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The State of Florida vs George Zimmerman: The Trial

 
 
revelette
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 07:47 am
@BillRM,
Both statements can be true. Even a child has the right to say no and legally Trayvon Martin was a minor.
BillRM
 
  -1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 08:56 am
@revelette,
Quote:
Both statements can be true. Even a child has the right to say no and legally Trayvon Martin was a minor.


A minor does not mean a child and a 17 years old minor is not a child by any normal used of that term.

A great way to slander Zimmerman by stating that a woman claimed she was molested by Zimmerman at the age of six but Firefly and such that used that charge let out that George was eight himself at the time of this "molesting".

An eight year old super sexual predator my ass.

The idea that an eight years old child could get away with forcing a 6 years old child into doing something she did not care for without any adult knowing anything about it happening and then keeping this behavior up until the girl was 16 and he 18 is nonsense

The girl could not say no to another child in her own age range if she had wish to do so for a period of ten years!!!!!!

It hard enough for adults to get away with such behaviors for a decade let alone for someone starting as a very young child!!!!!!!!!!!

Next the only one found to have naked pictures of underage females is Trayvon not George.

For some reason the cousin have a grudge against George and such a bullshit charge when he was facing all the others nonsense would be an ideal means of getting back at him.

There is no indication that she is telling the truth concerning any sexual interaction of any kind let alone any such was force on her,


Firefly and the army of anti Zimmerman people are just looking to try to justify a negative view of an outstanding citizen no matter how silly the claims are on their face of people who have crawled out of the woodwork.

revelette
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 09:07 am
@BillRM,
Quote:
A minor does not mean a child and a 17 years old minor is not a child.


What if the 17 year old walking home from the store at night in rain was a 17 year old white girl? What if instead of punching Zimmerman in the nose, she shot him? I betcha anything in the world, the right wing would have had Zimmerman demonized as some kind of illegal immigrant and the girl turned into a child heroine.

I don't know the story of Zimmerman and his cousin. I do know that kids do bother other kids and it is not always friendly play. Guilt comes into it, children go into all kinds of mental reasons why they would keep such a thing a secret.

Furthermore, it would be an odd thing to make up.
firefly
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 09:17 am
@revelette,
Quote:
Even a child has the right to say no..

In addition to which, a 6 year old cannot legally consent. What this relative describes is not normal age-appropriate play behavior on Zimmerman's part--it is unwanted physical contact of a sexual nature, and it is child molestation.

Because the perpetrator is also a child, does not make the activity any less of a molestation, or the effects on the victim any less damaging.
Quote:
Said the young lady to investigators in 2012,

“It started when I was six. We’d all lay in front of the TV and we had pillows and blankets and he would reach under the blankets and try to do things and I would try to push him off but he was bigger and stronger and older,”

The woman said, audibly weeping in the Florida State Attorney’s Office interview recording released Monday.

“It was in front of everybody and I don’t know how I didn’t say anything, I just didn’t know any better...It's not just me that he did these things to."

The other alleged victim would not come forward.

The woman, identified in various reports and in taped interviews with investigators as witness 9, said that from the age of six to 19 Zimmerman repeatedly fondled her, at times penetrating her vagina with his finger.

According to the young family member, the molestation continued for years during family visits. The woman only came forward after Zimmerman "went into hiding" following the fatal shooting of Martin - she finally felt safe.

"This is the first time in my life that I’m not afraid of him. [H]e cant get to me. If I saw him on the street or saw him anywhere it would just make me break down in tears, but now with everything going on I know that he’s not going to be out in public. I won't go to Target and see him anymore. I’m not afraid of him anymore.”


Quote:
Trayvon Martin was a minor.

On that issue, there should be no dispute. Trayvon Martin was only 3 weeks beyond his 17th birthday. He was a minor--a child. He was not old enough to vote, buy a beer in the 7/11 he had just visited, etc.

BillRM has problems dealing with reality.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 09:28 am
@BillRM,
Quote:
Firefly and the army of anti Zimmerman people are just looking to try to justify a negative view of an outstanding citizen

And you don't have to look too far to see that George Zimmerman is not an "outstanding citizen."

1. His former fiancée got a restraining order against him for domestic violence

2. He was arrested for assaulting a law enforcement office

3. He was fired from a part-time job as a party security person for being too aggressive.

4. His cousin has accused him of sexually molesting her for a period of 10 years, beginning when she was 6 years old.

5. His wife currently has fears in the back of her mind that he might become violent toward her.

6. He's an untrustworthy, deceitful, brazen liar who devised an elaborate scheme to conceal evidence so he could manipulate the decision of a judge in a court of law.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 09:32 am
@revelette,
Quote:
What if the 17 year old walking home from the store at night in rain was a 17 year old white girl? What if instead of punching Zimmerman in the nose, she shot him? I betcha anything in the world, the right wing would have had Zimmerman demonized as some kind of illegal immigrant and the girl turned into a child heroine.


Bullshit.............

Quote:
Furthermore, it would be an odd thing to make up.


My guess is that there was at some point in time some sexual interaction between the two and it resulted in hard feelings later on.

But that does not mean that sexual actions happen at 6 and 8 or that it was unwilling on either party part.

Regret over having sex with someone turn into rape far too often.
firefly
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 09:49 am
@BillRM,
Quote:
But that does not mean that sexual actions happen at 6 and 8 or that it was unwilling on either party part.

It's abnormal for an 8 year old child to initiate sexual activity toward another younger child--and this was not mutual, it was something the older child did to the younger one who did not know how to handle the unwanted contact--and 8 year olds are way beyond the age of harmlessly "playing doctor".
Quote:
Child-on-child sexual abuse is further differentiated from normative sexual play or anatomical curiosity and exploration (i.e. "playing doctor") because of overt and deliberate actions directed at sexual stimulation or orgasm. In many instances, the initiator exploits the other child's naïveté, and the victim is unaware of the nature of what is happening to them.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child-on-child_sexual_abuse


Did you molest other children when you were 8?
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 09:50 am
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Did Rochefeller ever try to murder someone on the streets or brag about his ability to harm others or got kicked out of school for misbehaving or.........

We all know that Trayvon was at the very very best a hoodlum what to be and you are others and not helping other young black men by trying to turn him into a victim of racism and self defense laws instead of a victim of his own damn behaviors.

You can not begin solving the problems that are costing us all far too many young black men futures by pretending it all due to racism and evil non black men.

Congratulations on your circular reasoning.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 10:12 am
@parados,
Circular reasoning has some truth in it, but Bill's opinion is full of fiction.

In other words, it's based on bull ****!
BillRM
 
  0  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 11:02 am
@cicerone imposter,
An you poor fools need to try to libel Zimmerman at the age of 8 years old while poor hoodlum Trayvon was a poor child at the age of 17.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 12:27 pm
@cicerone imposter,
BillRM is trying to find some way to blame a child homicide victim, who might well have been trying to defend his own life, as being responsible for his own death--and saying, therefore, that child deserved to die.

This is not unlike the way he tries to blame rape victims for their own rapes.

And, not only does he blame Martin for his own death, he blames his two loving, concerned, decent parents for their child's death, because they didn't teach him how to "behave properly". I suspect Martin's parents did teach him how to behave properly by telling him that, if he was confronted by someone, an adult stranger, who appeared to want to harm him, he should defend himself. And their child, who had been stalked in the dark, by a menacing stranger, who never identified himself, had every right to defend himself with a punch, certainly if this stranger had tried to detain him, or revealed he was armed. Trying to blame these people for their child's death, and for the actions of George Zimmerman, is not just illogical it's despicable.

BillRM furthermore tries to distract from Zimmerman's behaviors by irrelevantly bringing up black on black crime, the incarceration rate of young black men, and other recent crimes blacks have been involved in. For someone who claims race was not involved in the Zimmerman case, BillRM can't stop talking about race--generally to talk about how blacks are involved in crime, and to attribute all kinds of negative stereotypes to Zimmerman's victim, mainly because he was black. BillRM is letting us know this case is about race, in his mind, and Trayvon Martin was just another one of those black ghetto hoodlums. In other words, BillRM is not only embracing the idea that Zimmerman racially profiled Martin that night, he is saying he was correct to do so. BillRM is a racist. That's really why he feels Trayvon Martin deserved to die--he views this black kid's life as worthless, so his death's no loss to anyone--BillRM has called Martin, "a walking piece of ****". Could he dehumanize this child any more than that? Could he voice more contempt than that?

All young black men seem alike to BillRM. He can't even acknowledge that Trayvon Martin was not a ghetto teen, he was a middle class kid, with two hard-working parents, who were able to provide him with a comfortable life style, and expectations of a promising future that included getting a college degree, just like his older brother. His loving and involved father was a strong presence in his life, as was one of his uncles, an ex-Marine. He had good role models, and good influences, and good opportunities. And he had never been in trouble in the community--no anti-social or criminal behaviors, no run-ins with the police, no arrests, etc.--and he never displayed aggressive or harmful behaviors toward others.

To try to characterize this teen as a "hoodlum" or "thug" or "want to be hoodlum" is so absurd it's downright ludicrous. Zimmerman made a mistake when he did that, and profiled him just based on Martin's race and dress, but BillRM is knowingly distorting and stereotyping this kid, and disregarding facts to do it--like the fact that Martin wasn't a trouble maker in his community, he wasn't really a trouble-maker in his school either. And he wasn't the one who began stalking someone in the dark that night.

Getting suspensions for things like playing hooky once, or writing "WTF" on a school locker, and even for having an empty baggie with a trace of pot, hardly mean that any kid is "a hoodlum"--these are the somewhat mildly rebellious behaviors that are within the norm for male adolescents. Trayvon was never "kicked out of school"--he received a few days suspension as a disciplinary action. He was not a management problem in school in terms of being disruptive, or defiant toward teachers, or aggressive toward other students. Once in a while he broke a rule--what adolescent doesn't?

As far as anyone knows, he never stole anything, nor did he have a need to steal--his parents gave him money. The nonsense about his having some jewelry is just that--nonsense. No one ever determined the rather odd assortment of jewelry--mostly a collection of plain wedding bands-- was stolen from anyone, and it may well have been something a friend gave him to hold--Martin acknowledged it wasn't his. And whatever pictures were on his cell phone, or the private messages he sent to friends, are equally unrevealing in understanding what his actual behavior was like--since he was not engaging in anti-social or criminal activities in his community, he was just bantering with friends in a private conversation, and doing all of the boasting, and bragging, and lying, and exaggerating, and fantasizing, and macho talking, that many adolescent males engage in--and it's just talk. In reality, in the real world, this kid neither looked like, nor acted like, "a hoodlum" or a "gangsta".

So, not only does BillRM try to assassinate this 16 year old's character, and distort his actual behaviors, he then laughably asserts that George Zimmerman was an "outstanding citizen" despite Zimmerman's track record of genuinely anti-social behaviors, which included the abuse and harm of others.

1. His former fiancée got a restraining order against him for domestic violence

2. He was arrested for assaulting a law enforcement office

3. He was fired from a part-time job as a party security person for being too aggressive.

4. His cousin has accused him of sexually molesting her for a period of 10 years, beginning when she was 6 years old.

5. His wife currently has fears in the back of her mind that he might become violent toward her.

6. He's an untrustworthy, deceitful, brazen liar who devised an elaborate scheme to conceal evidence so he could manipulate the decision of a judge in a court of law.

What's really puzzling is why BillRM feels compelled to, rather compulsively, repeatedly attack and smear this child's reputation and character, mainly through the use of negative stereotypes about black young men--stereotypes that really don't fit this particular young black male, or his decent, hard-working, responsible middle class parents.

In BillRM's racist mind there are apparently no young black males who aren't on a fast track to a life of crime and years behind bars. Even the ones who haven't been in trouble with the law, who plan on following an older brother to college, who think about becoming a pilot one day, who enjoy a totally normal range of teenage activities, and who aren't doing anything to harm or hurt anyone, are still suspect in his mind. If you're BillRM, you just can't trust any young black males.

The night he was killed, Trayvon Martin was the house guest of a woman who is a correction officer in a juvenile detention facility. If anyone should be able to spot a teenage "hoodlum" it's a person who works with that type day in and day out, and she very likely wouldn't want someone like that in her home, or near her own 14 year old son. But this woman did welcome Trayvon Martin into her home, several times, and she described him as being well behaved and respectful--because that's how he really acted. She wasn't afraid to go out of her home and leave Trayvon alone with her own son or her property, she didn't think Trayvon Martin was drug-addled, or criminal, or a threat to anyone. And she actually knew him.

But, when your agenda is to promote racist attitudes, as BillRM appears to be doing, you're not going to let reality stand in your way of doing that. And, if any black person raises the issue of racial profiling, or racial inequity, and you're BillRM, you're going to call them a "race-baiter" even though you're the one spouting all the racist attitudes...

BillRM seems to live in some sort of alternate reality. And it's a rather hate-filled place he inhabits.



cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 03:14 pm
@firefly,
You're just wasting your time on Bill. His perception about reality is based on his own imagination and misinformation. There's no way to change his mind about Zimmerman. He's a mentally incompetent, sick, individual without any conscience or morals.

Your efforts have no value to Bill.
BillRM
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 05:00 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Show me some proof that Zimmerman is anything but an outstanding citizen and that Trayvon was anything but a young man on the path of becoming a low level criminal.

Oh by proof I do not mean edit 911 tapes or claims of him being a child molester of a 6 years old leaving out the little tiny detail that this claimed happening dated back to when he was an 8 years old himself!!!!!!

Or claims of domestic abused based on a nasty divorce where both parties got domestic restraining orders against the other and there was no arrests or any charges of domestic abused file.

Let see Zimmerman acting in aid of a friend at a bar by putting a arm on the other party shoulder without knowing that the other party was an off duty police officer will not do it either with special note of all charges being drop.
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 05:26 pm
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Show me some proof that Zimmerman is anything but an outstanding citizen...


That has been done time and time again. Try to GET it.



BillRM
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 05:36 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
That has been done time and time again. Try to GET it.


I seen nothing that would show Zimmerman in a bad light oh by the way shortly after Zimmerman run in with an law enforcement officer in a bar not in uniformed or IDing himself another similar cop with the same department got himself killed by another police officer that have no idea he was dealing with another cop.

Not a good idea to be doing police work without allowing either the public of other cops to know you are law enforcement.

PS...no legally following someone on the public streets to guide the police to that person is not doing police work.....LOL

Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 05:55 pm
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Quote:
That has been done time and time again. Try to GET it.


I seen nothing that would show Zimmerman in a bad light oh by the way shortly after Zimmerman run in with an law enforcement officer in a bar not in uniformed or IDing himself another similar cop with the same department got himself killed by another police officer that have no idea he was dealing with another cop.

Not a good idea to be doing police work without allowing either the public of other cops to know you are law enforcement.

PS...no legally following someone on the public streets to guide the police to that person is not doing police work.....LOL




You just WILL NOT get it, Bill.

What you asked for has been done dozens of times.

In as friendly as way as possible...whatever is driving you to be blind to it is something you ought really to deal with.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 05:58 pm
@Frank Apisa,
By the way Frank the more I find out about Zimmerman the more I am happy that I was one of tens of thousands of people who wrote checks so he could deal with an out of control legal system bowing to political pressure on almost equal terms.
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 06:00 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Asking Bill to
Quote:
Try to GET it.
is an IMPOSSIBLE TASK.

In other words, A WASTE OF TIME.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 06:01 pm
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

By the way Frank the more I find out about Zimmerman the more I am happy that I was one of tens of thousands of people who wrote checks so he could deal with an out of control legal system bowing to political pressure on almost equal terms.


Whatever is driving you to deal with all this the way you are...is something you would do well to deal with, Bill.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Mon 2 Sep, 2013 06:02 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

Asking Bill to
Quote:
Try to GET it.
is an IMPOSSIBLE TASK.

In other words, A WASTE OF TIME.


It may well be, ci.

I feel an obligation...human being to human being...to keep working at it.
 

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