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The State of Florida vs George Zimmerman: The Trial

 
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 05:52 am
@firefly,
firefly wrote:
Because in that interview he's still publicly defending George--his remarks are what you expect from a defense attorney. He's trying to make Zimmerman's behavior seem less alarming than it was.

The anger O'Mara felt toward Zimmerman when he came to the scene revealed what he was really feeling toward him. He knew Zimmerman provoked the entire situation--and had, on top of that, destroyed evidence of his actions..

Look, O'Mara dumped Zimmerman. His first lawyers also dumped him. Let's see how the new lawyer fares.
Let 's hope that Zimmy gets much better counsel that O 'Mara.
In that interview, he only stated what was obvious.
Sometimes, divorcing couples have squabbles.
I was eminently un-impressed with his work for Zimmy in the trial.
He won that trial because it was such an ez case.
( I was going to say that a chimp cud have won that case,
but upon reflection, that might be an exaggeration.)

There were good arguments -- dispositive arguments in my judgment--
that O 'Mara ignored. He had enuf time to prepare. Zimmy deserves better representation.





David
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 06:29 am
@OmSigDAVID,
ERRATUM:
"Let 's hope that Zimmy gets much better counsel that O 'Mara"

shud have been:
Let 's hope that Zimmy gets much better counsel than O 'Mara.





David
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 06:36 am
@MontereyJack,
MontereyJack wrote:
oralloy wrote:
coldjoint wrote:
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa20/Lexion07/Traylost_zpsad068225.jpg



I wish they'd fix the spelling error in this one, it'd be a lot more popular:

http://www.documentingreality.com/forum/attachments/f237/460695d1372280786-trayvon-martin-crime-scene-photo-trayvon.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/0ilRUy0.jpg



so coldjoint thinks a pitcure of trayvon giving the finger proves something.

so what does it prove when George W. Bush did it when president:http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_kK18CpDhHKM/RqQF4YgeItI/AAAAAAAAAnI/VIX8-6XP3mI/s400/bush%2Bfinger.JPG
or then-vice president Nelson Rockefellerhttp://ray032.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/vice-president-of-the-us-giving-the-finger.jpg

Clearly anyone who'd do something so heinous is likely to be a murderer, right, coldjoint?



I can't speak for coldjoint, but the reasoning behind the (misspelled) text on the one I posted is: when fired from handguns, the 9mm is a somewhat marginal round.

The 9mm is clearly not in the "mouse gun" category. It is clearly strong enough (although barely) for defense against humans. But at the same time, even a slight increase in potency will noticeably increase the effectiveness of the round.

While a single shot to the heart did work in this case, ending Trayvon's violent assault on him, Mr. Zimmerman would have benefited from having a more potent caliber of handgun.


The 9mm when fired from submachineguns does not have the same marginal qualities. The longer barrels really do it good.

I bet those Glocks with the extended target shooting barrels also notably improve the 9mm.

But anyway, for an ordinary self-defense handgun, something a bit more potent than the 9mm is better.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 07:09 am
@oralloy,
That is very true. I 'd not wanna bet my life on a 9mm.
I recommend a .44 special with hollowpointed slugs.
I deem .44 magnum to be overdoing it.

If I ever meet him, I 'll bring that up.





David
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 07:27 am
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:

That is very true. I 'd not wanna bet my life on a 9mm.
I recommend a .44 special with hollowpointed slugs.
I deem .44 magnum to be overdoing it.

If I ever meet him, I 'll bring that up.





David


Be careful to approach him in as non-threatening way as possible.
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 08:13 am
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:

OmSigDAVID wrote:

That is very true. I 'd not wanna bet my life on a 9mm.
I recommend a .44 special with hollowpointed slugs.
I deem .44 magnum to be overdoing it.

If I ever meet him, I 'll bring that up.





David


Be careful to approach him in as non-threatening way as possible.
I promise not to beat his head on the street, Frank.
(whether I ever meet him, or not).





David
0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  0  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 11:33 am
Haha it looks like a toy more suitable for a ladies handbag..Smile

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/zim-gun_zps2d298afb.jpg~original
http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/03/28/george-zimmermans-gun-a-popular-choice-for-concealed-carry/
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 11:58 am
@Romeo Fabulini,
do you think zimmerman went for the heart because he had little confidence in the stopping power of his weapon?

my argument is that he should have gone for the shoulder, and after he shocked martin with the pain pushed him off and held him at gun point till the police arrived. that martin was killed was unnecessary.

edit: I am not at all happy that the law sanctioned this unnecessary killing.
BillRM
 
  0  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 12:12 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
my argument is that he should have gone for the shoulder


LOL he is under someone pounding away at him and trying to interfere with his breathing and trying to seize his weapon and somehow instead of blindly firing into the attacker body he should had been able to place a bullet into the man shoulder!!!!!!!!!!

In fact all and I mean all self defense courses teach that if you are in a life and death situation the only time you are allowed to fire a gun at someone you aimed at the attacker center of mass and fired not one time but two times.

After firing then you re-judge the situation to see if you are still in danger and need to fire more rounds or not.

So Zimmerman firing just one time did not follow his self defense training.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  2  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 12:16 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
But anyway, for an ordinary self-defense handgun, something a bit more potent than the 9mm is better...

Well, he didn't use a handgun this time to get himself arrested.

This time he allegedly used a long-barrel shotgun to threaten an unarmed, and allegedly pregnant (according to him) white woman.

So, he's apparently flexible in his choice of weapons, as well as his selection of unarmed victims...

He seems flexible in his choice of lawyers too. He just hired a lawyer who has previously said Zimmerman should not have been carrying a gun the night he killed Martin, and she doesn't believe anyone should have guns.

oralloy, you're behind the times. The murder trial is over. Zimmerman now has new gun-related charges against him.

So, do you think a long-barrel shotgun should be the weapon of choice when you want to threaten an unarmed domestic partner? Or would you suggest he use a different kind of gun for that purpose?
0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 12:41 pm
Martin should have gone to sunday school to learn the first commandment-
"Thou shalt not sit on a guy punching him in the face and slamming his head into the ground"..Smile
firefly
 
  2  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 01:08 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
Zimmerman should learn that the lawful possession of guns doesn't include using them to threaten, and frighten, and terrorize, unarmed victims--since that's what he's been accused of lately.
0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 01:15 pm
Guns were invented for self-defence, and when Martin jumped on him Zim used his for that purpose..Smile
"Arms in the hands of citizens may be used at individual discretion in private self defense."- founding father John Adams
"The right of self defense is the first law of nature"- US judge St. George Tucker (1752-1827)


Minute Man statue
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/Minuteman.gif
izzythepush
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 01:28 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
Romeo Fabulini wrote:

Guns were invented for self-defence,


Were they ****. They were invented so those who had them could attack those who didn't.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 01:40 pm
@izzythepush,
RF really has a blind spot on guns; they were invented to kill. It kills more often they are used for "self defense." I'd like to see him prove otherwise.
Romeo Fabulini
 
  0  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 01:41 pm
Same with tanks, they were invented to make war more fun..Smile
"THAT'S WHAT I WANT! That's what I want to have!"- Hitler quote when watching a pre-war demonstration of early panzers
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 01:52 pm
@cicerone imposter,
He's got a lot of blind spots, one of them being that he likes to quote Hitler, then acts nonplussed when he's accused of racism.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 02:17 pm
@cicerone imposter,
And the current gun-related charges against Zimmerman have nothing to with self-defense, and he is not alleging self-defense.

That does put his gun-nut supporters in a rather difficult position--they can't drag out the Constitution to defend the types of current charges against him. In fact, they can't even content that he has any kind of "rights" to use guns for the purpose of threatening, and frightening, and terrorizing, unarmed domestic partner victims.

And, because they can't even use the excuse of his latest arrest to spew forth their racist bile, because his more recent "targets" have been two white women, and one white male, they tenaciously cling to continued vilification of his last victim--the unarmed black child he killed, in order to give their racism an opportunity for continued expression. It's sick, and sickening.

Meanwhile, Zimmerman has been arrested again on a gun-related charge.
hawkeye10
 
  2  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 02:25 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
That does put his gun-nut supporters in a rather difficult position-
"never point a gun at someone unless you are willing to shoot them" is one of the top three rules of gun culture, right?

Quote:
they tenaciously cling to continued vilification of his last victim-
if she is the only evidence that he committed a crime then her credibility must be challenged if justice is to prevail, this is not a flaw in the pursuit of justice. if her credibility is suspect then this reality is highly relevant.

Quote:
Meanwhile, Zimmerman has been arrested again on a gun-related charge.
it is the number of convictions that count in American law, not the number of arrests, and even that is highly dubious. Each bad act should be judged on its own merits.
firefly
 
  1  
Wed 27 Nov, 2013 03:03 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
if she is the only evidence that he committed a crime then her credibility must be challenged if justice is to prevail, this is not a flaw in the pursuit of justice. if her credibility is suspect then this reality is highly relevant.

What has that got to do with their continued vilification of Zimmerman's previous victim, Trayvon Martin, and their continued need to use him as an excuse to spew racist venom?

Where did I say anything about their challenging the credibility of his current accuser? In fact, they largely seem to be avoiding the issue that Zimmerman has been arrested again.

Your response to my comments is, once again, disconnected and illogical. You really do seem to have marked difficulty following and/or comprehending the posts you respond to.

And, she's not "the only evidence" that Zimmerman committed a crime. The police found Zimmerman locked in her house, with the door barricaded with furniture, and he was unwilling to respond to their requests/demands that he open the door. That's evidence they observed first hand, and it does seem to support her claim that a dispute occurred and that he threw her out of her own house. And there was other physical evidence inside of the house as well. The police believed her, which is why they arrested him, and this time they really didn't hesitate about doing that.

And, while Zimmerman was barricaded inside the house, he also gave himself time to alter the crime scene...
Quote:
The Sheriff’s Office got the warrant, suspecting that Zimmerman had locked away the shotgun after the confrontation but before deputies unlocked the door and pushed their way inside.
http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/11/zimmermans-new-lawyer-old-guns/

Her credibility about what took place, as well as his credibility, really can't be properly judged, at all, by the public, until the actual evidence against Zimmerman is released, and/or she, or both of them, actually testifies in court.
Quote:
it is the number of convictions that count in American law, not the number of arrests, and even that is highly dubious. Each bad act should be judged on its own merits.

That's in terms of having a criminal record. And, each new criminal charge is judged on its own merits in terms of legal procedures.

But, when someone continues to display a pattern of behaviors, that pattern can't be entirely ignored either, particularly in the court of public opinion, because that does say something about the habitual behavior of the accused and his credibility in a current case. Zimmerman has displayed patterns of behavior, and, we're not in a courtroom now. If it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck...the possibility it might be a horse is rather dim.





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