The State of Florida vs George Zimmerman: The Trial

Martin was not in the midst of committing a crime, he was merely walking, "looking about. So there was nothing for Zimmerman to suspect Martin was up to anything, other than the fact that he was walking slowly in the rain with a hoodie on talking on the phone and looking about.

Are all our gun nuts here and posting? I am worried that we may have lost one of our posters in Hialeah Fl. lately. How about posting so I know your all alright. The gun nuts that is.

...in the big lie there is always a certain force of credibility; because the broad masses of a nation are always more easily corrupted in the deeper strata of their emotional nature than consciously or voluntarily; and thus in the primitive simplicity of their minds [describes CI, firefpy, Apisa pretty well, no...] they more readily fall victims to the big lie than the small lie, since they themselves often tell small lies in little matters but would be ashamed to resort to large-scale falsehoods. It would never come into their heads to fabricate colossal untruths, and they would not believe that others could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously. Even though the facts which prove this to be so may be brought clearly to their minds, they will still doubt and waver and will continue to think that there may be some other explanation. For the grossly impudent lie always leaves traces behind it, even after it has been nailed down, a fact which is known to all expert liars in this world and to all who conspire together in the art of lying.

—Adolf Hitler , Mein Kampf, vol. I, ch. X[1]

I'd like to know how you of all people can feel as though you are smarter than simple old me...

That's an interesting story Gunga but full of made up BS.

He was found with jewelry but there is no evidence of it being stolen. It fit the description of a burglary but there is no evidence the victim of that burglary ever identified and claimed the items you are suggesting were stolen by Trayvon.

He was found with a screwdriver. I keep one of those in my car but I don't consider it a burglary tool.

oralloy wrote:

Rockhead wrote:

Zimmerman made his bed.
now he gets to lie in it...

No. What Zimmerman gets to do is shoot more people in self defense when they are dumb enough to attack him.
Sooner or later you clowns will learn to leave him alone.

Or get their gun out first and blow his ******* head off.

The night Trayvon Martin died, he didn't have any burglary tools or women's jewelry or anything else so he was not robbing or had robbed anyone.

Zimmerman did not know Trayvon Martin, didn't know Martin's past history so there was no reason for Zimmerman to suspect Martin regardless of his supposed past history since Zimmerman was unaware of Martin's past history at the time he made his assumptions of Martin being "up to no good."

Martin was not in the midst of committing a crime, he was merely walking, "looking about.

So there was nothing for Zimmerman to suspect Martin was up to anything, other than the fact that he was walking slowly in the rain with a hoodie on talking on the phone and looking about.

From what I can understand in a civil lawsuit what matter is why Zimmerman followed Martin, not whether he felt "in fear of his life or great bodily harm."

The way I see it, if any case makes it to court, it would be a lot easier to prove regardless of Martin's past because we talking about something a lot more concrete than what is reasonable fear.

what is it that makes me simple minded, gunga?
that I don't believe in creationism?
or your mars theories?
I'd like to know how you of all people can feel as though you are smarter than simple old me...

and please tell me some more about how to make purple drank.

it is unreasonable to suspect someone is up to no good merely for walking "slowly" in the rain and "looking about

Jul 21, 2013
Killing Trayvon Martin's soul
by Dante Atkins

An innocent teenage boy is dead. The man who killed him is free. And not only that: He might even get the gun he used returned to him.

The result of the case is a travesty of justice. It should be a crime, beyond any reasonable doubt, for a man to take a loaded gun, act in contravention of the advice of an emergency dispatcher, stalk an innocent teenager in the neighborhood, and kill him after a confrontation that, regardless of who swung first or who swung at all, was the result of the killer's aggressive and reckless behavior. It should be. And every protest, every utterance of abhorrent disbelief, every political press release decrying this miscarriage of justice, every howl of execration from all corners of our country and perhaps even the world, every tear shed for a life that should never have been lost—these are all more than justified.

The rationale for the outcome itself, however, is less simple, and there is adequate reason to agree with the verdict returned, even for those who find it distasteful. The legal system that governed this case had failed Trayvon Martin long before George Zimmerman picked up his gun and decided that he would not be one to get away. It's possible that without the existence of so called "stand your ground" laws in Florida—which apparently allow someone who feels threatened to use deadly force, no matter who initiated an altercation—Zimmerman would have borne some culpability for the spiteful and prejudicial horror he wrought. But should one believe that given the specifics of the laws governing the case and the instructions given the jury, that the correct verdict was handed down, it would seem common sense that there be no celebrating the final outcome of this tragedy.

If only.

For some of the most popular figures on the right, the fact that Trayvon Martin was killed by a stalker for simply walking down a sidewalk is an unacceptable narrative: instead, they feel the need to demonize his life. Here's Ted Nugent:

But George Zimmerman and his entire family, innocent of any wrongdoing, have lost everything and will be in debt for a long, long time for having to fight the trumped-up charges that he "profiled" and/or set out to murder the poor, helpless, dope-smoking, dope-peddling, gangsta wannabe, Skittles hoodie boy.

Rush Limbaugh felt the need to compare Trayvon Martin and Boston Bomber suspect Dzokhar Tzarnaev. The ever-so-moral Pat Robertson declared that Trayvon was basically at fault because he jumped on someone whom he "thought was a quasi-policeman," as if to imply that the victim had a lack of respect for law enforcement and presumably deserved to die for the offense. But as bad as they are, they are far from alone. Right-wing media figures have conducted a relentless smear campaign against the victim, suggesting with no evidence that he was a "wannabe gangster" and a drug dealer with a history of violence. Zimmerman's guilt or innocence had absolutely nothing to do with Trayvon Martin's past, but rather on the singular events that took place that fateful evening. And yet, the right wing continues to feel this twisted compulsion to insult his death by tarnishing his life. Why?

Because as horrific as it is, the fantasy about killing aggressive urban minorities in self-defense is a prevalent, deeply held narrative among certain sections of the American right. It's not a hidden fantasy, a secret and dark desire that dare not speak its name. No, this strain states its intentions and its desires loudly and proudly. Take, for instance, shock jock Neal Boortz, who had this to say about crime in Atlanta:

This town is starting to look like a garbage heap. And we got too damn many urban thugs, yo, ruining the quality of life for everybody. And I'll tell you what it's gonna take. You people, you are - you need to have a gun. You need to have training. You need to know how to use that gun. You need to get a permit to carry that gun. And you do in fact need to carry that gun and we need to see some dead thugs littering the landscape in Atlanta. We need to see the next guy that tries to carjack you shot dead right where he stands. We need more dead thugs in this city. And let their -- let their mommas -- let their mommas say, "He was a good boy. He just fell in with the good crowd." And then lock her ass up.

This isn't an isolated phenomenon. On far-right message board Free Republic, there have been threads where posters openly fantasize about killing black people who "invade" their communities subsequent to rioting or social unrest. In the minds of this strain of the American right, best represented by Rush Limbaugh and Ted Nugent, Trayvon Martin must have been violent, must have been a gangster, must have been a drug dealer or drug addict. Because were this not the case—were he simply, as he was, a teenager carrying a can of iced tea and a pack of Skittles minding his own business and on his way home—it would suggest that perhaps the vigilante fantasy that so pervades the conservative camp might be mistaken; that perhaps standing one's ground for so-called Second Amendment remedies could result in the death of an innocent teenager, rather than justified self-defense against one of Boortz' so-called "urban thugs."

Trayvon Martin is dead. But some among the right feel the need to kill his soul as well, all so a disturbing vigilante fantasy can live on without hindrance.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/07/21/1224296/-Killing-Trayvon-Martin-s-soul#