7
   

Our deeply embedded hatred of who we are right now

 
 
chai2
 
Reply Sat 18 May, 2013 02:22 pm
A conversation I just had with a total stranger at Target, and tsar's video below, prompted me to start this thread....If you haven't watched this already, take a look. It'll help with what I'm saying.

http://emilyvgordon.tumblr.com/post/50668854293/the-most-genius-thing-ive-ever-seen-on-tv

When I watched tsar's video I thought it was funny, the things women would say responding to a simple compliment. However, I really didn't get why all the women had to kill themselves at the end, when the last woman simply said "Thank you" when she got her compliment.

I think now I get it, and it ain't funny.

I just stopped by Target to buy sheets, and was standing in line and glanced back and smiled at the woman behind me. She was bending over getting some Reeses Peanut Butter cups, and some other candy. She was actually a tiny bit smaller than average size, and about my age, mid-50's. She looked fit, like she took care of herself.

When she caught my eye, she quickly stood up, and putting her hands out, like she was offering me her candy said "I hate myself that I'm buying this."
Instead of replying with the expected "Oh yeah, I know." or something like that, I said "Why? You want them don't you?"

It was like that completely shocked her. She actually stammered for a moment and said "er...umm....there're so BAD for you."

Me:
But you want them. Why should you deny yourself the pleasure of getting something you want?

She:
I....I used to weigh 199 pounds! (I found it interesting that she didn't just say 200 pounds, like that would somehow be beyond forgivable. Saved from perdition by 1 pound.)

Me:
I weigh 199 pounds.

(actually, I weigh 185, but you get the idea, I'm big, and I'm fine with it. More than fine, I like me right where I am)

She:
Oh! (shocked look....like she suddenly saw me standing in front of her...all 199 pounds of me).....I just meant.....well......you look fine....

Me:
You want the candy. Why not just get it and enjoy it? Are you going to worry about every bite of food you take and hate yourself for it?

She:
I....I work in the health care field, and someone I take care of just went in the hospital....

Me:
You're getting the candy because the person you take care of went in the hospital?

She:
No! (then..., not getting the connection, she said) Someone else I took care of died last year.

Me:
You're getting the candy because they died?

She:
No....

Me:
I work at a hospice, and people die all the time.
Why not just get the candy because you want it, and eat it and enjoy it? You're not going to be 199 pounds because you eat that.

She:
Well.....it's just so easy to gain....

At this point, I'm watching the woman behind her silently laughing. Mostly because she weighed 199 pounds too. So I thought "what the ****" and just threw the curtains open, and all the lights on.

"Are you afraid if you eat that you'll look like me, or the woman behind you? We're about the same size. How about it you skip the hating yourself for doing something you enjoy, and just do the enjoying part?"

She:
"Well....it's just that.....Oh....God bless you! Thank you for saying that...."

Me:
Well thanks. I hope you enjoy your candy. (at this point, I've just paid for my sheets and was getting ready to leave)

She:
It's just that this is so bad, I hate that I'm getting this....



Oh Jesus Christ.
I know a one time conversation with someone in the check out line may not permanently change anything. But, it was so sad when I thought how much we are trained to mistrust ourselves, hate ourselves for doing something enjoyable. Our fear of not conforming to some invented standard.

Why don't we just skip the hating ourselves part, and go straight to the enjoyment?



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Type: Discussion • Score: 7 • Views: 1,934 • Replies: 13
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chai2
 
  1  
Reply Sat 18 May, 2013 02:45 pm
Something else....

Why do we always respond to someone telling us they lost some weight with effusive praise, as if this is some great accomplishment?

I mean sure, it's something you accomplished, but is it worthy of saying now you're a better person than you were before?

You lost some weight, that's all.
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Sat 18 May, 2013 02:59 pm
I have to wonder if something that is apparently so incredibly hard for you body to do is either/or (a) worth it, (b) good for it.

I'm more talking about the kazillions of people who are not enjoying the person they are right now, and the life they have over 25, 10....or those really obsessed people that feel like their life is going to somehow be improved by losing 5 pounds to obtain some perfect number they read somewhere.

I'm of the personal opinion that if it's less than 30 pounds to reach that magazine article number and you're 5'5 or over, screw it. If you lose some of that, fine, if you don't...it ain't gonna kill ya, and doing it to get into that particular pair of pants is a pretty lame reason.

chai2
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 May, 2013 11:44 am
@chai2,
hmm....I notice 50 people have viewed this thread.

No opinions?
saab
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 May, 2013 11:54 am
@chai2,
As far as I understood it is the question about accepting a compliment and accepting yourself.
I find it impolite to give a negative answer fo a compliment - just say thank you and maybe something positive.
But somehow it is old old correct behavior to respond negatively. Which shows you are modest, not proud and some other qualities.
How can we learn to accept ourselves as humans and also our body in a society where one should not praise children?
Things have changed but now it is just as bad. Now kids have to be praised all the time.
This results is if they are not number one in everything they get depressed and feel they are not as good as others. They have failed in every walk of their little lives.
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 May, 2013 11:59 am
@chai2,
Oh, as long as I'm talking to myself.

A few years back I was at the mall, and stopped to get a bite to eat.

At the table in front of me there were 4 teenagers, 3 boys and a girl. The girl and one of the boys looked so much alike you knew they were brother and sister.

Anyway, they had ordered, and just had brought to their table a large pizza.
The boys dug in, and the girl just sat there.

That would have been fine, except that, you could tell the girl was Really hungry. The guys were talking, laughing, grabbing another slice, and she obviously couldn't even concentrate on what was going on. Her eyes kept locking onto the food....she kept swallowing because she was salivating. When someone picked up another slice, she followed it with her eyes to their mouths.
Finally, unable to stand it, she reached out....and didn't take a piece of pizza, but instead picked up this piece of crust or cheese the size of a thumbnail, and quickly put it in her mouth, like she didn't want anyone to see.

All that managed to do was really make it harder for her not to eat, but she was determined.

Thing was, she probably weighed 100 pounds soaking wet.

The guys finished, and they left to leave. No one had offered her any food, like it was expected, as a girl, she'd refuse. They left, the boys were laughing and joking. She left, hungrier than before.

We've all seen this.

If you were to ask her, she would have told you she was "fat", like she didn't deserve to have the simple pleasure of eating.
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 May, 2013 12:00 pm
@saab,
saab wrote:

As far as I understood it is the question about accepting a compliment and accepting yourself.
I find it impolite to give a negative answer fo a compliment - just say thank you and maybe something positive.
But somehow it is old old correct behavior to respond negatively. Which shows you are modest, not proud and some other qualities.
How can we learn to accept ourselves as humans and also our body in a society where one should not praise children?
Things have changed but now it is just as bad. Now kids have to be praised all the time.
This results is if they are not number one in everything they get depressed and feel they are not as good as others. They have failed in every walk of their little lives.



This isn't about the video. That was just a starting point.

What has happened that we hate who we are right now, that we can't just live and enjoy?
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 May, 2013 12:04 pm
@chai2,
I know so far I've based this on food, but it's not just that.

Look at for instance, people who post pictures of themselves asking "am I pretty?" and then, when advised they are, refuse to believe.

Sometimes I think all the mirrors need to be smashed,
Rockhead
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 May, 2013 12:15 pm
@chai2,
don't smash the mirrors, smash the television sets...
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 May, 2013 12:33 pm
@saab,
saab wrote:


Things have changed but now it is just as bad. Now kids have to be praised all the time.
This results is if they are not number one in everything they get depressed and feel they are not as good as others. They have failed in every walk of their little lives.



I agree with your first part, but not with the 2nd.

Yeah, I think it's crazy how some people feel they have to praise kids for literally everything, no matter how small (and no matter how young the kid is)

Re the 2nd point, I think it doesn't usually make them feel bad about themselves. I think it makes the "Good JOB Brittany!" become absolutely meaningless.

Maybe, hence the fact that when someone does go above the norm/average etc, and they are praised, it's not so much that they don't believe it, but it's just words.

Last summer, at the pool, I listened to a mother do this "Good JOB Brittany" to her (I don't know, 1.5 year old?) Over and over and over again. Literally every time the toddler moved in the water.

The toddler would turn her body...."Good JOB Brittany!", 2 seconds later she would reach out for the ball in the water (missing it by a foot)..."Good JOB Brittany!" Brittany then looked at her foot in the water "Good JOB Brittany". Brittany then looked at her hand "Good JOB Brittany!" Brittany again reached out for the ball "Good JOB Brittany!"

Jesus Christ, how is Brittany ever going to learn what a good job is, if she has heard she's doing one every time she bends over and picks up a sock?

At work, there's a secretary who I learned used to be a teacher, and I've realized that she's not been able to make the transition from praising kids for everything they do, so complimenting an adult for doing something challenging.

I do work at a place where it is really a team environment, and I can honestly say each person feels valued for their part of the work.

We're short staffed right now in the office, so I've been trying to jump in to take the load off someone when I see they are struggling, deadlines looming, etc. Hey, I appreciate a heartfelt "Hey thanks" as well as the next person, and I sure don't mind giving thanks.

However, I find myself really resisting the urge to just come out and say "All Right already!" to this person, because I feel like I'm getting what she considers the adult version of "Good JOB Chai!"
Yes, you gave thanks, but I'm going to keep coming around helping you until we hire someone new (hopefully soon, I'm swamped myself) but really, I feel good enough about myself that one good "thanks" was enough, now let's get to work.
The most annoying part is, whenever (meaning a few times a day) this person gushes appreciation and gratitude, it's making me feel like if I don't each time say "oh you're welcome, I'm glad to help, it's all about working together isn't it?" that now I'm not fulfilling her expectations of how someone should respond.

It's like there's the 2 extremes of "I hate myself for doing something I'm going to enjoy" and "Good JOB Brittany" and little "let's just get on with this" and finding fulfillment in getting on with it.
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 May, 2013 12:35 pm
@Rockhead,
Rockhead wrote:

don't smash the mirrors, smash the television sets...


Oh yeah, I am so right there with you man.
0 Replies
 
tsarstepan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 May, 2013 01:08 pm
http://static.tapastic.com/cartoons/e9/c3/46/83/b6d6dc5f9f524d8aaaff6514d568a18c.jpg
http://tapastic.com/episode/5341
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  2  
Reply Thu 30 May, 2013 07:29 pm
hmm.

I find that cartoon disturbingly off the mark.

It trivializes the reality of what is going on inside a lot of women.

0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 31 May, 2013 02:25 am
Marilyn Monroe was a size 12 for most of her working life, and i believe she got to size 14 before she died. I don't recall that people were calling her fat then. I can't say to a certainty, but i think this is a relatively new phenomenon. Maybe it dates back to Twiggy, and the rise of the emaciated fashion model. With a standard that most women cannot achieve, most women might end up considering themselves failures.
0 Replies
 
 

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