am beginning to worry about Kerry, because he's making promises that are beyond his control. He now says he may need to retract his "promises." Not good for a presidential candidate of any stripe - IMHO.
0 Replies
 
Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 10:15 pm
Foxfyre wrote:

You mean Snopes' sources are magazine and newspaper articles? Well shoot. I can post a half dozen newspaper and magazine artciles that directly contradict Snopes' sources then.

So where does that leave us?


Well, it's damn easy to post an apocryphal urband ledged, have it debunked and then attempt to use the abiguity of media accuracy as your backup. But I'll let ya take this one all the way if ya want.

So if you really want to stand behind the items you posted that Snopes debunked feel free to do so. Support them as you wish. I'll do my best to respond to what you bring.

But because I am lazy, I'd like to restrict it to claims that you posted and were debunked by Snopes. This way, I have to back up my position within this snopes thing you got yerself into but don't have to do the research legwork for any ole email or web op-ed column you come across.
0 Replies
 
Tarantulas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2004 10:35 pm
suzy wrote:
Yeah, so? A couple of mean-spirited attacks proves what?
Answer: Nothing!
But play again soon.

Sorry, it's late and my sarcasm is showing.
Although you asked for it!
Goodnight.

The first one was a joke.

The second one was a group of eyewitnesses. There's nothing "mean-spirited" about the truth.
0 Replies
 
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Thu 8 Apr, 2004 06:46 am
You are basing your beliefs on what you read on NewsMax?!?

You have got to be kidding.

But, as I have said many times, Please keep attacking Kerry for his military service. It's not like we mind having this particular issue front and center.
0 Replies
 
 

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