Why is it so important to refute Christianity?

I would guess, Phoenix, that if the Christian belief in an afterlife is anywhere close to what is actually beyond the grave, and we are privy to getting our answers to things like this answered, we are all probably going to be very surprised. Smile

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RE: http://texnews.com/1998/religion/healing0418.html

Quote:

More and more doctors are becoming believers

Observation 1:
The article is six years old. It would be interesting to know if the "trend" foretold has continued?

Observation 2:
From the link:

Quote:

At a recent [sic] conference on Spirituality and Healing in Medicine

Hmmmm... I wonder who is most likely to attend such a conference. Wink

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Foxfyre- It's a lovely thought, but I just cannot relate to it.

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Thor- There is no doubt in my mind that people who have strong support systems, be it a religious congregation, or simply a circle of caring friends and/or relatives, are able to throw off illness better than those people who don't have these social supports.

Quote:

A "healing team" laid hands on people who came forward and anointed their foreheads with oil, making the sign of the cross.

I have read a number of articles and studies that show a positive correlation between human touch and healing. But that touch does not have to be in a religious context. Probably the advantage for the person who is very religious, is that the strong belief is what enables the healing.

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Foxfyre wrote:

I would agree Mesquite that those who would exclusively substitute faith for medical science are inappropriately rolling the dice. Who is to say that God does not inspire people to be healers through modern medicine as well as through laying on of hands, etc. Nor do I deny that the human mind has profound influence where the human body is concerned; i.e. the mind can believe that a placebo has healing power and therefore the body is healed.

Did you check my link on Peter Popoff and watch the video? This is an obvious fraud that has certainly damaged many lives. I haven't checked lately, but a couple of months ago , he was a regular on Sunday nights on the BET channel. And he is not alone, as there is a constant rotation of similar programs.

It may be my imagination, or perhaps that I am looking with a more critical eye lately, but there seems to be a resurgence of these frauds. Are they untouchable by our current justice system? Is this a concern only of non-believers such as myself?

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Mesquite- The problem is, because some people want so desperately to believe, that that is why these frauds and hucksters flourish.

Not ever throwing out the baby with the bathwater, I think that for some people, the comfort of religion can be an attractive, positive thing. Deep belief may enable people to overcome problems, and even heal themselves.

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Phoenix32890 wrote:

I have read a number of articles and studies that show a positive correlation between human touch and healing. But that touch does not have to be in a religious context. Probably the advantage for the person who is very religious, is that the strong belief is what enables the healing.

I'll agree with that, but never tried it outside a religious context. What I do know is that my hands do get very warm and some would say hot. One lady had extreme sweating on her head with my hands on her head for about 10 minutes. Do I have answers - nope. I've resisted this hands on and prayer for a very long time. I'm not keeping real good track of successes and failures. When I go pray and lay hands on someone it is very difficult for me. I'm so unworthy to have this gift.

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Phoenix32890 wrote:

Thor- There is no doubt in my mind that people who have strong support systems, be it a religious congregation, or simply a circle of caring friends and/or relatives, are able to throw off illness better than those people who don't have these social supports.

Did I say something to make you think that I don't agree with you? I don't think I'm prepared to argue against this, at this point.

Phoenix32890 wrote:

...Probably the advantage for the person who is very religious, is that the strong belief is what enables the healing.

This would seem to imply that the religious, as a group, would be healthier overall than the non-religious? Question

Faith healing seems to be slightly astray of the topic...

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Phoenix32890 wrote:

Not ever throwing out the baby with the bathwater, I think that for some people, the comfort of religion can be an attractive, positive thing. Deep belief may enable people to overcome problems, and even heal themselves.

I hear what you are saying Phoenix. I was referring more to these hucksters that are seeking only financial rewards from the most unfortunate of society. Tune in sometime to get a glimpse. I was hoping to hear from some of faith that were willing to help clean house.

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Quote:

This would seem to imply that the religious, as a group, would be healthier overall than the non-religious?

Thor- Not necessarily. The non-religious might have other sorts of networks that would supply the same kind of support that that is provided by religion. What I am saying, is that, everything else being equal (and nothing ever is) I am postulating that the extremely devout MIGHT receive an added benefit simply from the depth of their faith.

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Mesquite, I am quite familiar with 'Elmer Gantry' type scams that exist. Building on what Phoenix said, among the two billion (?) Christians on Earth, it is a given that a certain number of them are going to be susceptible to fraud. I personally take a very dubious view of those 'evangelists' who solicit pricey contributions in return for a 'healing prayer cloth' and I certainly do not accept all claims of healings as authentic.

It does not naturally follow that all Christians are scam artists any more than all Irishmen are drunkards or all Germans are Nazis or all Italians are members of the Mafia or all French are snotty or all Scots are miserly. (I use these as examples only because my heritage includes all.)

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Quote:

I was referring more to these hucksters that are seeking only financial rewards from the most unfortunate of society.

Mesquite- Unfortunately, it is the downtrodden, uneducated and unsophisticated who are the first to be taken in by charlatans. Many criminals have discovered that selling religion to the naive is a good way to make a fast buck. I don't blame that on religion. I think that the vast majority of religious practitioners mean well, but there is are criminal elements in every field!

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husker wrote:

I'm not keeping real good track of successes and failures. When I go pray and lay hands on someone it is very difficult for me. I'm so unworthy to have this gift.

In that case, be careful who you touch, and watch out for malpractice suits.

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to refer to "some" christains as being decent and caring human beings is somewhat akin to saying "some" atheists are decent and caring human beings. The implications are very interesting. perhaps we could leave it as "some" people are more compassionate than others and religion is not an indicator.

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While I believe Christianity tends to prompt more decency and caring in people than would probably exist without it, I agree with Dys that the fact that some people are pretty icky has nothing to do with the fact they are Christian or athiest or persuaded in some other way.

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Foxfyre wrote:

While I believe Christianity tends to prompt more decency and caring in people than would probably exist without it, I agree with Dys that the fact that some people are pretty icky has nothing to do with the fact they are Christian or athiest or persuaded in some other way.

Just pointing out your tendency to limit an otherwise insightful statement with a disqualifier. Laughing

Have to leave for a while. Sad

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Just didn't wish to contradict myself and suggest that Christianity doesn't make a difference, Mesquite. Smile

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I believe you are right Foxfyre. Sometimes it does make a difference. Sad

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Christianity didn't cause the behavior cited in the artcle attached to your link, Mesquite.

Because some Christians are bigoted or prejudiced or homophobic or whatever, it does not naturally follow that Christianity fosters bigotry, prejudice, homophobia, or whatever. Nor does it naturally follow that athiesm fosters human rights abuses, pograms against Jews, suppression of the arts, etc. just because that seems to happen when athiests take over control of countries.

People connect the wrong dots on stuff like that all the time.

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Foxfyre, Note that I used your favorite qualifier, "sometimes".

In ith picture with the articleThe man had a sign which read:

But the men of Sodom were wicked
and sinners before the Lord
exceedingly

Genesis 13:13

So long as the the Christian text book is stocked with homophobic lessons, I think we are bound to see some Christians following them. Does the fact that some Christians tend to overlook some of the darker passages make them better Christians?

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Why is it so important to refute Christianity?

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