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The State of Florida vs George Zimmerman: The Trial

 
 
firefly
 
  -1  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 12:28 pm
@Baldimo,
Quote:
You haven't provided any links or articles showing he had to ID himself.

The police report of the investigation pointed it out as a failing on Zimmerman's part. Zimmerman had opportunity to both avoid an encounter, by remaining in his vehicle, and to defuse the situation by IDing himself, and he did neither.

In other words, Zimmerman's lousy judgment created the entire situation that led to a needless and avoidable death.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  0  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 12:35 pm
@gungasnake,
gungasnake wrote:

Quote:
Ahhh...so you think a wife should commit crimes in order to keep her husband out of prison.


In theory at least, an honest and competent DA should almost never be in the position of holding somebody in jail for a year or more awaiting trial, and then have a jury declare the person totally not guilty. When that happens, ideally, the DA should spend a year or more in prison thinking it over.

In this case, the intention of the persecutors and the original judge who, you'll remember, got bounced off the case, appeared to be to have GZ in jail or prison long enough that their little political problems might just go away.

Don't expect ordinary people to impute decent motives to you or to anybody like you, Frank, you haven't earned it.


Apparently you misunderstood the question, Gunga.

What I meant was: So you think a wife should commit crimes in order to keep her husband out of prison?

Do you?
firefly
 
  0  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 12:35 pm
@parados,
Quote:
As I have pointed out before, the ONLY people that seem to think it tastes good and is a recipe for "purple drank" are Conservatives trying to defend Zimmerman's action.

Well, if they're the ones drinking it, that would explain the bizarre thinking in some of their posts.

oralloy, for instance, is sure that Zimmerman saved an entire family from being slaughtered by Martin that night. Rolling Eyes

0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  2  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 12:49 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
The cost is a lot less then having the speed limit on our highways in the 60s 70s MPH instead say 45 MPH for example in terms of dollars and lives.


That's not answering the question and if you don't know it you damn well ought to.

There's an economic advantage in traffic movements. What's the economic advantage of 300,000,000 guns in circulation? To set against the disadvantages. Which are very great in my estimation.

You could impose a 5mph speed limit to see what the economic advantage of 50 or 70 mph limits are. That would save lives in one way but cost them in other ways.

As I said--if you can't make the advantages, from both economic and psychological points of view, outweigh the disadvantages you can easily be seen as a wrecker.

Quote:
Second footnote having an armed citizenry can be a life saver when government break down in an area for whatever reason such as south florida in 1992 or south California in the late 1880s. Just two examples in US history.


That's one example of complete drivel. What's an "area"? What's "break down"? What's "can be a life saver"? What's "government"?

What is the US getting out of 300,000,000 guns apart from a millstone round its collective neck. You're un-American. Un-patriotic. It's a Business culture. How is 300 million guns good for business? Sure it's good for some but overall it's a giant minus and the flag should not be displayed when guns are being promoted.

If you show how it is good for US inc. I'll have a rethink. Get on with it eh instead of wittering away about by-gone times.



OmSigDAVID
 
  3  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 12:50 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
So many people on these threads have blinders on that they can't see the obvious racial bigotry in this country.
firefly wrote:
That's because they are too busy contributing to the racial bigotry in this country, C.I.
So What?? That is off-topic.
firefly
 
  0  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 12:50 pm
@Frank Apisa,
But Shellie Zimmerman didn't have to lie to keep her husband out of jail--they had adequate assets in his legal defense fund to meet the amount needed for bail--that's what the Zimmermans were trying to hide, along with the existence of his second passport.

The judge jacked up Zimmerman's bail, after all the lying and concealment was exposed, because he rightly assumed that Zimmerman was planning to flee the country with the hidden assets and his second passport. The high bail set the second time around, along with the ankle monitor he had to wear, was to prevent him from skipping town.

Both Mr. and Mrs. Zimmerman are untrustworthy liars.
firefly
 
  -1  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 12:54 pm
@spendius,
If you want to discuss the economics of the gun culture in this country with BillRM, please do it in another thread, spendi. That really isn't what this thread is about. Guns are big business in this country, but that isn't even tangentially related to the Zimmerman trial or verdict--although both the NRA and the gun lobby see this case as good for the gun business.
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 01:08 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Your post is "more" off topic than our exchange about racial bigotry - which happens to be the crux of this subject. It's called "racial profiling" by Zimmerman.
Frank Apisa
 
  0  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 01:10 pm
@firefly,
firefly wrote:

But Shellie Zimmerman didn't have to lie to keep her husband out of jail--they had adequate assets in his legal defense fund to meet the amount needed for bail--that's what the Zimmermans were trying to hide, along with the existence of his second passport.

The judge jacked up Zimmerman's bail, after all the lying and concealment was exposed, because he rightly assumed that Zimmerman was planning to flee the country with the hidden assets and his second passport. The high bail set the second time around, along with the ankle monitor he had to wear, was to prevent him from skipping town.

Both Mr. and Mrs. Zimmerman are untrustworthy liars.


They certainly lied to the judge about their assets...and they should be held to account for those lies.

We'll see what happens.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 01:25 pm

The George Zimmermn Story: A Study In Pristine INNOCENCE

1. Our hero, George, becomes aware of burglaries in his naborhood.

2. The beauteous Olivia sees 2 blacks break into her apartment
in that complex and she is both un-armed and in a state of terror.
911 Operator tells her that the police r on their way
and that in the meantime, she shud take up any weapon
that she has on hand. With her little baby in one arm,
she hides behind a pair of "rusty scissors" in defense,
while hollering: "Get out of my house. The police r coming.
Get out of here! The police r on their way." One of the blacks
is arrested for burglary; the other one escapes. (Travon ??)

3. Zimmy finds out about the crime and he comforts Olivia,
giving her a new lock for her back door and his wife 's fone number.

4. Subsequently, Zimmy sees a young black looking at houses
in the naborhood, standing in the rain. Zimmy lawfully follows,
keeping the suspect in sight. Suspect flees the scene.

5. Zimmy calls 911 from his vehicle, requests the police investigate
to find the suspect (of casing the naborhood).

6. 911 Operator suggests that Zimmy not follow the suspect,
but he asks Zimmy for a more specific location to meet police.

7. Zimmy agrees to stop following suspect.
He goes to find a street number for the 911 Operator.
He dismounts from his vehicle to accomplish this purpose.

8. Having fled, the suspect is not in sight, until he abruptly
re-appears, confronts Zimmy smacks him in the face,
knocks him over backward and beats his head on the cement
sidewalk, to make Zimmy 's brain fall out.

9. Zimmy takes out his puny little 9mm Kel Tec automatic
and he applies it to its defensive purpose,
discharging a warning shot into the chest of the target,
which generates the desired effect in that the target
dis-engages from further abuse of our naborhood hero, Zimmy.

Note that Zimmy KNEW that police were on the way,
in that he had called them himself. He had no way of knowing
whether the police were observing that struggle,
as thay approached from whatever distance it was,
nor did he know how many nabors were watching
or photographing the fight from inside their apts.
or from outside, as Zimmy yelled for help.
Presumably, he did not elect to perpetrate felonies
in front of approaching police nor in front of nabors with cameras.

1O. There has been a counter-argument
offered in refutation of Zimmy s innocence,
in that he allegedly supported Obama.





David
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  0  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 01:34 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
They certainly lied to the judge about their assets...and they should be held to account for those lies.

George conspired with his wife to conceal the assets, and he lied to his lawyer about the assets, but only she lied directly to the judge, while he sat there and let her do it.

Only Shellie Zimmerman was charged with Perjury In Official Proceedings.
George didn't commit perjury--he just sat there, according to the judge, "like a potted plant"--so he can't be held accountable.

Her next court date is the 21st of this month.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  2  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 01:34 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
If you want to discuss the economics of the gun culture in this country with BillRM, please do it in another thread, spendi.


Why? Is it because I'm distracting attention from your hopeless approach.

The case couldn't exist here. Even our police are not armed so a neighbourhood watchman wouldn't be. Of course it is relevant to the case because only in a gun culture would Mr Z be carrying a gun. And only in a gun culture would you meet your opposition and not only fail to budge it one inch but drive it into more extreme positions.

If it cannot answer the charge of economic sabotage it has nothing left to say. And it looks like it can't whereas it can handle anything you have to say.

The NRA, if my hypothesis is true, is a danger to US inc. And I will think it true unless it is shown to be false.
firefly
 
  0  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 01:55 pm
@spendius,
Trust me, your approach is hopeless too.

And the gun-lovers around here will simply go on automatic pilot and mindlessly regurgitate the same things they always do.

http://afeatheradrift.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/nra.jpg

Guns are very big business, and paranoia and fear help to sell guns.

http://media.mcclatchydc.com/smedia/2013/02/01/11/37/MHHW8.SlMa.91.jpeg

http://static.selfdeprecate.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/assault-rifle-ban-cartoon.jpg

This is the danger of the NRA....
http://0.tqn.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/W/0/5/NRA-Hired-Gun.jpg

http://media.cagle.com/95/2013/05/03/131206_600.jpg

You won't prove anything with them, spendius.

0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 01:57 pm
@spendius,
W
Quote:
hat is the US getting out of 300,000,000 guns apart from a millstone round its collective neck. You're un-American. Un-patriotic


So a subject of the queen is telling me that I am un-american how amusing given that the very reason we do not trust government go back to your nation actions in the colonies directed at the time free Englishmen.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  2  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 01:58 pm
@spendius,
Quote:
What's the economic advantage of 300,000,000 guns in circulation?


That's not about economics, it's about freedom and preventing tyranny.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 02:08 pm
@gungasnake,

Quote:
What's the economic advantage of 300,000,000 guns in circulation?
gungasnake wrote:
That's not about economics, it's about freedom and preventing tyranny.
Yes; of course.

There was a time when the English valued (relative) freedom.
Thay were proud of it.
BillRM
 
  1  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 02:22 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
crux of this subject. It's called "racial profiling" by Zimmerman.


No the assault and the attempted murder by Trayvon that is the crux of the matter.

Bullshits claims of racial profiling with no indication of any kind that Zimmerman care one way or another over Trayvon skin color is the crux of bullshit and nothing more.

Zimmerman to 911 when ask about the race of the person he was concern about stated I think repeat I think he is black.
firefly
 
  0  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 02:41 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
No the assault and the attempted murder by Trayvon that is the crux of the matter.


Asshole, it was Zimmerman who was on trial for murder.

And Zimmerman will forever be remembered as a child killer.

But you just want to go on spewing your racist crap, and using Trayvon Martin as an excuse to do that.

You and Rush Limbaugh, buddies in racism.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_toWYJVoGFEc/SwsVleN0ugI/AAAAAAAAAB0/9IYRX4JZpeE/s1600/GREAT+POLITICAL+CARTOON.jpg

Gotta fear all those unarmed black children....


0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  2  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 03:04 pm
@gungasnake,
Quote:
That's not about economics, it's about freedom and preventing tyranny.


I didn't say it wasn't but I asked for the economic cost to be quantified. It seems a neglected aspect of the matter despite its great importance.
firefly
 
  1  
Wed 14 Aug, 2013 03:15 pm
Who says the NRA is insensitive to the needs of young blacks to protect themselves? Smile

Quote:
NRA Offers Membership Discounts to Young Black Adults
Jul 19, 2013

The National Rifle Association announced it is offering membership discounts to young black men and women who join the organization.

In a statement, the gun-rights group highlighted last year's fatal shooting of unarmed black teenager Trayvon Martin and the number of deaths of unarmed black men as evidence that African-Americans need to join them in supporting gun rights and self-defense laws across the country.

"Had Mr. Trayvon Martin been legally allowed to arm and defend himself, this tragic case might have had a different outcome," the NRA said in a statement. "Instead, an unarmed man – who was legally prohibited from purchasing a gun – was unable to defend himself and was killed by another man who did have a gun.

"The NRA believes in defending the Second Amendment rights of all Americans. This is why we have decided to offer membership discounts, through Aug. 31, to African-Americans, ages 18-25, who can join us in defending their right to keep and bear arms for protection.

"If you are tired of reading about young, unarmed African-Americans being killed, then join us today and fight for your right to defend yourself."

Protestors took to the streets in several cities following the acquittal of George Zimmerman, 29, who fatally shot Martin, 17, in Sanford, Fla., last year. Zimmerman's attorneys argued that the former neighborhood watch volunteer fatally shot the unarmed Martin in self-defense after Martin allegedly attacked him. Zimmerman was following Martin around his Sanford neighborhood because he thought Martin looked "suspicious."

The NRA said the Zimmerman/Martin case was also a reminder of how "unarmed black men are too often the victims of violence in the United States" and encouraged people who were upset about the verdict to become active in promoting their right to defend themselves.

The NRA added it will be sponsoring workshops in African-American neighborhoods aimed at educating residents about the controversial "Stand Your Ground" laws, which enable a person to use force in self-defense if they believe they are under threat.

The NRA also stated it will focus its efforts in a similar Florida case involving Jordan Davis, an unarmed black 17-year-old who was fatally shot in an SUV allegedly by 46-year-old Michael Dunn, a white man, because Davis and his friends allegedly refused to turn down their music.

"We are beginning efforts to lobby federal and state governments to reduce the legal minimum age for law-abiding Americans to purchase and own guns to 15 years old. This would allow all law-abiding teenagers to enjoy the same gun rights and legal protections as adults in defending themselves from attackers."

"We all must look at all of these tragic cases and say, 'Never again!' "


http://dailycurrant.com/2013/07/19/nra-offers-membership-discounts-to-young-black-adults/

 

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